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George19
31st January 2007, 07:05 PM
Hi everyone,

I'm looking for some advice, I've had some suspicions about a nearby breeder and while I was playing Sherlock online I found one of her poodle pup's pedigrees. Is it ok for the pups grandparents on dads side to also appear as great grandparents on mums side? I can't imagine that that's ok, am I wrong? I have a vested interest as one of her cavalier matings appears on my George's pedigree (yes she breeds everything under the sun and apparently raises them all with love in the house). I'd post the link to the pedigree but I guess it'd be libellous. I could be completely ignorant of proper breeding but I am curious.

Thanks all

Karlin
31st January 2007, 07:12 PM
It is not necessarily a problem -- this is called line breeding and maybe one of our breeder members will discuss in more detail. Generally if you want to preserve wanted features you know better what you are getting by choosing dogs within the same line, but you also lose genetic diversity. Inbreeding can cause problems to appear. You need to really know the health history of the lines used and understand how unwanted traits could be inherited.

In cavaliers, it would be rare for many dogs from reputable breeders NOT to share some grandparents and other ancestors not just on both sides of a pedigree but often on one side!

Generally breeding very closely -- parents to offspring, or siblings to each other -- is considered bad breeding practice. But grandparents often will be bred to dogs at a further distance and the same grandparents, GG grandparents etc are fairly common.

All that said -- sounds like your nearby breeder is at best a backyard breeder and more likely a puppy farmer (there are many in Wales). No reputable breeder can manage more than two, and at a real stretch in special cases, maybe three breeds. Most focus only on one because of all that needs to be known to breed and show just one breed.

You could report her to the RSPCA and see if they are aware of her operation and the number of dogs she has at her home.

George19
31st January 2007, 07:18 PM
Thanks Karlin, it's good to have the facts.
I'll definitely consider the RSPCA

Barbara Nixon
31st January 2007, 08:17 PM
The experienced breeders who do line breed, if asked, will emphasise that you really have to know your lines or you get trouble.

inca
31st January 2007, 09:57 PM
line breeding is till fairly common in some lines . although i think its fair to say some are avoiding doubling up now due to health problems ...

A lot of pedigree's have doubled up names on each side it was the way of breeding a generation type breeders wouldn't often go outside the pedigree ( outcross) incase of loosing the type and risking bringing in unknown problems

think i have said that right :flwr:

Lisa_T
31st January 2007, 10:36 PM
In Cavaliers as well, I think line breeding is also used in improve longevity and for heart health etc- by which I mean the same dog will appear a number of times- the dog is question is often one of the 'big names', eg, Alberto of Kindrum.

inca
31st January 2007, 11:28 PM
well that was the plan but sad to say some health issues were helped BUT others were made worse by some lines becoming to tight some of the effects are just starting to surface :(