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Linda Stern
29th May 2006, 06:29 AM
Hi I am new to the site. We lost our dog a lab after 12 years a month ago...so our Cavalier was on her own unitl last thursday night. Now we got a new cavailer puppy she is great, the puppy, but our 5 yr. old cavilier, Calli is not happy to say the least. She is just misrable, and the puppy keeps trying and trying her best to get to know her. I am sure she is adusting too...as she came across the country to us and is used to being around several......cavaliers. Calli won't give her the time of day and is still growling and running away from her. She gives me the look as if she says what the heck have you done!!! are you crazy...then her eyes get wide and she is just breaking my heart tooooo. The puppy couldn't be any better she is soooo cute and easy....any advise.....will it just take more time or will they never get along. Thanks in advance for your help if you can. Tried all kinds of stuff...don't really want to go to the public park as the puppy is just tooo small. Help if you can?
best,
Linda I am a new member. :yikes

judy
29th May 2006, 07:25 AM
Hi Linda. Check out the thread titled CONGRATULATIONS LINDA--Linda just brought a new puppy home and her existing dog is not pleased. Hopefully they will adjust--i think they just have to get used to the idea of the new guy and accept it. It's a big change that they don't immediately understand, they weren't in on the decision to enlarge the pack so to speak. hopefully they will warm up, hopefully soon.

Mary
29th May 2006, 12:50 PM
Linda

Congrats on your new puppy. Hope to see pictures. It just takes time. I have seven dogs and they all get along just fine. Of course they have spats at time but never anything serious. They are separated at feeding time to prevent any problems. Just let the two get to know each other slowly. Don't force anything. Calli will let her know her boundaries and come to accept her on her own terms. In a couple of months they will likely be best "buds". So have patience...let them just get to know each other. Calli may growl and snap but only intervene if anyone is actually getting hurt. The pup will be submissive and back off. Calli is just letting her know that she is here first and it is her rules. Good luck.

Linda
29th May 2006, 01:08 PM
Hi Linda
A Big Welcome, sorry if I missed welcoming you but I have been a bit
excited myself.

I totally understand how you feel, I brought our new Ruby Boy home yesterday and Dudley our 2 1/2 year old Bleinham Boy wants nothing to do with him. He also runs away from him, Darby was following him and still is. I tried holding and cuddling them both nope, Dudley wants away and Darby is so active he wants down.

Take it from these guys they are all pro's, I am off to the Vet this morning
and will ask what she thinks. Bruce is a amazing breeder and he has
posted on the thread that my wonderful friend Nicki started that everything will be fine.
I know lots and lots of people who have more than one cavalier and it
is a adjustment for our already established Cavaliers, don't worry we will both help one another get through this together.

Bring on the pictures, we want pictures. :snap: :snap:

Jen
29th May 2006, 01:47 PM
Hi, and welcome to the board! Hopefully you'll find this site packed with all the info you need!

I think with a little time Cali will realize that the new pup isn't going anywhere and that just maybe it could be kinda fun to have a sibling again! Also, so sorry to hear about your lab. 12 yrs for a lab is a wonderful, long life, but of course loosing this dog is a huge adjustment for the whole family, especially Cali. She just needs some time to adjust to all the changes. Make sure to give her individual attention to make her feel secure that she is still the queen bee. Always greet, treat, feed, etc. her first, and then give attention to the pup. We've recently added another pup as well, and our trainer has stressed the importance of treating each individual dog with attention rather than them together. It makes for more work, as it's easy to just lump the two of them together, but I think in the long run it will make for a more well-adjusted dog.

Good luck, I'm sure time will be your best friend in this situation. :D

Nicki
30th May 2006, 08:27 AM
Welcome Linda <waves> good to see you here.

So sorry about your Lab...12 years is a wonderful age for a Lab but it doesn't make it any eaiser sadly :( I'm sure your new baby will help to fill the hole though

Calli will come round in time, as others have said, it's a big adjustment for them. There's some good advice here, I haven't anything to add really, but just to say please ask if there is anything else you want to know, and if possible, we'd love to see some photos :D and of course congratulations on your new baby too!!

Angela
30th May 2006, 09:44 AM
Im sure Calli will come around soon. Enjoy your new little puppy.

Karlin
30th May 2006, 09:47 AM
It almost always takes time for any established dog (or cat!) to accept a new member of the household. They are jealous, first of all, and if the dog is older, it creates anxiety as now the two dogs have to figure out the pecking order. With a puppy the pecking order is straightforward -- the puppy is just a puppy.

There's lots out on the web about introducing a new puppy or adult dog to a household of an existing dog(s). Basically the exisiting dog needs MORE attention than the newcomer, and all intereactions will need to be closely monitored in the coming weeks. An adult dog can accidentally or deliberately harm a puppy so while this is rare caution and control of the situation at all times is important (eg never leave the puppy and the adult dog alone together until you are very sure of their relationships -- which ususally means for a good few weeks and perhaps longer, til the pup gets to a more significant size).

Usually most dogs seem to start to accept a new arrival after about a week but it can take weeks, months, or in rare cases, they never really are too enthusiastic about each other. While the latter cases are unusual, it is good to at least keep in mind that new arrivals are not always easy transitions to accept for the existing dogs and they do create some anxiety at least for a short time in most households, til everyone adjusts. And to realise there's always a small chance that you may need to simply accept they have very different interests and personalities and will not be close companions. This is a more typical situation with cats when new cats or kittens are introduced -- it has taken 2 years for my existing cats to totally accept (eg be willing to curl up with) a kitten who is now a big adult tomcat! I;ve learned at accept that animals will make their own decisions in this regard and a lot of patience is always required as well as some wise management of the situation to reduce the stress levels to a minimum.

So with a new puppy -- this means giving your adult plenty of your time, giving him or her lots of time without the puppy (some adult dogs simply do not like being haranhgued by puppies, while some enjoy playing with them. Just as some adult humans like toddlers and some find few things more annoying :lol:). Keep to existing schedules for the adult dog so routine does not change dramatically, and give the adult lots of walks on its own where it gets time with you. Consider an x-pen so that the puppy can be safely enclosed and not hassle the exisiting adult dog, but is there in the same room with you. Let them have controlled interactions so that they do get to know each other. try to give them time together in a neutral place like a local park or maybe someone else's garden (once the pup's vaccinations enable it do go out) as this may be a more comfortable place for your dog to interact with the pup but not have to defend its territory against an interloper!

In summary -- this will take time. But you can help make the process smoother for all by following some of the steps above, and discarding your own expectations (though this can be hard). The dogs will find their own way forward in their own time and will decide what sort of relationship they wish to have.

Alison_Leighfield
30th May 2006, 10:09 AM
Hi Linda and welcome,

In time it will settle down, believe me.

Did you do any prep work before bringing pup home?

Sometimes it is a good idea to send a blanket to your breeders house with your dogs scent upon it and when returned it would give your dog a chance to small the pup before it arrives. some breeders are happy for you to take your older dog for a visit before you bring pup home as long as they are older and on their feet, often it is welcomed especially when with nice gentle children, all handling is an experience along with new sounds, smells etc.

If you have a pups toy with its scent on it try taking your older dog away on it's own and play with it with her, your older dog might associate the pups smell with nice/good/fun things and not a threat to its love/mum/time etc. try and play/do things with both dogs together, you might find that your older dog will enjoy the dog fun that they will have as they slowly bond. Take both dogs for a ride in the car as you teach pup what she needs to know about that, do the grooming together while you get her familiar with brushes, combs etc. there are lots of things in your normal routine that you can do involving more than one dog.

Sometimes an older sensitive dog can pick up on your moods, body language..are you tense, worried, nervous? just try and relax about it all.

Please don't over compensate and over fuss your older dog, the puupy is an addition to your family and nothing for her to be worried or nervous about, carry on with your normal routine and she will come around and in time they will be best buddies.

It is normal for them to smell and sniff each other and you will find that there might be an odd growl as the older dog puts pup in it's pecking order!

It's very interesting stuff watching dogs. Perhaps a few books on the topic might ease your concerns about it all. The first time like this is for you is always an
anxious time, NEXT time it will be easier! :D

Just ENJOY you new baby,

Alison, Wilts, UK.

Linda
30th May 2006, 12:20 PM
Linda

I am having the same problems as I mentioned with Dudley and Darby,
upon visiting my Vet yesterday she also suggested that I get a dry facecloth or small towel rub it all over the puppy and then onto the
older dog and then rub it all ove the older dog and onto the puppy keep doing this daily so they get used to each others scents.

I am on my second day, and although Dudley is not accepting Darby he
was a little better last night with him.

He was not running away while we all stayed in the backyard the previous
day Dudley wanted inside.

I have an xpen set up and my children will be at school today so I am on my own, I plan on putting Darby in the pen this afternoon for at least an hours worth of snuggling totally alone with Dudley.
Then I will let him out, may have to let some of the housework go for a bit but feel this is more important.

Keep us posted, I understand how you feel as I thought that Dudley would
of been so happy about me bringing a puppy home. :yikes :yikes :yikes :yikes

Suzanne
30th May 2006, 12:36 PM
My charming and friendly Lucy has had problems getting our cat Bella to accept her. Bella (appx. 2 1/2 yrs old) is usually soooo loving and affectionate, that I just assumed (mistakenly, it seems!) that she would be happy to have a companion...I also thought her maternal instincts would surface. Alas, Lucy has been here since March, and I still cannot permit them to be alone together. Bella can be really nice one minute, and for absolutely no apparent reason, she decides to swat or bite Lucy. On the rare occasions when I must leave Lucy at home, I place Bella in my bedroom with the door closed. They both sleep on my bed at night without any problem, but during the day I just can't trust Bella. I've made sure to give Bella a lot of attention, but nothing seems to work. I am still hopeful that in time they will become "sisters" and I hope to find them curled up together. I've always had dogs and cats together, but this is the first time I've ever encountered this problem.

Karlin
30th May 2006, 02:31 PM
A lot of cats simply do not like dogs. And vice versa! The routine you have is sensible. In two and a half years two of my cats have had no interest at all in being anywhere near the dogs though they won't swat them, and they will sleep on the same couch but not close to each other. My other two cats like the dogs but only one will actually curl up with them by choice. I think it is the norm for them not to be very close and you do need to be careful with a cat that swats, just as you are being. I know of two cavaliers who have been blinded or had an eye removed after an encounter with a cat so caution is best if the relationship is uncertain.

If you want to be on the safe side consider softpaws: www.softpaws.com

These are actually surprisingly easy to put on and fine for an indoor cat. I've used them for the ones that prefer the sofa to a scratching post.

Suzanne
30th May 2006, 02:42 PM
Thanks, Karlin. I'm always watching carefully and basically Lucy is by my side almost all of the time. In addition to being on the watch so Bella doesn't hurt her, I worry about what the stress may due to Lucy. Since cavs are prone to heart problems, could the stress the stress impact upon her health?

judy
30th May 2006, 05:05 PM
when i got the puppy, Zack, in january, my cat Fluffy was over 13 years old. There was no expectation that Fluffy would like Zack. The question was, how bad would it be? A few months before, my daughter's cavalier Belle was here to visit and she left Fluffy completely alone, so that worked out fine. Fluffy is not aggressive. She is kind of a shrinking violet, and will run away rather than fight.

But Zack wasn't like my daughter's cavallier about Fluffy. He is much more sociable with other animals than Bellle. He just wants to play. So, he would jump at Fluffy, the way puppies do with each other. Now, 4 months later, he still has the impulse to jump at Fluffy and try to get her to act like another puppy--and that is never going to happen. I have corrected him consistently the entire time, but while he is very compliant about most things and responsive to correction, he has seemed just overwhelmed by his urge to play with Fluffy.

But now there has been an improvement. A few days ago, instead of just verbally correcting him while blocking him from lunging at Fluffy, i escalated the correction by getting up, growling, snapping at him, and then when he laid down on his back, i bit his muzzle--softly, not to cause pain, but to make a dramatic point. I had never done that before but had read it in a book which recommends taking on the role of the mother dog. It worked. He has been much better, dramatically better, not lunging at all, though still appearing to want to, but so much calmer. the difference is undeniable.

Fluffy sees the difference and she has begun to actually show a lot more comfort with him, for example, i looked up a couple of days ago and they were laying on the floor about a foot apart. Previously the only time they'd stay near each other was if they were sitting with me on my reclining chair. The difference was that Zack wasn't lunging or overly excited, so Fluffy didn't retreat to her little hidling spot behind another chair. then, i saw them laying near each other on another spot and Fluffy was playing with one of Zack's toys. This has never happened before, and Zack was watching intently. If this had been another puppy, he would've wanted to play tug o war with the toy, but instead he just watched, containing his excitment. I have been praising him a lot when i see him acting this way.

Another thing in the last few days is that Fluffy has allowed Zack to lick her, including affectionately giving her a few licks on the ear yesterday. This is really radical. Before this, Fluffy was very uptight if Zack made any contact with her except when part of his body would be laying on her when the three of us were sitting together. And then, twice now when we were sitting that way in the past couple of days, Fluffy licked Zack!!!! wow! she licked his fur, on two separate occasions.

From the beginning, Fluffy would try to avoid Zack when he was harrassing her playfully, but if he went too far, she would swat at him, and if necessary, she would chase him and would hiss and make an angry cat noise and would bite at him. he would act completely intimidated, would run away and would then leave her along for the time being. She did not appear to be trying to hurt him, her claws didn't seem to be open, but fortunately this was always effective and he would always stop right away when she did this. If he were to keep going at her, i think she would attack more seriously and hurt him, but i've seen no sign that he would do anything but run away as soon as she swats him or tries to chase him. Fluffy is not very agile. She is a small cat, she was once 9 pounds as an adult, but in the past year, she has become obese and more recently she limps in a stiff arthritic way off and on and i am trying to learn what to do about it.

when i got Zack i placed a baby gate on the stairs and for a lot of the time, i kept them separated. When i wasn't home, Zack has been first crated, then penned, then loose in the kitchen, and now, he has the run of the downstairs of the apartment when im not home. I keep Fluffy upstairs. I've started leaving the baby gate open when i am home. This is such a gradual process but after i saw the mutual licking between the two and how they laid quietly near each other on the floor, i am wondering what the possibilities might be.

I still think that Fluffy could hurt Zack if he was lunging at her so i don't want to leave them both loose in the house when i'm not home, but i feel bad about Fluffy having to be confined for so many hours, i think she gets even less exercise when she stays upstairs, there's nowhere for her to go up there, jsut her little cat bed and her dishes and her catbox. Fortunately they sleep a lot.

Suzanne
30th May 2006, 05:42 PM
Judy - thanks for posting about Zack and Fluffy. Some of the behavior between them has been the same with Lucy and Bella. I know I must be patient and give them as much time as they need to work out their territory, etc., but I love them both soooo much that I'd like to see them be best buddies. I guess I can't do much about it, except to keep an eye on them and allow them to determine the parameters of their friendship! I'll definitely post again about this when and if things get better between them! Thanks again for the info! :c*t: cavtiny