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sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 10:51 AM
Hey there

I bought a lovely little cavalier king charles last week. Today he is 8 weeks old and Im a bit worried.

Last night he woke us at 4.30 in the monring crying, I went down to check on him and noticed that there were 2 little poo's. These were very soft and water like, and had blood in them!!!!!

I called the vet this monring and I'v to bring him for a check up later today - But im so worried.

He had his Parvo shots on 21 August, so I don't think it could be this? He is a very lazy little thing, sleeps alot! But I thought this was normal as he is only a puppy. When he is playful he is very lively. He doesn't have a huge appitite but I think he may dislike the food we are giving him as he will eat bolied ham and chicken at the offering!

Any advice or ideas to settle my concerns?

coconut
6th September 2007, 11:21 AM
What food are u feeding him? Have u changed his food since u got him??

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 11:28 AM
The breeder gave us dog nuts and I've been mixing this with dry food that the Vet recommended.

My Boyfriend brought him up to his mothers yesterday and they gave him milk as he seems to like that.

I also gave him a little bif of shepards pie yesterday evening as he doesn't seem to eat his own food.

Could any of that be the problem?

coconut
6th September 2007, 11:36 AM
It could be that you are giving him too many different things leave him on the food the breeder gave u for a week or more and then slowly change the food. I had this problem with my fred when i got him i changed the food pretty quickly and had this problem! ALSO it is not recommendated that you give your puppy milk as he may be allegric to it, as it not suited to all dogs!!!

I have only started to give my dogs a taste of shepherds pie and stuff now and they are 10 months and 8months.

Good Luck in the vets!

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 11:39 AM
Thanks for the advice :-) I hope he'll be ok


It could be that you are giving him too many different things leave him on the food the breeder gave u for a week or more and then slowly change the food. I had this problem with my fred when i got him i changed the food pretty quickly and had this problem! ALSO it is not recommendated that you give your puppy milk as he may be allegric to it, as it not suited to all dogs!!!

I have only started to give my dogs a taste of shepherds pie and stuff now and they are 10 months and 8months.

Good Luck in the vets!

Karlin
6th September 2007, 11:47 AM
You definitely need to get him to a vet right away. One worry: at what age did the breeder home him to you if he's only 8 weeks now? IKC breeders are not allowed to rehome dogs til at least 7.5 weeks and many would feel under 8 weeks is really too young for a breeder to have homed cavalier puppies in particular. It really annoys me that some Irish breeders home this young -- they just want rid of them and to get their money and it is enfuriating. :confused: If this puppy was UNDER 7.5 weeks you should report the breeder to the IKC. :mad:

What information and support has the breeder given to you on the puppy? Were the puppies all wormed as well? Worms could be a cause of blood. On vaccinations: it's very important to understand that your puppy will NOT be safe against parvo at this age (the breeder should have explained this very clearly!), and will only have had his first vaccination. You need to talk to your vet quite urgently on how to manage a puppy til its second puppy shots and when they are due. Generally the puppy should not be allowed outside -- do NOT walk it outside at all except minimally in a garden to relieve itself, or to play in an enclosed garden where other dogs don't have access! -- or be introduced to other dogs until two weeks AFTER the last puppy shots. That means a puppy is not safe against parvo/distemper til 12-16 weeks old. Until then the puppy is considered at FULL RISK for parvo and distemper.

If the puppy is listless and sleeping a lot, this would be a concern. Puppies however do sleep a lot so the other behaviour is what you also need to be watching. Blood in stools in a puppy is not a good sign though so definitely get into a vet today. Are you walking him at 3-4am? Puppies this young need you to take them out and that is one reason why they will cry at this age. You need to have a scheduled time in the middle of the night to take him out.

I'd strongly recommend getting a good book on puppies as this will answer a lot of early questions people tend to have. I'd suggest ordering Ian Dunbar's book(s) on raising a puppy from Amazon.co.uk :thmbsup: There's also a lot of good info on puppies at www.diamondsintheruff.com (http://www.diamondsintheruff.com).

Definitely do NOT give milk. Dogs can not digest the lactose and milk will often cause diarrhea and stomach upset.

coconut
6th September 2007, 11:47 AM
Karlin's information is alot more informative than mine!! Take in all that she is telling you as it is very good advice! Let us know how the vet goes!

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 11:56 AM
The breeder let him home to me at 7 weeks. He is 8 weeks old today - I've only had him a week now. He does sleep a lot, but when he is awake he is full of beans!

I didn't realise that I needed to take him out during the night, Ill start doing that!

I'll bring him to the Vets today, the appointment is at 4.50. Hopefully he'll be ok. Im so attached to him already!

coconut
6th September 2007, 12:37 PM
if u need anything pm me! don't worry to much i have my :xfngr: for u!

Cathryn
6th September 2007, 12:38 PM
This is why I don't let pups go until 10 weeks minimum! First of all it is a huge upheavel leaving mum and puppy mates, that alone is enough to upset a puppies tum, plus changing diet as well and that just adds to it I'm afraid to say.

My litter are now 10 weeks old and spend an awful lot of time asleep still, this is totally normal, when they are awake oh boy do we know about it :lol: It is very common for puppies to go off their regular feed when they move homes as well as they have lost the normal competition factor at mealtimes from their siblings too!
One of my pups is off to his forever home on Friday :( :( His new mum is calling daily now for updates on her baby :lotsaluv: he will have had his full vaccination routine by then but will not be going out other than in his own garden for a full 2 weeks longer, we have had a long chat on this matter as his owner so wants to get things right straight away!

Anyway, I hope that your little chap, what have you called him by the way? I do hope that all goes well with him, am sure he will be fine, but you are doing the right thing getting him checked out by the vet :thmbsup:

Will watch for news!!

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 12:41 PM
Thanks Cathryn - his name is Brian - I've posted pics on the puppies gallery of him :-)

hilary
6th September 2007, 12:56 PM
Hi SASSYPIPS . REALLY HOPE YOUR PUP IS OK NOW . I THINK YOU SHOULD CONTACT THE BREEDER . IF THE PUP ISNT WELL SOME OF THE ONUS RESTS WITH HER /HIM . I STILL HAVE NOT MANAGED TO FIND A PUPPY . TO BE HONEST I'M GETTING A BIT FREAKED OUT BY ALL THE SCARE STORIES . I KEEP HEARING STORIES ABOUT UNSCRUPULOUS BREEDERS JUST OUT TO MAKE A QUICK BUCK . FINGERS CROSSED YOUR LITTLE GUY WILL BE FINE . I KNOW YOU CAN GET ATTACHED TO THEM IN A MATTER OF MINUTES AND I SOMETIMES THINK BREEDERS CAPITALISE ON THAT FACT. BEST OF LUCK ............HILARY

Karlin
6th September 2007, 01:13 PM
Under the old code of ethics it was ILLEGAL for an IKC breeder to have homed a puppy at 7 weeks -- and you should report this person. That's absolutely shocking to have homed at that age and in many countries and US states under 7.5 weeks is actually illegal for a whole range of health and behavioural reasons. Is this an IKC breeder? Did you get their name through the breed club secretary? She too should be informed one of their breeders is homing underaged puppies. :(

Cathy Moon
6th September 2007, 01:15 PM
Others have offered great advice, so I won't repeat anything except for one: Definitely buy yourself a book about puppies, a book about Cavaliers (which should have a chapter or two on puppy care), and one more book, Complete Dog Care Manual by Bruce Fogle, D.V.M, published by DK.

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 04:33 PM
My boyfriend just called me - he is back from the Vets. Brian will be ok. The Vet gave him antibiotic shots. He also gave us tablets to give Brian this week. We are unsure what caused the blood in the stools.Could have been his diet we were told.

Found out also that he has mites!! The Vet said these were contracted from the mother and that the breeder should have known and treated this. I was told the one thing I didn't want to hear - I bought from a bad breeder. We have to wash him once a week with special shampoo to clear it up. The Vet said its not easy to clear!!

And also .... My pup still has his dewclaws which I was told should have been removed! Furthermore Im annoyed now because I brought Brian for a check up the day after I bought him and the first Vet didn't mention any of this to me!

Ohh ... what will be next!

WoodHaven
6th September 2007, 04:58 PM
My boyfriend just called me - he is back from the Vets. Brian will be ok. The Vet gave him antibiotic shots. He also gave us tablets to give Brian this week. We are unsure what caused the blood in the stools.Could have been his diet we were told.

Found out also that he has mites!! The Vet said these were contracted from the mother and that the breeder should have known and treated this. I was told the one thing I didn't want to hear - I bought from a bad breeder. We have to wash him once a week with special shampoo to clear it up. The Vet said its not easy to clear!!

And also .... My pup still has his dewclaws which I was told should have been removed! Furthermore Im annoyed now because I brought Brian for a check up the day after I bought him and the first Vet didn't mention any of this to me!

Ohh ... what will be next!

So glad to hear Brian should be fine. Did they say what type of mite the pup has? Some types of mites are more common and some are more problematic.

I ONLY have the dewclaws removed on a cavalier IF the litter is very stable. I prefer to have them off-- but I will not risk the pups life for it. I've had two premie litters that I didn't want to risk an open wound on tiny pups. fwiw-Sandy

Barbara Nixon
6th September 2007, 05:07 PM
In the uk it is not common to remove dewclaws, unless they are damaged or deformed in some way. I'm assuming you mean, front ones, as very few dogs are born with back ones. A lady on Dogpages had the rear ones removed from her large breed and wished she hadn't as the op was quite invasive and painful afterwards.

coconut
6th September 2007, 05:09 PM
So glad that brian will be okay!

MITES :yikes i would defo ring the breeder and say it to them!!

Is this other vet in the same place as the one u were with today? I would love to know how come he didn't notice!!!

Poor Brian lets hope them horrible mites clear up quickly for him! :flwr:

sassy.pips
6th September 2007, 06:15 PM
I'm not too sure which mites they were, I must ask my BF later as he was talking to the Vet. The Vet is from the same practise but it was a different (more competant one it seems) that looked after Brian today.

I'm not sure which dewclaws he was talking about either - It may have been a back one. The Vet said he was just advising us in case it caused problems in the future as the nail has a tendancy to grow back into the skin.

This really is a learning experience for me I tell you!!

Cathryn
6th September 2007, 06:32 PM
Have to agree with Sandy on this one. In order for a puppy to have it's dewclaws removed they have to be around 2-3 days old, they have NO IMMUNITY to anything, this operation should ONLY be carried out by a vet, they do NOT give any anaesthetic/painkiller they quite simply clamp the dew claw and cut it off with very sharp scissors :yikes: I for one will not take a litter of newborn pups into a surgery risking contact with who only knows what airborn bugs in order to remove a nail a little further up it's front leg that if trimmed properly throughout it's life will never give any trouble at all!! I went with a colleague once when she had her litter done, it was heartbreaking hearing those little mites scream with pain and even more heartbreaking to see how unsettled those puppies were for 2 days afterwards too. The only time I would ever remove a dew claw is if it is obviously deformed.

On a more positive note, I am glad to hear that Brian has medication for his tummy upset and also for his ears, am sure all will be well again soon for him, personnally I would get in touch with his breeder and let them know about the mites so they can treat the rest of their dogs?? :thmbsup:

Moviedust
6th September 2007, 06:38 PM
I'm sorry to hear that you've discovered --after the fact-- that your puppy comes from a breeder who wasn't very concerned about your dog's health. Is this your first dog?

Definitely check out the literature that's available. While nothing can be specific to you, you can learn a great deal about what's normal/average to expect from a puppy at different stages. They can also give you tips on how to interact with your puppy so that it grows up with manners and basic obedience.

Since your puppy is so very young--think of a human infant -- you will have to be very careful and constantly on watch. You have to make up for the fact it is missing out on important lessons from its mother and siblings.

As far as house-training, with a puppy this little you can start the principles, but it will be months before your dog can be considered trustworthy on its own (others might say a whole year!). Think about a human infant and how long it can go without relieving itself and needing a diaper changed. Cav puppies have even smaller bladders than some human infants, so you will probably want to take your puppy out every 15 minutes or so. Especially watch for signs of sniffing and circling. Also, after eating, sleeping and playing your puppy will probably need to go outside. At night time, your puppy can go longer because the body's mechanics slow down during sleep, but the puppy still won't be able to hold it all night. Generally, a puppy will need to go outside at least once or twice every night. At this age, you're looking at several weeks of night-time outings. It's important to take the dog out, too; if not, you'll be setting your house-training back each time the dog has an indoor accident.

There's a lot to know about raising a little puppy, so definitely start reading up ASAP!! Good luck!

Barbara Nixon
6th September 2007, 07:33 PM
Cathryn, that's barbaric. how would the vet like his finger or toe nails clipped off, even if he's only a few days old. The nails may be softer then, but the nerves are intact.

BarbMazz
6th September 2007, 08:34 PM
Both my Cavs have their dew claws intact. Bentley has one rear dew claw, too.

I trim them just as I do all other nails. It's no problem at all.

My Golden has his dew claws, too. My English Springer had hers removed when she was tiny. Her breeder said he does it matter of course because they are hunting dogs. Poor things! Goldens are hunting dogs, too, but his breeder left them intact. Seems like it must be very painful removing them. :(