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Andrea Howell
1st August 2007, 08:24 PM
Hiya everyone
I too have just joined the Cavalier chit chat. I'm so Happy to have found a board where people love their Cavs as much as me. I'm mummy to Tara, my beautiful blenheim girl. She will be three in October, and is a fantastic little lady. I've started checking out studs for her in my area and have come across two gorgeous little Drumadowney tri boys (brothers). I've been checking out their pedigrees and i think they might be related to some of the cavs on here. Tara hasn't got a fancy kennel name (her breeder didn't give her one and I didn't know at the time how much it means to be able to track their pedigrees) I can track her pedigree to her ggparents but after that the trail dries up. She does have the infamous little stud 'Homerbrent Jeremy at Cottismeer' in her line though. There are alot of Alanskei's and Cottismeer's, Marcliffs and Cottarose. Andrea x Anyone related? It would be fantastic if the owner of Tara's mum or dad was on here.

Karlin
2nd August 2007, 12:38 AM
Hi Andrea: You are very welcome here :) but please be aware I do not allow discussions of breeding dogs unless I can verify the breeder is doing all proper health testing for their dogs. :thmbsup: This is explained clearly in the Getting Started section on the board.

If you do not even know the pedigree of your own dog, which is crucial for good breeding practice for health reasons, and you do not understand fully the genetics of how serious health conditions are passed on through this breed, please do not consider breeding.

There are two extremely serious health issues in the breed, mitral valve disease (early onset heart disease) and the painful neurological condition syringomyelia. You should not breed your dog or use either of those studs unless you know the full heart history of the dogs AND their parents. To follow the MVD protocol that good breeders use to help protect these lovely dogs from early, painful deaths from heart failure, your dog and the studs should be at *least* 2.5 years old and have a full heart clearance from a cardiologist specialist (NOT a vet as vets consistently fail to pick up most early murmurs). In addition all four grandparents must be at least 5 and also, all be/have been heart clear still up to at least age 5.

In addition, you will want to consider MRIs for syringomyelia for your breeding bitch ( also done at 2.5 or older) to receive a breeding grade and also have the stud done as well. There are low cost clinics for this in the UK but expect to pay around £200 per scan and the scan should not be done until 2.5 so that the scan fits in with the earliest breeding age and the MVD protocol.

Please do not even consider breeding until you have watched these three videos of cavaliers affected with symptomatic syringomyelia:

http://sm.cavaliertalk.com/video/videos.html

You will also find the full SM breeding protocol explained on the site. Are you aware that SM is now blieved to affect at least 50% of all cavaliers over their lifetime? Many of us here, including me, own SM-affected dogs and having seen the pain they live with every day, would not want any breeder to unknowingly inflict this condition on further generations of puppies.

I would recommend getting involved with your local breed club to fully understand the implications of making proper breeding choices. Additionally, it is worth noting that the UK breed club this year already has an excessive amount of puppies on its puppy roster that are not selling, as buyers perhaps grow more cautious about finding breeders who at minimum do the proper heart screening on their dogs. That means these breeders will be left with these dogs for their lifetime.

If you cannot sell your puppies, as a responsible breeder you would need to be willing to keep all the puppies yourself, as well as take back any dog of your breeding for its lifetime.

It's a big responsibility on every level.

Cathy T
2nd August 2007, 01:24 AM
Hi Andrea

Welcome. Do please listen carefully to Karlin's advice and information re breeding. It's such a tricky endeavor. We're glad to have you here. What a great place to learn.

Caraline
2nd August 2007, 04:01 AM
icon_welcome

Hi Andrea, welcome. Karlin has already given you some great advice above, but I’d like to add my 0.2c worth.

When we have a gorgeous dog that we love & we feel is absolutely perfect, it can be tempting to want to breed from them. However, if we are truly serious and really want to do the right thing, not only for our dog, the puppies & the breed, but also for the potential puppy owners, we need to start off on the right foot right from the word go.

This usually means forgetting about breeding from our much loved pet & accepting them as a wonderful family member, but not for breeding purposes. As your girl does not have her registration papers, her pedigree will always be in doubt, no matter how nice & sincere her breeders are. This also means that her genetic health also is & will continue to be in doubt. Even if you did all of the health checks required at this stage, you will never be totally sure about the health history of her ancestors.

If you really are determined to enter the breeding arena, you need to start from square one. Square one is where you do your homework, you read about canine genetics, breed specific problems, about whelping, about what can go wrong, the list goes on & on. You then choose an experienced & ethic breeder who will help & guide you along the path. Only then do you start looking for a puppy or an adult that may be suitable from breeding from. It also means getting involved in the show scene, as it is very difficult for us to be objective about our own dogs suitability for breeding. Though the judges opinion can never replace appropriate health checks, their eye is still valuable in evaluating whether outwardly a dog is suitable for breeding purposes. This is why when choosing a puppy many people wish to see the pedigree of the sire & dam, and are reassured when they see a nice splash of champions in there. It is a long and slow process, but this is an area where there really are no ethical shortcuts.

I hope you will receive our comments in the spirit that they are meant. There is a wealth of information here on the forum so take a look around. :flwr:

Andrea Howell
2nd August 2007, 02:49 PM
Hi Karlin, I want to appologise for discussing breeding Tara on your forum I didn't realise, I guess I was just so excited about being in a Cav chat forum, but I want to let you know that she is KC registered and I have her 5 year generation certificate at home in a frame. I'm not sure why she hasn't got a proper kennel name. I suppose her parents where just kept as pets and not for the ring, although I understand that, that shouldn't matter. I've had her eyes and heart checked and been given the all clear, although i'm still waiting for her heart certificate to come in the post. I had to get it from the uk Cavalier King Charles spaniel club and then forward it on to the cardiologist specialist in Belfast who didn't have any heart certificates to give me at the time. (thats N.I for you) I have been doing lots of reading up on the breed and wanted her fully health checked. I've been in touch with her breeder and her parents still have clear hearts and eyes and are over 5 years old. They are from Wales. The stud dogs that I mentioned have also had health checks done and are from a reputable breeder. They are from Drumadowney kennels here in Northern Ireland. Their lines are linked with Charterwood pedigree. I've found that we do have a problem here in Northern Ireland for getting MRI scans for syringomyelia. The cardiologist specialist has only recently become a cardiologist specialist.
Tara's pups will be going to trusted members of my family (I'm from a very large Irish family) aswell as ourselves. I am very aware of the health issues and I am trying to do my upmost to give Tara's puppies the best start in life. There is no question of me taking the puppies back if i need to, as Tara's pups will always be Tara's pups regardless of who takes them.
I'm sure you will all give me great advise as Tara and I go through this journey. Andrea X

inca
2nd August 2007, 03:18 PM
welcome to the forum Andrea

coconut
2nd August 2007, 03:42 PM
andrea and tara welcome to the board!

Rj Mac
2nd August 2007, 06:19 PM
Hiya, welcome to the board :D