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Pavane
12th September 2006, 07:01 PM
Getting my pup this weekend. Our breeder warns against the leptospirosis vaccine. Is this a common concern? I am a real Cav newbie.

merlinsmum
12th September 2006, 07:41 PM
I'm not sure why - I have just checked our vaccination profile and Merlin vfirst had Nobival and then two doses of Quantum 7 ( because this doesn't work on the back of Nobival - so we had to start from scratch)

This is effective against canine distemper, parainfluenza, parvo virous and Inactivated Leptospira ( is suspect it uses an inactivated bacteria so that antibodies are created but no actual symptoms occur.)

To be honest - it doesn't sound a particlulary nice disease "bacterial disease transmitted by contact with the urine of an infected dog, rat or other wildlife. Produces sever symptoms of fever, depression, jaundice and internal bleeding and was fatal BEFORE the vaccine was developed. Recovered dogs can be carriers and the disease can be transmitted from dogs to humans" taken from Meredith Johnson-Snydr's Cavalier King Charles Spaniels.

However, the breeder that put us in touch with our breeder believes in homeopathic vaccines http://www.betic.com/ - maybe this would be an option! - I'm no vet - just my reading on the subject

WoodHaven
12th September 2006, 08:32 PM
Getting my pup this weekend. Our breeder warns against the leptospirosis vaccine. Is this a common concern? I am a real Cav newbie.



;) About every couple of months we discuss shots and recommendations. I think every dog is an individual and every lifestyle needs to be examined when it comes to inoculations. Here is a basis of my shot recommendations (I have modified it a little-- a compromise with my vet, really)
http://www.doglogic.com/vaccination.htm

The lepto shot seems to be the one that MANY toy breed dogs have negative reactions to ( not all, of course ).

Each time we gave lepto to my first cavalier, her reaction got worse and worse-- she had a total of two puppy shots with lepto and her booster had lepto-- I can NOT give her anymore -- when she gets lepto shot she can't walk, she is in severe pain, she runs a fever, gets diarrhea and is rather ill for 3 days (last time). Lepto has strains (like the flu-- a flu shot is not a guarantee that you won't get the flu) Same with lepto. My vet has had NO cases of lepto in over a year. There was one in the county that he heard of (last time I asked) in the last year.
So--- higher risk of reaction, low risk (where I live) of getting the disease, possible not correct strains of lepto -- I don't give it to my dogs.
I realize if there is an outbreak nearby-- I will seek a holistic vet to see what can be done.
Lepto is a nasty disease-- when I had my girl Dominique in to the vet with an unexplained high fever and listlessness, I reminded the vet that she hasn't been inoculated for lepto-- and we treated her like she did have it. She had an IV, powerful antibiotics - full blood chem-- later that day she had vomited and had diarrhea BUT -24 hours later she showed no signs of being ill. She didn't have lepto.

merlinsmum
12th September 2006, 08:53 PM
Sandy,

Thanks for your input, I wasn't aware that so many have reactions to this. I only have previous experience of goldens, they never reacted to anything ( all 7 of them) and Merlin my cav was fine, showed no allergic reactions - guess I have been lucky with Merlin.

Not sure if we have made Parvane's decision any easier though!!!

WoodHaven
12th September 2006, 09:08 PM
Sandy,

Thanks for your input, I wasn't aware that so many have reactions to this. I only have previous experience of goldens, they never reacted to anything ( all 7 of them) and Merlin my cav was fine, showed no allergic reactions - guess I have been lucky with Merlin.

Not sure if we have made Parvane's decision any easier though!!!

I rarely give ANYONE answers-- <ask my daughters-lol> I just wanted to give him something to think about. Knowledge is power.

Coco's mom
12th September 2006, 09:15 PM
I'm definitely confused too now. :roll: My vet suggested the lepto vaccine for Coco (now 11 weeks). She said the disease is carried by skunks and raccoons- we have lots in our area, so we thought it was necessary. I didn't want to have to give Coco any of the "noncore" vaccines unless the vet suggested it for our region. Now I wonder if she was considering Coco's breed. :( She hasn't been vaccinated against it yet. Anyone had a similar situation?

merlinsmum
12th September 2006, 09:25 PM
I suppose we have to trust our vets sometimes as they are more aware of what diseases are more pevalant in the areas that they service and take on board their experience. Our vet has been our family vet since 1980 and has been through some hard times with us (cancer of the nose, gastric torsions, emergency c section, lymphoma sarcoma) and I trust him totally and know that he would ALWAYS do his best for us.

Pavane
12th September 2006, 10:04 PM
Thanks for this discussion. At least it helps me be au courant with my vet. We live in an area that has many racoons and is considered a fairly high rabies area. Even though this is a suburban looking neighborhood, we regularly see: racoons, alligators, otters, wild boar, armadillo, possum, a few little deer, and even a baby bear! Not that puppy will be roaming freely, but it is not exactly Hyde Park.

merlinsmum
12th September 2006, 10:07 PM
It must still be nice to live somewhere where there is so much wildlife.... everything seems to get killed off here in the uk with all the houses they keep building!

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Cathy T
13th September 2006, 04:15 AM
We don't give lepto but Jake and Shelby are all grown up. It may be different for a puppy and I would definitely take into account what your vet has to say about the concerns in your area. Here in San Diego...it just isn't a concern.

judy
13th September 2006, 09:43 AM
I'm definitely confused too now. :roll: My vet suggested the lepto vaccine for Coco (now 11 weeks). She said the disease is carried by skunks and raccoons- we have lots in our area, so we thought it was necessary. I didn't want to have to give Coco any of the "noncore" vaccines unless the vet suggested it for our region. Now I wonder if she was considering Coco's breed. :( She hasn't been vaccinated against it yet. Anyone had a similar situation?

You can check independently whether lepto or any disease is endemic to your area. You can check the CDC (Centers for Disease Control) website and you can call your local county health department, but your vet should have the most recent statistics. whether i would rely on what a vet says depends on the vet. It can take some time to get to know a vet and whether to be confident in them.

You can do what Sandy does, ask your vet how many cases he/she has seen or heard of in the past year. If it's not rare, then vaccinating is one option to seriously consider. If you decide to vaccinate, there are things you can do to support your puppy's immune system so that side effects may be milder, a truly holistic vet would be my choice as a source of advice, someone with a known reputation, if available.

If you do vaccinate and the puppy doesn't have a negative reaction, then you would feel better about boosters. If the puppy does have a negative reaction, then i might be looking into other options, but it's a very hard choice with risks on both sides and a need to choose between risks. It's a big responsibility. The odds are your dog would not have very serious side effects, but a dog that does have serious side effects may face some serious health consequences.

Karlin
13th September 2006, 10:51 AM
We have several dog deaths annually in Ireland from lepto so I always get it and the dogs are not bothered by it at all.

merlinsmum
13th September 2006, 12:41 PM
I think it must be the increase in rats - as they are carriers - I read somewhere the other day that there are more rats in the uk than humans - and a pair can breed up to 2,000 ratlets in a year!!!!!

Where's the Pied Piper of Hamlin when you need him? :lol: :lol:

Cathy Moon
14th September 2006, 12:12 PM
I once had a discussion about vaccination titre testing with my vet, and while he was willing to do that if I wanted to, he did tell me something I was not aware of about the lepto vaccine. He said lepto always wears off quicker than the vaccines it is mixed with in the DHLP shot, so then you have to get a separate lepto shot before the other ones if you choose to do titer testing. The lepto that is given by itself is one that has a higher incidence of reaction in dogs. He said he felt safer using the lepto in the DHLP shot.

I was glad he told me this and I decided to get the annual DHLP for my cavs. :flwr:

Coco's mom
15th September 2006, 04:30 AM
I really appreciate your replies! :flwr: I am learning so much.

Cathy Moon- I will definitely talk to my vet about this. That is really good to know! There is so much to learn! Its overwhelming!
Judy- I will also ask my vet how many cases there have been in the past year. It would be a great idea to check the stats with the health department on my own too.
Cathy T, Karlin, and merlinsmum- Thanks again for your replies. It's a great help for a newbie to hear other people's experiences and opinions.

RoyalT Cavaliers
24th September 2006, 12:45 AM
We have always not given Lepto shots to our Puppies, but now that I have kept from my own breedings and my dogs are now older *these are my Yorkies* I am now wanting to get them vaccinated for Lepto as there was 2 cases this year in my area my vet confirmed this to me.
I was wanting to do the Lepto shot but after reading what Cathy said I am thinking I may not go with the Lepto only shot. I had never heard this before but will definitely be careful as I don't want to cause any of my dogs any harm.
My adult Cavaliers are also at the age I would like to get their Lepto shots.
I was just researching this and I noticed Cavaliertalk.com came up in the links for the research on this topic. I am glad I came across this.. lol
I had missed it.

Thanks
Deana and Royal T Cavaliers and Prestigeous Yorkies
:l*v: