16th February 2007, 07:23 PM
Hello pple i am new here and have 2 cavaliers Jaz a 5yr female and Sammy a 2 and a half male. Sammy is the recent addition as i wanted him as a pet and also the chance to put him with Jaz.
4 wks ago Jaz came into season and of course she was'nt reading to accept the male and would snap at him and he would respect her. then 3 wks this coming Sunday i got woken up to shrieks and ran up to the kitchen. only to find the 2 dogs "tied" together!! i supported Jaz as she was quite didtressed as this was her first time. the tie last around 15 mins. then since that sunday we had seperated em while no one was around to supervise them. When in the home we let them be together and subsequently they have tied several times over 4 day from that Sunday 3 wks ago.
She is currently at my parents haeing a lovely time being spoilt!!
Anyone here that could give me advise as to what are the early signs to look for if she is prgnant? or when it would start to show? Much appreciated.
16th February 2007, 07:49 PM
You have pm. ;)
16th February 2007, 08:18 PM
You are welcome to the board but you need to read the Getting Started section about what is appropriate to post.
If you had, you would have discovered that I do not allow discussions of breeding on this board except by breeders known to me, whom I am sure do the proper health testing for this breed -- meaning a cardiac clearance for heart murmurs, testing eyes, hips, patellas, following the breeding protocol for prevention of heart disease, which will affect 50% of all cavaliers by age 5 because of backyard breeding (breeding by people who do not understand genetics, health testing, or the health issues in the breed, and thus severely damage not just the chances of every puppy in a litter, but the breed's very future). Anyone breeding also needs to understand the severe problems the breed now faces from the neurological condition syringomyelia, which affects between 30-70% of cavaliers (see www.sm.cavaliertalk.com for more information and for the suggested breeding protocol for cavaliers -- which requires MRIing all breeding stock).
Also I do hope that you and your folks were fully aware of and have followed the mitral valve disease breeding protocol which has been around for a decade, is endorsed by the worldwide official breed clubs, as it is **so important** only to breed dogs that fulfill its basic requirements -- that both your male and female have been cleared for heart murmurs within the past month or two by a cardiac specialist (a vet is not good enough; they miss many murmurs til they are very advanced and your dogs both need to have totally clear hearts). Also you need to be sure that the parents of both your breeding dogs were ALSO heart clear at age 5. Otherwise you have placed ALL your puppies at risk of early onset heart disease and early death. :( At a minimum, you need to have followed the heart protocol, even if you did nothing else in terms of health testing. We all, I hope, care far too much for this wonderful breed to watch puppies produced that are at risk of dying early of heart disease and themselves passing on poor genes to future offspring.
I am also really concerned that you have bred a five year old dog for the first time, at this age!! -- this is VERY old for a cavalier bitch to be bred for the first time; most are RETIRED at this age, if they were considered to have genes valuable to the breed and therefore be worth breeding in the first place. She has clearly already gone through considerable distress in the process of being bred at this late age.
Health issues for the breed:
No one should be breeding any dog unless they have read through these considerations:
This is what I mention about posting about litters on the board in the Getting Started section:
Longtime members will know I am very wary of having announcements of new litters posted to the board -- for ethical reasons I have gone on and on about numerous times. This is also stated in the Getting Started section on what is appropriate to post.
Exceptions are reputable breeders on this board whom I know through their participation here and on other boards and lists, and who I know are actively concerned about health and conformation and temperament -- who breed with knowledge and with health clearances and who remain an active part of the breeding and showing world -- so their cavaliers are under constant scrutiny. They home their dogs carefully under restricted contracts. They don't breed pet quality dogs of unknown background and health history.
It is very hard for me to know whether others take into account some or any of these things when they have bred their dogs. And I fear that discussions of such breedings only encourages others to do likewise and gives the impression that such breedings are fine with me and with everyone here. To me, they aren't fine, never have been fine.
After a lot of thought, I have decided I do not want discussions of new puppy litters on the board by anyone who isn't a breeder that fits the above criteria. And unfortunately there are now so many members that it has become almost impossible for me or the breeders that I know to be reputable, to know about new breeders joining the list. That puts me in the awkward position of limiting litter discussions.
You who fit the criteria all know who you are as you have been here for a while and are known in the breeding and showing world . There's nothing more delightful than hearing about puppies that have been carefully bred to have long and healthy lives, and seeing their pictures. But I despair of every single cavalier born to people who do not follow the heart protocols, do not register their dogs or register with the bogus registries, who do not stay actively involved in the breed. Every one of those puppies is a potential liability to the breed. It is depressing reading about those who have bought such puppies years ago, and end up losing their dogs now to heart failure at young ages, 5 or 6 or 7. Problems that could be minimised and even eliminated by responsible breeding. If you are not breeding to help lower the risk of MVD, then you are contributing to the problem. Full stop. If you can live with that, fine; but you are not really welcome to talk about it here. If not -- and I sincerely hope this board helps people see why breeding in this way is so wrong -- get a good mentor, get involved with the breed and with showing, learn more about this breed and its health issues, and consider returning to breeding when you are able to improve the breed rather than contribute to its decline. For that is what indiscriminate breeding has already done to cavaliers, and every new litter bred in the same way is another blow to the breed's health.
If you can prove to me that your breeding programme fits all the above criteria, and if I can verify that definitely through a third party involved with the clubs/breeding/showing, I will allow discussions of new puppies.
There are other boards and sites that allow lots of discussions on breeding and litters and given that there are these other resources, I don't feel it is overly restrictive to keep such discussions controlled here. Breeders wanting to discuss breeding and announce litters should of course be on the L-list, the main CKCS breeder list.
Incidentally for many of the same reasons, I also don't allow links to breeder websites when they are listed as an advertisement for puppies (as stated in the board guidelines too) and will delete them when I come across them.
I am locking this thread as I don't want any further public discussion. I'd suggest reading up thoroughly and getting a knowledgeable mentor on the whole breeding process as you will have a higher risk pregnancy for both puppies and mother -- your bitch's life is at greater risk, to be breeding her for the first time, so late in her life. :( If I were you I'd seriously reconsider whether you even WANT her to go through this pregnancy -- unless losing her is worth the risk of having a litter.
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