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Why are Cavaliers such an expensive breed?

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Sharon

Sharon

Well-known member
This is the first time we have had a Cavalier and I would love to get a play mate for our little Wrigley, but they are so expensive compared to other breeds. Apart from being absolutely adorable, what makes them such an expensive breed? Is it because they originate from the UK? Even other English Spaniels, such as the Cocker, are not as expensive.

If anyone knows of a good breeder in/close to Texas that doesn't charge the earth, please let me know. I would dearly love to get another to keep our pup company, but can't stretch to $1000 upwards at the moment.

Thanks.
Sharon
 
good question. $1000 was low end when i was shopping early this year. $2000 and up was the going rate from reputable breeders generally. Not that there couldn't be exceptions to that, but that was what i was finding and what i was told by a local breeder who was giving me some advice and information.

Good luck getting a second one. I think it 's a wonderful idea, for companionship for the other dog especially, not to mention double pleasure for the humans. :flwr:
 
I probably should not even try and answer this as I am not a breeder and the truth is I do not know but.....

I would imagine the responsible breeders have to try and recoup some of the costs for the health screening that is required to breed a ckcs ?

Worth every cent though, and anyway who needs food and electricity and all that if you've got the love of a cav !! Just kidding :p
 
In Malta believe it or not they are one of the cheaper breeds to buy. I do not understand why they are so cheap compared to the rest of the world. We have only one breeder in Malta she charges

Lm 175.00 Malta liri

equivalent to
287 sterling
522 dollars
 
OK then, I'm not a breeder but I have had enough contact with breeders to understand why Cavaliers are so expensive.

A Pregnant Cavalier's trips to the Vets are usually numerous - not covered by healthcare and usually expensive.

Health screening before each litter is not at all cheap, especially if you get all screening done.

Litters are usually small, sometimes only one or two pups.

Extra food for Mum and food and care for the pups.

It all costs money you know and tbh I would much rather pay the money for a good, strong, healthy puppy than buy one from a BYB for next to nothing and have all sorts of health problems that cost me a fortune and caused pain and suffering to the furbaby.

All in all, when you think that $1000 (£530) over a period of 10-14 years (average life expectancy of a healthy Cavalier) it's not an awful lot.

Also, I live in England and can assure you that I would expect to pay more than £530 for a good healthy puppy. Maxx is 7 now and I paid almost that when we got him as a puppy!
 
Oh boy, this is a big topic!

First: please consider an older dog from a breeder, or a rescue cavalier -- either of these options can allow someone who truly wants a cavalier, and is truly operating on a budget but committed to the dogs' welfare, to acquire a worthy cavalier at a lower cost than a puppy from a good breeder. But see the caveats that follow below regarding price.

Cavaliers cost far less in the UK and Ireland as well; there have been many discussions (and arguments) on lists and boards as to why this is so. Even breeders will disagree strongly on this one!

It is partly to do with costs amd geographies and of course, supply and demand... cavaliers are one of the most common breeds in the UK and Ireland and readily available. They are still much harder to find in the US and hence the market supports higher prices. They also have small litters, sometimes only one or two puppies, which can make them more costly.

BUT -- and this is the crux of a broader issue connected to the issue of cost -- if a breeder is NOT

  • * cardiac testing every year
    * testing hips, eyes, patellas
    * perhaps also doing any sort of exam or an MRI for syringomyelia
    * not using studs that are equally health-tested and therefore known to be of good quality (and therefore having little by way of stud fee)

And if the breeder does NOT

  • * have breeding stock of real quality (and initial cost) that enable them to be registered with REAL national registries, not the fake ones that are meaningless; and likewise register all their puppies with same (In US, that means ONLY AKC or CKCSC)
    * dedicate any personal time to understanding genetics, pedigrees and breed history
    * understand or worse, care about all the implications of not breeding for health
    * participate in clubs activites most importantly, showing to make sure s/he understands conformation, health and other breed quality issues
    * give any time to raising the litter nefore homing, in a health and temperament-focused way
    * have a commitment as ANY good breeder should to take back, without questions, any dog bred by them for any reason at any point in its life

Then you can see how easy it is to sell puppies for almost no cost at all.

Health testing over time induces costs, as does proper whelping care and vet care for the pups and mother. And commitment to the breed as a whole, over time, so that you are producing the best quality dogs (NOT show dogs but QUALITY dogs -- people mistake getting a puppy from a quality show breeder as meaning they want a show quality dog. Few puppies bred by a good breeder EVER are show or more especially, breeding quality -- but all will be from quality breeding programmes where health and temperament is as important as conformation (looks). And that is why going to a reputable breeder is so important).

If you don't put any time into your own dogs and your litters, then you have few direct or indirect costs to recoup, and have little interest in recovering the add-on value (to use a blunt marketing term) that your time, diligence and commitment is worth.

Your interest will be in breeding as cheaply as possible, and making money as easily as possible. A few hundred whatevers here or there don't matter much when another litter is on its way.

Consider overall costs during the lifetime of a dog. I have seen again and again, and hear regularly from, people who buy puppies from breeders who sell a little more cheaply, often dogs 'bred by the sister of this person in Ireland/England' or a person who doesn;t show but has so-called 'quality imports' or who argues their slightly cheaper dogs are registered with the fake registries 'because the AKC/CKCSC is really just a stuffy club'. They end up with puppies that can literally cost thousands in vet costs due to their sickliness as puppies, or they die at age 6 from congestive heart failure because the breeder didn;t bother with heart health, or they couldn;t get money refunded from supposed 'breeder' when their puppy tragically died, or their 'breeder' won't respond to any calls or emails when they start to have problems, usually health problems, with the puppy.

At that time the same refrain comes up -- "I wish I'd gone to a reputable breeder and paid a little more."

Consider too that the difference of a few hundred dollars/pounds/euro counts for a tiny amount of what your dog is likely to cost in food, vet, boarding and health vosts per year for the next decade-plus. The OVERALL cost of keeping a dog, especially a purebred that does have some known serious and costly health issues as real possibilities during its lifetime, needs to be kept in mind when opting for a purebred. If the upfron t cost seems daunting, what will people do when facing a vet bill for $1200? A $2000 MRI scan? A patella surgery for $800? Kennelling costs of $500-1000 for two weeks?

Looking for a good breeder and getting value for your money takes time and effort and research -- as there are too many willing to relieve you of your money for dogs from trash breeding programmes that damage the breed and its health in the medium to long term, whatever the case with an individual puppy.

How to find a good breeder:

http://www.cavaliertalk.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=30

http://www.cavaliertalk.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2757

Sadly many people put more time (and value paying for quality more) when buying a TV or dishwasher than they do with buying a living creature that will live in a house with a family for a decade or more, with luck. :(
 
To quote the mastercard advert:

A meal out, £50
A new washer, £200
A new cavalier, priceless.........

Whats £500, when you can have 10 years of unconditional love and affection?

(Maybe I could swop my other half for the new puppy - no, I'd have to pay more for them to take him!!) icon_whistling
 
People seem to always cringe at the cost of a well bred cavalier but you know when you look at other breeds that are from breeders who do testing etc to ensure quality dogs....their prices are just as high. Pugs, labs...any dog can and will cost you the same as a cavalier and the cost is all in part due to the cost of raising the mom/pop and litter.
 
The initial cost of a dog is nothing when you consider the cost of keeping them for a decade. Cheaper than a child, I agree, but still a big responsibility.

Joanna
 
Sharon said:
This is the first time we have had a Cavalier and I would love to get a play mate for our little Wrigley, but they are so expensive compared to other breeds. Apart from being absolutely adorable, what makes them such an expensive breed? Is it because they originate from the UK? Even other English Spaniels, such as the Cocker, are not as expensive.

If anyone knows of a good breeder in/close to Texas that doesn't charge the earth, please let me know. I would dearly love to get another to keep our pup company, but can't stretch to $1000 upwards at the moment.

Thanks.
Sharon
Click to expand...


The mixed breeds at our local Petland go for 700 plus dollars. There are (some terriers- french bulldogs to name a couple) breeds that are MORE expensive than cavaliers. Texas gets a lot of rescues-- If you just want a loving buddy for your cavalier, you might fill out an application for rescue and see if one that fits you comes through.
 
Karlin said:
...And if the breeder does NOT

  • * have breeding stock of real quality (and initial cost) that enable them to be registered with REAL national registries, not the fake ones that are meaningless; and likewise register all their puppies with same (In US, that means ONLY AKC or CKCSC)

    ...a person who doesn;t show but has so-called 'quality imports' or who argues their slightly cheaper dogs are registered with the fake registries 'because the AKC/CKCSC is really just a stuffy club'.
Click to expand...


  • Just to add that puppy buyers wanting to buy a dog from quality stock cannot just go by AKC registry. This was something i was educated about by the person who taught me the details and cruicial importance of health testing for this breed. AKC registry does not in any way mean a dog's parents and grandparents have been health tested. I'm not exactly sure what AKC does certify or guarantee. What is it? In what way is it superior to the fake registries? It would be naive for a puppy buyer to think that because a puppy is AKC registered, they can count on reputable breeding as it's defined here.

    What about CKCSC registry? Are they any more stringent than AKC about breeding protocols?


    ...Sadly many people put more time (and value paying for quality more) when buying a TV or dishwasher than they do with buying a living creature that will live in a house with a family for a decade or more, with luck. :(
    Click to expand...

    I can also tell you that a person can put months of careful research into learning about how to buy the best quality puppy but if the supply from such breeders is not enough to meet demand and the puppies from such breeders are too rare, demand will tend to be met in other ways. There are also stringent restrictions on obtaining a rescue cavalier, so unless there can be any change in these circumstances, the attention to health testing throughout the breed is going to be a distant ideal at best.

    I've heard some propose that breed clubs might use their funds to make health testing more affordable for more breeders, in the interest of improving and protecting the health of the breed. I haven't heard any discussion of pros and cons of that idea.
 
judy said:
Karlin said:
...And if the breeder does NOT

  • * have breeding stock of real quality (and initial cost) that enable them to be registered with REAL national registries, not the fake ones that are meaningless; and likewise register all their puppies with same (In US, that means ONLY AKC or CKCSC)

    ...a person who doesn;t show but has so-called 'quality imports' or who argues their slightly cheaper dogs are registered with the fake registries 'because the AKC/CKCSC is really just a stuffy club'.
Click to expand...


  • Just to add that puppy buyers wanting to buy a dog from quality stock cannot just go by AKC registry. This was something i was educated about by the person who taught me the details and cruicial importance of health testing for this breed. AKC registry does not in any way mean a dog's parents and grandparents have been health tested. I'm not exactly sure what AKC does certify or guarantee. What is it? In what way is it superior to the fake registries? It would be naive for a puppy buyer to think that because a puppy is AKC registered, they can count on reputable breeding as it's defined here.

    What about CKCSC registry? Are they any more stringent than AKC about breeding protocols?


    ...Sadly many people put more time (and value paying for quality more) when buying a TV or dishwasher than they do with buying a living creature that will live in a house with a family for a decade or more, with luck. :(
    Click to expand...

    I can also tell you that a person can put months of careful research into learning about how to buy the best quality puppy but if the supply from such breeders is not enough to meet demand and the puppies from such breeders are too rare, demand will tend to be met in other ways. There are also stringent restrictions on obtaining a rescue cavalier, so unless there can be any change in these circumstances, the attention to health testing throughout the breed is going to be a distant ideal at best.

    I've heard some propose that breed clubs might use their funds to make health testing more affordable for more breeders, in the interest of improving and protecting the health of the breed. I haven't heard any discussion of pros and cons of that idea.
Click to expand...



  • An AKC registered dog means the parents are AKC registered. That is all. You can lose your ability to use the AKC registry things like poor breeding practices, DNA incorrect, not allowing the investigators in to check you out. The AKC allows breeders to register pups with restrictions-- nonbreeding restrictions-- Fake registeries don't care if you weren't suppose to breed your dog. Many just require a picture and if your dog LOOKS like a breed-- they give people papers. It allows people to look ligit (see my dog has papers). NOT being AKC registerable seems like a huge red flag in my opinion.


    The CKCSC, USA has a code of ethics: things like minimum and maximum breeding ages, max number of litters, required registrations. They also have recommendations for testing, I believe.

    I am part of 4 different cavalier rescues--- what stringent restrictions are you referring to??

    If you go to breeder referral sections of cavalier breed clubs, you could come up with MANY pups looking for a home right now -- sometimes distance is an issue. But I've also seen people with big hearts who want a rescue bad enough that they drive all weekend to take a chance on a cavalier that can have many issues and carry a lot of baggage.

    The CKCSC,USA already has health clinics about once a month (mostly heart and eye clinics)-- many of the small akc cavalier clubs also make an effort to sponser health clinics. There have been a couple of MRI clinics and there are people working to get more-- these are very expensive and time consuming.
 
Sandy

As I am new to owning a Cavalier and also to this site, are there any links to some good rescue clubs in the US (particularly Texas and surrounding).

I can appreciate all of the replies about why Cavs are expensive initially, but, we still have our limits that we can stretch to. Having seen the pictures of Cavs together, and read all the posts about owning two or more Cavs, I would love for our little pup to have a companion to grow up with, as well as our family. He is a happy little chap, but I also think he would benefit from having another 4 legged friend to run around with and snuggle up to. Perhaps a rescue dog could be our answer.

Sharon
 
Sharon said:
Sandy

As I am new to owning a Cavalier and also to this site, are there any links to some good rescue clubs in the US (particularly Texas and surrounding).

I can appreciate all of the replies about why Cavs are expensive initially, but, we still have our limits that we can stretch to. Having seen the pictures of Cavs together, and read all the posts about owning two or more Cavs, I would love for our little pup to have a companion to grow up with, as well as our family. He is a happy little chap, but I also think he would benefit from having another 4 legged friend to run around with and snuggle up to. Perhaps a rescue dog could be our answer.

Sharon
Click to expand...

Rescue cavaliers usually need more time and patience (but not always) than a normal dog. Some have spent years in pens with little to no human interaction. Many are older and some have never been in a home - so a toilet flushing, a door bell or a simple tv can cause them distress at first. Some have never been housetrained.
Lucky Star Cavalier Rescue is just that-- they rescue dogs from dispicable conditions - the dogs are vetted (spay/neuter, checked over cured of infecting and infestation), fostered and homed. www.luckystarcavalierrescue.org
CKCSCR- gets some rescues in, but they do a lot of rehoming. Some of these dogs have been neglected, some are not in the best of health.
www.ckcsc.org -- under rescue--- online application

I am still wondering about the stringent restrictions you mentioned. Most rescues (any and all breed) want you to have a fenced in yard -- if not, you would have to convinced them that you have a good way to allow the dogs to eliminate often. Most don't want the dog left alone all day, everyday. Some of these dogs have experienced neglect if not outright abuse. Cavaliers need people (or at least another dog) to help them live a good life.
 
Sandy

I am lucky in that I am at home nearly all the time with my children. We have a large home with a good size back yard which is completely fenced. The kids have just started at a preschool a few mornings a week, which gives me time to spend at home quietly with our pup.

I know we can offer a safe and loving environment for the right dog. The only worries I would have is concerning the dogs behaviour around the children. If our pup gets a bit nippy (as all pups do), the kids have learned to jump on the sofa and get out of his reach. I am teaching him that biting us is not good, and I think he is slowly getting the message. However, we would have to consider a rescue dog very carefully based on its nature, the same, I am sure, as we would carefully be considered as a family based on our lifestyle and what we could offer such a dog.

I think I will look into the possibility of a rescue dog a little more. Obviously, there is no guarantee that we would be the right fit for many of the rescue dogs, but we might just get lucky.

Thank you for the info.

Sharon
 
I've fostered more than a dozen cavaliers,,, they are fostered for a minimum of two weeks-- the last three were allowed to be with my 5 MONTH old grandson. Supervised of course, I would fear for the dogs, not the baby.
 
I would pay 2 times as much if I get a health puppy and a happy dog having lost 2 cavaliers to M V D in the last 10 years Aileen
 
WoodHaven said:
An AKC registered dog means the parents are AKC registered. That is all. You can lose your ability to use the AKC registry things like poor breeding practices, DNA incorrect, not allowing the investigators in to check you out. The AKC allows breeders to register pups with restrictions-- nonbreeding restrictions-- Fake registeries don't care if you weren't suppose to breed your dog. Many just require a picture and if your dog LOOKS like a breed-- they give people papers. It allows people to look ligit (see my dog has papers). NOT being AKC registerable seems like a huge red flag in my opinion.
Click to expand...

Thanks for clarifying that. When i was searching for a puppy, a local breeder with the highest standards and ethics warned not to just go by AKC registry when evaluating a puppy. She said just because a puppy is AKC registered doesn't mean he is from a breeder who does regular heart testing etc. Aren't some pet store puppies AKC registered? Please understand i'm not knocking the AKC, i knew that AKC registration did mean something important, i just didn't know what, and i appreciate hearing more specifically what kind of quality control they use. But also, i was told that a buyer of a cavalier could not just go by AKC registry alone in knowing whether the breeding was of the highest quality.

Zack is AKC registered but i don't think his breeder meets the kinds of standards that are considered to be the best. I was told though that when the AKC guy came out to check on the breeders' place and make sure it was up to their quality standards, the guy liked Zack's father so much, he bought him on the spot for a large sum.

The CKCSC, USA has a code of ethics: things like minimum and maximum breeding ages, max number of litters, required registrations. They also have recommendations for testing, I believe.
Click to expand...

What are the requirements for CKCSC registration? I mean, is it required that the parents were registered, or is it more a matter of meeting those criteria you mentioned?

I am part of 4 different cavalier rescues--- what stringent restrictions are you referring to??
Click to expand...

I just mean that i had to get written permission from my apartment landlord, and i was not willing to do that because i didn't want to put the landlord in a position of having to say no to enforce my rental agreement which says no pets, while i knew that if i got a sweet quiet little dog, they would not later kick me out as they are very kind and tentant-supportive, yet still, i wasn't willing to try to get them to put it writing so that they would be forced to say no before i got the dog. After the fact, you can make a case for implied consent if you have the dog long enough. I believe they know about Zack now and have not objected, thank goodness.

At the dog park, i have had many people tell me they were unable to get a rescue dog for the same reason that i didn't attempt it.

I consider these requirements by the rescue organizations to be reasonable, ethical and correct. But i still wanted to have a cavalier.

I did adopt a cat from a rescue once many years ago, and i don't remember being asked to get written permission but i do know that at that apartment, where i used to live, pets were allowed, that's when i got the first cat (from the pound) and then i got the second (from a rescue). As it is, i couldn't keep the second cat because the relationship between the two cats was a terrible disaster.

Anyway, I would always look into getting a rescue animal before buying commercially, and that is what i encountered when looking into rescuing a cavalier. Until i met my first cavalier last year, if i had wanted a dog, which i didn't, i would've gone to the pound to get a dog as in the past. And for the right dog, i would not hesitate to drive two days or fly, to get the dog, if i were able to rescue.

The CKCSC,USA already has health clinics about once a month (mostly heart and eye clinics)-- many of the small akc cavalier clubs also make an effort to sponser health clinics. There have been a couple of MRI clinics and there are people working to get more-- these are very expensive and time consuming.
Click to expand...

That's good to know. So far, my efforts to find one locally haven't been successful, for heart testing. At one point, i was needing to prove to my pet insurance company that Zack's heart was OK, and i looked at the available low cost clinics and there were none within a couple hundred miles or more of me. At the office of the local cardiologist, Stephen Barnett, they quoted me $500-$600 for an echocardiogram. I live in Los Angeles County and would think that would be a large area to be served.

I'm glad there are people working to get more low cost clinics. Is it possible to target donations for that project?
 
Regarding registries -- while there are obvious reasons for not choosing breeders who register with the bogus registries (there's a list of them in the Library section), anyone looking for a puppy should be mindful that AKC or CKCSC should only ever be the STARTING point for researching a good breeder in the US (or other recognised national breed clubs in other locations -- it's IKC in Ireland, KC in UK).

There are no significant health or breeding protocols that the US clubs follow. No club in the US, Ireland or the UK requires any sort of health testing for example (only the Swedish club does, to my knowledge; their heart protocol is listed in the health part of the Library here and is very stringent, requiring a heart clearance on parents every 8 months for puppies to get club registration), though some clubs have recommendations. And while people can be removed from clubs, the complaint processes are cumbersome and slow, from all I've read of discussions amongst breeders themselves concerned about questionable people getting registrations for their puppies. But registration again is ONLY a basic verification and the clubs do not have the ability to police their large memberships to any great extent, even if they wanted to do this. I always say, view a proper club registration as something like a drivers license -- it indicates you have passed some basic requirements (unlike the bogus registries that anyone can get for any dog!) but gives no indication if you are a terrible driver.

Rescue puppies are rare, and as Sandy noted rescue puppies and dogs come from totally unknown backgrounds and need a lot of extra work which is extremely rewarding for the right person but shouldn't be taken on lightly. Some dogs fit in right away; others need time. It is worth therefore going to established breed rescues who vet homes and dogs before placing a dog and will work for a good match on both sides.

I have a list of all the breed rescues in the US pinned at the top of the breed rescue section of this website. for both clubs as well as Lucky Star.

I would seriously doubt the quality of any cavalier puppy in the US available for under $1500-2,500 depending on the breeder and the location. Even $1000 is worryingly low for any committed breeder doing the most basic health clearances -- the price is just too low and any purebred of any breed from a decent breeder is going to be around that level to start with.

Please realise a puppy from a poor breeder has far higher risks of health issues and an early death from MVD (it won;t matter much that it cost a bit less if you only have the dog for 5-6 years!! :( ). Dogs from breeders following heart protocols have significantly longer lives overall -- the difference being as long as DOUBLE the lifespan. So in every way, it is worth taking the time to find the right breeder and saving for a quality puppy --- or else making the commitment to a rescue that may need vet care down the line, but is very deserving. Or waiting until it might be financially easier to welcome a new puppy -- keep in mind that two dogs of similar age will grow old and bring extra vet costs with their aging, both at the same time, so it is worth having a few years between dogs. Buying poor quality puppies from poor quality breeders means you save very little over the upfront cost -- a few hundred dollars at most in many cases as the trash breeder knows the market and will price only just under the quality breeder's prices in the region -- and risk health issues from the start. Many here can testify to a litany of health problems in puppies from poor breeders, as many of us start from a point of not realising how many breeders are out there to dupe you into buying the dogs they breed so carelessly. And the poor breeders are ever there with advice or support. They simply do not care once they pocket your money.

The breed deserves so much more -- and buyers have the greatest power to push for change and make the market more difficult for the trash breeders, because buyers are the demand side of the market and have the money. The single most powerful thing any one of us can do is support a good breeder who values the health of this breed. It is a breed under serious pressure now from health issues and supporting the breeders who work to reverse this situation should be at the top of anyone's list who loves the breed.
 
In my area, Cavaliers are fairly rare, so perhaps that is one reason they are more expensive here. Also, like someone already posted, they tend to have smaller litters.
 
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