View Full Version : Raw Food Raves and a question
22nd September 2007, 01:44 PM
I have started feeding my three Raw from a company called Healthy Pet Products. They LOVE it....I have never seen anything like it! My freezer is stocked up with the beef, chicken, duck necks, and green tripe. For treats, I got freeze-dried chicken hearts.
I have never seen dogs be more excited when its time to eat.... I always stayed away from it because I thought it would be more expensive to feed the raw, but I am finding it works out about the same as a high quality kibble and the dogs are much more excited to eat! If anyone has fussy eaters I HIGHLY recommend giving this a try.
The other great thing about raw (since I have to pick up their poops--yuck!) is that they are so small and they go much less often! Definitely makes for easy clean up--even if Bentley has an accident in the house--which happens on occasion as he is only 5 months.
I do have a question for those of you who feed raw....do you just use paper plates and a snood, or do you wash the same dishes after they have eaten? I find I am doing LOTS of dishes as they eat twice a day... I really need to order some snoods.
22nd September 2007, 01:49 PM
You would definitely need to wash bowls daily. Paper plates are kind of wasteful though and I'd think a bit stinky to sit in the trash?
Snoods are always a good idea especially if feeding raw as they will get raw meat in their ear hair and that is potentially a health risk to *you*. It is known that there is a range of bacteria in analysed raw diets, including salmonella (even a good proportion of chicken from the supermarket had salmonella contamination -- it sadly is part of the risk of large processing faciities that are the norm these days). So you need to be extra meticulous in handling and cleaning up, and also meticulous in picking up poops as it is known that there's often salmonella in the poops from raw diet fed dogs and this is a health risk for the elderly and children in particular, if left lying around.
22nd September 2007, 01:56 PM
Something to keep in mind as well, from the University of Missouri Vet School. Feeding raw divides people strongly. Raw feeders regularly take issue with vets and vet schools. I tend to feel more comfortable with actual studies from vet schools and the stories I hear directly from vets, rather than anecdotal evidence that this is a healhier diet, so I no longer feed raw except the occasional bone or chicken neck (that's my personal bias clearly stated:thmbsup:; everyone has a different risk level they accept for their dogs in trade for what they see as clear benefits). This outlines what a prominent vet school sees as the risks which I think need to be taken on board if only for why anyone feeding raw has an extra obligation to be very careful at cleaning up after their dogs at all times :thmbsup::
Health Risks from Feeding Raw
Pet Food and Treats
March 16 2007
Raw pet foods are meat or meat-based products that are typically not subjected to heat processing before distribution to consumers. Feeding raw food to dogs and cats has gained popularity in recent years. Among the proposed benefits are better nutrition, longer life, less parasites, and less allergies. However, little to no scientific proof exists for these claims. There is evidence for health risks to pets and their owners from raw pet foods and treats.
Hemolytic-uremic syndrome is caused by a toxin (poison) produced by a form of the bacteria, E. coli. Recent cases in humans have been linked to eating undercooked hamburger or spinach. Approximately 73,000 people in the U.S. become sick each year from Hemolytic-Uremic syndrome, and some die.
For years an ulcerative skin disease and kidney failure syndrome in racing greyhounds fed raw food and called “Alabama Rot” perplexed veterinarians. The cause is now believed to be an E. coli toxin acquired from raw meat. Handling of raw pet foods and treats can be a hemolytic-uremic syndrome risk to humans.
Salmonella bacteria, the cause of typhoid fever, can cause severe diarrhea, vomiting, arthritis, and other problems in animals and humans. Approximately 40,000 people in the U.S. are infected with Salmonella each year. People with impaired immune systems or children are at higher risk of dying from Salmonellosis. Raw food, especially poultry, is a major source. Government studies have reported 16.3% of all chickens carry Salmonella bacteria.
A study was reported in 2002 that showed 30% of dogs fed raw food diets had Salmonella bacteria in their stool samples. None of the dogs fed commercial (heat-processed) food had Salmonella.
In 2003, two cats died of Salmonellosis in Georgia that were fed raw beef diets, and two Papillon dogs in Texas fed raw chicken-based food died of the disease.
In June, 2006, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control issued a warning to people who handle raw beef or seafood treats to their pets. The warning described 9 cases of pet owners who became sick with Salmonellosis, which they acquired from handling pet treats. Some of their pets also became ill.
Last month, February 2007, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration issued a warning for consumers not to buy Wild Kitty Cat Food, a raw pet food because Salmonella had been cultured from samples of the food.
Toxoplasmosis is a one-cell parasite that can cause brain, heart, liver, and eye inflammation and damage in animals and humans. Pregnant women who acquire the parasite may pass it to the unborn baby and cause brain and eye damage in the baby or abortion.
Toxoplasmosis can be transmitted to humans from raw meat products such as raw pet food or treats by contaminating hands, food preparation areas such as cutting boards, or food preparation utensils such as knives.
Avoid feeding your pet raw pet foods or treats, or make sure the label says the manufacturer has used heat-treatment or irradiation to destroy bacteria in the processing.
At the minimum if you feed raw food that has not been sterilized follow manufacturer’s directions: wash your hands after feeding, sterilize (not just clean) all food preparation areas and utensils, wash the pet food bowl after every meal, do not store pet food in a way that human food may become contaminated, and discard any refrigerated raw pet food within 3 days after thawing.
For more information, contact your local veterinarian or the MU Veterinary Medical Teaching Hospital 573-882-7821 or visit http://www.vmth.missouri.edu/
22nd September 2007, 01:58 PM
Thanks, Karlin! Thats what I have been doing---washing every time with anti-bacterial dish soap.
And, yes--- they do get it in their ears so I have been washing their ears, too. I have definitely got to order snoods....
22nd September 2007, 02:00 PM
Oh, no....that article is a bit scary.... now Im confused!
22nd September 2007, 04:04 PM
I feed raw to mine. I use snoods and change them every couple of days (needless to say....I have a whole stash of snoods!!). The containers the food is stored in and the bowls I feed them out of are washed right after dinner with hot soapy water. I wipe the counters down with anti-bacterial wipes (no sponges since I don't want any tidbits of raw meat sitting on my sponge). I treat feeding raw the same way I treat handling raw meat I am planning to cook for our meals. The benefits I've seen from feeding my two Primal are huge. Both of them have no more tummy problems, their coats look great and Shelby has no more tear staining.
Feeding raw is very much a controversial subject. If you do it properly and are careful....great. But you can't get sloppy with your prep and cleaning techniques. I completely trust my source of food.
23rd September 2007, 02:47 AM
About 4 months ago, my local pet store recommended a frozen raw dog food by Nature's Variety. It comes in convenient "medallions" of raw food....so easy, I'd take out 4 of them the night before and let it thaw in the fridge overnight.
I have to say, my puppy loved it so much she would practically inhale it! However, when I ran it by my vet, he said he doesn't recommend raw food because of the possible bacteria it can carry.
So there went that. Back to Eukanuba kibbles....
23rd September 2007, 03:28 AM
I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a vet who "endorses" raw feeding. My vet doesn't. But she understand why I am doing it and recognizes my precautions. So, although she doesn't endorse it, she does support my doing it.
23rd September 2007, 10:28 AM
Sorry but what is a snood:confused:
23rd September 2007, 04:42 PM
Something you put over their head to keep their ears out of their food.
23rd September 2007, 04:46 PM
Something you put over their head to keep their ears out of their food.
thanks for that. Doesnt this little guy look cute.
23rd September 2007, 05:58 PM
Doesnt this little guy look cute
I think she looks more petrified than anything :D but she knows....snood = food!!! :)
24th September 2007, 01:20 AM
I feed my guys raw too. Here in Australia it is a very popular way of feeding and does not carry the same fears that seems prevalent in other countries. It is probably only in the last 10 years or so that we have followed in the footsteps of America and have started to embrace fast-food, including dry kibble for our dogs, neither of which I am convinced is a move in the right direction, but that is moot.
I treat my dogs’ food & water dishes in exactly the same way I treat our dishes. That is to say, after every meal they are rinsed & washed in the dishwasher. Did you know that items washed in a well maintained dishwasher on the normal cycle come out sterile or if not, then so close to it, it doesn’t matter?
You can stop food getting in your dogs ears (by using a snood as mentioned by others) or by simply using the correct sized food dish. If you use a dish that is not as wide as your dogs head, the ears will lay on the outside of the dish, keeping them clean. When my guys get great bones to gnaw on, they do get meat & blood on their ears, but I just give their ears a wipe over with a warm wet face cloth.
I am pleased to hear that your guys are enjoying their new diet so much. My little men go nuts at meal time too, and yes those nice firm, odour free poops are a joy to behold. :D
24th September 2007, 04:34 AM
So there went that. Back to Eukanuba kibbles....
Oh sweetie...I can see having doubts about raw, but Eukanuba?? There are better choices, kibble/canned that is closer to a species appropriate diet than ground corn and by-products!
Winston's breeder recommends incorporating at least some raw into her pups diets, but I was skeptical. After much research I decided to dive in there a couple of months ago. What a difference! Winston and his 11 yr. old big sis Kelsey (a GSD) LOVE it! Mealtimes are an event rather than a 15 sec woofdown. I put their Raw Meaty Bone portions on a plastic placemat of sorts (a large plastic bag cut in half.) After each meal I wipe the counters with kitchen cleaner and use a swifter on the floor (as some inevitably slides off of the placemat.)
I can really see a difference with my pups. Soft, minimally shedding coats (yes, even the GSD!), compact poops, lots of energy (Winston was running circles around the humans on the 3hr hike this weekend) and pearly white teeth (first time in 5 yrs that Kelsey didn't need a dental!)
25th September 2007, 12:08 AM
I talked to a vet with a PhD in small animal nutrition. She said that as long as the raw meat was handled properly, dogs and cats with normal immune systems should have no problems with it. The reason she doesn't recommend it is because people often mishandle raw meat!
As far as toxoplasmosis, just freeze the meat for a day and that should kill the bug. There are many warnings about feeding raw, but with all the recent recalls I think risks appear no what you feed!
My guy does great on the raw and the warning always make me think twice. But since he's doing so well (much better than on kibble or canned), why change?
25th September 2007, 04:11 PM
Miles is on raw, and as a few others have said, he eats with a snood and his dishes are washed in the dishwasher after every meal. He eats his RMBs (raw meaty bones) on a special towel that is also washed every time he uses it; he is now trained to eat his RMBs on the towel so he doesn't get anything on our wood floor or rug.
Here are some pictures of Miles with his snood (I still can't figure out how to get the pictures to show on my post! :)
25th September 2007, 04:19 PM
Miles is adorable!! What sweet pictures of him.
25th September 2007, 04:23 PM
25th September 2007, 06:32 PM
Mia does wonderfully on raw. I wouldn't even consider going back to kibble. She loves it and it's obvious from her coat and eyes how good she's doing on it. :)
I think as long as you handle the food carefully and wash everything up, there's nothing to be concerned about and, IMO, the benefits outweigh the risk. I can understand why vets don't recommend raw probably because the vast majority of people wouldn't take the proper care in handling and clean up. It would understandably put them at risk for lawsuits. You can bet people would rather blame their vet for recommending raw than take the responsibility themselves.
Glad to hear you're enjoying feeding raw!! :rah:
25th September 2007, 07:06 PM
I forgot to add that Miles' traditional vet does not agree with feeding him raw, but his homeopathic vet sure does! :razz:
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