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Jen114
19th June 2006, 08:20 AM
Pooor Kayla,,,,...... she is so depressed it makes my heart ache!!!!!!!!! As you know my mother gillian got a puppy last Thursday, it was absolutly fanatastic news and we all love ABBY to bits but Kayla has really felt it and is depressed she just sits there and stares at her like what have you done to me.....

THat is not all though my sister in law bought a Tri bitch tooo so now we have Kayla/Molly/ Abby in the family

Yesterday was fathers day and the whole family was at my mom\'s including all the puppies it was so exciting to see them all together... The two babies one 7.1 week and other 8 .2 weeks were fighting like crazy.... Abby is the naughty one running and biting the other dogs tails it is sooo funny then she sort of runnnnnnnsssssssss..... jumps in the air and lands on the other dogs .... As you can imagine Kayla does not find this amusing at all.... I must add Kayla is a unique dog i think... well i have never ever ever seen a dog as fearfull and as placide as kayla she is scared of everythign and anyone she never ever opens her mouth not even when she was a puppy she chewed anything. well thereofre when the puppies bite her or run after her she jumps on the couch where they can not reach her and sulks....

PLEASE HELP!!!! WHAT SHOULD WE DO?????? WE REALLY WANT THEM ALL TO GET ALONG...... KAYLA IS WITH MY MOM EVERYDAY SO I AM HOPING THAT ABBY STOPS BULLING KAYLA HE HE HE......

do you scold abby for biting kayla ? what do you do?

We would apprecieate any help xxxxxxxx

love
Jen & Kayla

Maxxs_Mummy
19th June 2006, 10:51 AM
LMAO Poor Kayla, fancy being beaten up by two naughty puppies :lol: .

I think I'd let them get on with it for now and don't show any concern whatsoever. If you do you are reinforcing Kayla's belief that there is something to be scared of!

Maybe try a DAP diffuser? I have got one and every time either of mine have been scared I just switch it on. It is supposed to have a two week build up effect but it has worked on mine from the word go.

I really think that given time, Kayla will get used to the pups. Could you try and introduce them one at a time? Maybe she would accept this a bit better :)

Whenever we used to get visitors with pups when Maxx was about the same age we'd have the same problem. As hard as it was, we just ignored him and eventually we'd find him and the pup snuggled up together.

He still gets upset sometimes when we have dogs visit, but more often than not he just tends to accept it. Charlie jumps on the sofa and dribbles but he's scared of everything anyway. We just leave him to it ! It was what my Vet told me to do and it does work :D

My two are off to Auntie Alison's for the weekend and I just hope that Charlie doesn't flood her house with dribble (whenever he's worried he drools LOL) - I'm considering sending a supply of disposable bibs with him :D

Jen114
19th June 2006, 12:15 PM
Sorry for my ignorance but what is a DAP thingy? what ever it is if it stops her being so scared of everything i would love to try it.... i doubt they have it in Malta though..... icon_whistling

Mary
19th June 2006, 01:33 PM
It just takes time. Two are probably a little overwhelming. Make sure Kayla gets lots of special hugs etc.

joanna
19th June 2006, 01:36 PM
Daisy Boo was terrified of Twinkle when we brought her home too. It just takes a bit of adjusting - they'll all be cuddled up in the same bed in no time.

I'd love to see more pictures of Kayla - your avator is gorgeous.

Jen114
19th June 2006, 02:07 PM
Thanks alot... it is so difficult getting a good pic of her because she is black


let me try post some

:sl*p:

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j161/Jen114_2006/103_0313.jpghttp://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j161/Jen114_2006/1bbd20d3.jpghttp://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j161/Jen114_2006/103_0362.jpg

misty
19th June 2006, 02:11 PM
awwwww - she's beautiful!

I love the hair sticking up on top of her head - my Declan's hair used to do that and cause us so much amusement :)

Claire
19th June 2006, 02:21 PM
She's a beauty - You have really got to give Kayla time, please remember to treat her first, so when you come in greet her first, give her a treat first, this way the puppies should hopefully note that she is the alpha dog....

Cathy T
19th June 2006, 04:32 PM
Kayla is so cute. When we got Shelby I made sure Jake came first in everything. He also got extra cuddle time and cuddle time together. That way he could see that even though I was loving on Shelby...it didn't mean he didn't get any attention.

Linda
19th June 2006, 06:06 PM
Jen:

I think this is all normal, as you know already I am going through the
same with Dudley at the moment. He has his nose out of joint and is
acting and looking pretty upset.

Darby annoys him all the time, he has given him a few growls to back off but not intially. It took Dudley a while to do so.

Like my paedetrician always tells me with my human children, let them
sort it out by themselves. Only interfere if Abby is really hurting Kayla.

Darby also eats Dudleys food and pushes Dudley out the road, Dudley
is allowing him to do so right now but I don't know that he will continue to do so. I was thinking that Darby is becoming the Alpha, but feel it is
too early to tell yet.


This does not stop Darby from being the energetic and pesky little puppy that we love, that is what puppies do. Just make sure Kayla is getting attention.

I have had Darby for over 3 weeks now and they are still not what I
would call friends. I am sure it will happen so just try and not worry yourself. If you look at my pictures you will see although I did manage
to get some, look at Dudley's face he is not happy.
Is your sisters pup being looked after by your mom also, or was that
just because it was Fathers Day they were all together. ?????

I know it is hard not to let it bother you, believe me it bothered me too but
I chose to ignore it and let them sort it out themselves.
I have had lots of advise from 2 dog owners and that is what I was advised and this is what I am doing.
She needs time, and you will see a smal change daily not much but it will
happen.
I am still not seeing what I expected but I know in my heart it may take
a few months.

Jen
19th June 2006, 06:19 PM
Sorry for my ignorance but what is a DAP thingy? what ever it is if it stops her being so scared of everything i would love to try it.... i doubt they have it in Malta though..... icon_whistling

It stands for Dog Appeasing Pheromone. They also make them for cats--Feliway.
My Schnauzer pup is using the DAP collar (they make a collar or a diffuser) and it's really helped calm him down--he bites and growls when he's too excited--not the normal puppy biting, this is biting that breaks the skin. The collar lasts 4 weeks, and so far it's worked wonders for us! It works for many different issue...more info here:
http://www.healthypets.com/dapcollar.html

If you can't find it, you can order it online at various sites, just do a Google search.

Jen114
19th June 2006, 06:21 PM
Hi Linda... i know what you mean you can see it in their eyes... thank you so much for your help. It makes me feel better knowing that kayla is nto going through somthing that is abnormal...... and it is nice to have people here to talk to about it too thanks

judy
19th June 2006, 07:23 PM
kayla is so cute and beautiful. how old is she now?
treat her like the queen of the home, treat her like she is powerful even though she thinks she isn't. if she already tends to be shy and hesitant and unassertive, there's nothing surprising about her reaction, though it's a bit disappointing that she can't enjoy "the fun." Abby has such a different personality. they're just like us, so diverse and unique from one to the next.

something i enjoy so much about going to the dog park is watching them all as they socialize with each other, and how different each individual is, and how they try to work out their differences--it's not always a pretty sight (or sound), but definitely fascinating.

i don't think there's any doubt that darby will be the alpha dog--i could see it in the first pictures that were posted of him nursing at him mama's breast, he had a dominant position in the litter and appeared the most robust. anyway, it won't surprise me if it turns out that way. good luck dudley ;)

Linda
20th June 2006, 01:30 PM
Jen

I just wanted to mention to you something that may also help them to
become friends.

Yesterday in the evening we were in the backyard and Dudley was chasing
Darby all over the place, of course the little Red Headed Energy Ball Darby would play dead as Dudley is faster than him.


It is coming, but also afterwards I gave Dudley a bath I usually blow
dry him and decided not to I am not sure how Kayla reacts when she
has a bath but Dudley usually runs all over the house and plays to help
dry himself off. We'll of course Darby joined in as he thought that Dudley
was playing with him. They did this for a good 10 to 15 minutes, so
just to let you know although I am going through a slow bonding process
as well it is coming.
Try giving her and only her a bath and let her run to dry herself.
Just a suggestion that worked for me.

judy
20th June 2006, 03:47 PM
....Dudley usually runs all over the house and plays to help
dry himself off. We'll of course Darby joined in as he thought that Dudley
was playing with him. They did this for a good 10 to 15 minutes...Try giving her and only her a bath and let her run to dry herself.
Just a suggestion that worked for me.

brilliant idea. they seem to be in an altered state of consciousness after a bath, and generally a very pleasant one.

Karlin
20th June 2006, 04:42 PM
Linda, don;t worry too much about dominance. Dogs don't even begin to think about where they fit in the scheme of roles in the house til after puberty -- so Darby will be at least 6 months old before he even considers trying to assert himself into the top dog position, if he wants to do this. He is only being a puppy right now -- puppies just try out all these different behaviours and are very pushy, exactly like human toddlers who do not yet understand adult behaviour or restraint. That's why they are so annoying to most adult dogs after a while :) :lol: And toddlers are to all but parents and gradparents. :lol:

The likelihood is that their relationship will be so subtle that you will never actually be able to tell which dog is the alpha dog. This is a terribly misunderstood concept, and some very bad training decsisions are made on the basis of that misunderstanding. It also means nothing except to the dogs. They usually sort out who is who very quietly amongst themselves and problems only occur with dogs that try to challenge those roles or a loss of the order through a death for example. I wish people would not even use the wwords 'dominance' and 'alpha' as they are so loaded with human concepts that are not relevant to dogs! "leader' might be a better word.

I would wager that at least half of people make the **wrong guess** as to which of their dogs is the alpha (and this too causes all sorts of behaviour and training problems for many people!). That's because the alpha is very often the one that does NOTHING -- the one that doesn't challenge, bicker, boss the others around, and so on, so exactly NOT the one most people think is the boss. If you think of the alpha as the benign dictator you'll have a better concept. So actually, Dudley's general patience with all these shenanigans is proof that both dogs know just where they fit in right now and Darby is simply being a puppy.

In general a good behaviouralist or trainer, after watching a group of dogs interact for some time, will make a good guess as to the alpha but even then it is not always apparent except over long observation.

Put it this way: for humans, 99% of the time, knowing which dog is the alpha dog in the house has about as much significance to the people as knowing which human in the house earns the most money has for the dogs. The important element is only that your benign dictatorship is where all the dogs direct their respect.

The other 1% of the time is when problems arise either due to people misreading the situation and applying mistaken solutions, or when real problems arise due to shifts or challenges among the hierarchy. Generally such problems only begin to arise as you get three or more dogs, and a pack of dogs begins to form. Then their relationships grow much more complex.

Personal note: though Leo is certainly the top dog in my house I don't think a single friend has ever believed on first sight that it wasn't Jaspar. Only trained behaviouralists like Tara and Lisa and very experienced dog people have correctly spotted the very subtle indications that Leo is the benign dictator -- simply because he is SO benign. He is so calm and collected and quite and sweet that he has been used several times by professional trainers as the gentle quiet dog for assessing and helping anxious/slightly aggressive dogs (in safe situations of course). This included with a HUGE Great Dane! Of course by human notions of 'alpha' and 'dominance', this type of leadership and confidence doesn't make sense. And that is just my point. :) We think alpha=Rambo. Dogs don't.