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Emma n Renco
8th January 2008, 10:01 AM
Hi,

How bad is this timing - Bella is booked in to be spayed next week and yesterday she came into heat! The vet won't do it while she's in heat so we have to wait and keep Harvey under control. Oh dear... how long does heat last? We haven't had a female dog before...

sallymum
8th January 2008, 10:46 AM
I think they bleed for about a week or so, the danger time i have heard is the 3 weeks after the bleeding stops. Though i think they can get pregnant while there bleeding as well. There will be more members on the board who will know better than me. Good luck:xfngr:

lady and amber
8th January 2008, 11:30 AM
My two bleed for over two weeks,
but its not safe for you too leave them together at all when she is in season it last for about 3 weeks, someone who keeps both dogs and bitches might be able to give you more advise on how to cope with this.

Emma n Renco
8th January 2008, 11:56 AM
Just called the vet and she said she can't be operated on now for 100 days after the bleeding stops. Is that really true or should we go to another vet - nightmare!!

Bruce H
8th January 2008, 12:16 PM
Rule #1 thru #10: Keep them separated. All the time. The drive to reproduce is unbelievably strong; they will work together to get together! Don't rely on belly bands, the underware on the girl, etc.

When we have a girl in season, the boys and girls are kept completely separated and are never together; when the girls are in the house, the boys are crated and vice-versa. Everyone takes their turn in their crates. You also will want to watch Harvey for marking, although if he is the only male in the house, he may not. Do you have a breeder who can give you advice on how to take Bella through her season. It's really not as frightening as it may seem.

To be on the safe side, wait for at least 3 weeks from the time you saw spotting before getting her back together with Harvey. And give her a very thorough bath before re-introducing them.

Your vet is right on the money with not doing the spay now and waiting the 100 days after. You have a good vet who is trying to keep the risk as low as it possibly can be.

Emma n Renco
8th January 2008, 12:44 PM
Thanks for the advice Bruce, we aren't sure what we can do really now in this situation due to the small apartment we have and lack of rooms. I will have to look at finding someone to care for one of them but not sure who at this time. I don't know any breeders and we only took her as a companion for Harvey and to get her out of a bad situation, we weren't financially able to get her spayed last month and as soon as we were and booked the appointment this happened. dear oh dear... thanks again for the posts..

Karlin
8th January 2008, 01:13 PM
Oh that is frustrating! I gave you a contact for a Dutch breeder back when you were first helping her, who was happy to be of help and offer advice... maybe give this breeder a call?

Once her season is over it doesn't really matter that you will wait 100 days -- she won't come back into season for 6 months or so. The reason the vet wants to wait is that it takes that long for her hormones to get back into balance and return to normal. Dogs don't have periods like humans where the body only prepares for pregnancy -- a heat for a dog is a full blown hormonal surge of pregnancy and their body goes right through the whole cycle regardless of whether they are pregnant or not (hence they also can be tripped into 'false pregnancies'.

It's one of the reasons for spaying if you are not breeding :thmbsup: -- imagine passing through a many-month 'heat' and post-heat period annually that mimics pregnancy. :eek: That one week of heightened hormones and physical and emotional repurcussions many women feel is 4 weeks long in a dog then goes into a long post heat tapering off that takes that 100 days to end. That regular flush of hormones is what increases an unspayed female cavalier's chances of mammary cancer to one in four.

I have spayed mid-cycle in situations where I have had little choice and while not ideal it can be done. However you would still need to keep the two separated as she will smell as if she is in heat -- so for you this isn't really an option. There is a slightly higher risk of such spays but I've never had any problems.

Bruce H
8th January 2008, 01:16 PM
If you can find someone to take one or the other, that probably would be best.

If not, can you put their crates in a bathroom (even stacked on top of each other) so while one is out, the other is crated in the bathroom behind a door? Do they each have a crate of their own? If not, maybe you could borrow a crate(s) from someone until this is over. Don't try to use 1 crate for both of them and alternate; it'll drive them both crazy smelling each other in the crate.

This is certainly going to be inconvenient, but it is only for 3 weeks or so. I know you can make it through this. PM me with any questions and I'll help as much as I can.

Emma n Renco
8th January 2008, 01:30 PM
Karlin thanks for that reminder - so much being going on here planning weddings and house move in 2 months and taking on Bella my head's like a sieve! Will give her a call..

and thanks Bruce, not sure what has happened to her but she's traumatised by a crate and won't even walk near Harveys. Tried her in the x pen once and she was so distressed she pushed it the whole way across the room crying.

She just sleeps on a bed outside Harvey's crate which works fine. Thinking of the x pen, Harvey could stay in there to keep them apart when we're home, he won't be happy but heh! She's 6 years old or there abouts had lots of litters - don't suppose the memory of the pain and hard work of motherhood would have made the reproductive urges wear off over time :-)

CavyMom
8th January 2008, 03:14 PM
Good luck, it sounds like you're on the right track, if there's anyone else in your home, make sure they understand how important it is to keep them entirely seperate. That is the one thing I really DON'T like about showing my dogs!!! I hate dealing with a girl in heat, I have a fairly small house, so even in seperate rooms the boys can smell the girl in heat, so my boys always get anxious and drop weight, and the girl will dig at the door of the room I put the boys in to keep them seperate because they want their boyfriend!

Is there a room where you can close a door to isolate your boy, or a top for your pen? Just because he's never climbed it before, don't assume he won't! I've heard of quite a few "oops" litters because someone assumed their normally well behaved boy wouldn't climb a pen or fence, and suddenly he did when the girl was in heat resulting in her getting pregnant.

As for spaying, I usually like to follow the advice of 3 - 3 1/2 months after a heat cycle before spaying them, but that's really a personal preference, the reason someone already mentioned - Weither or not a dog is bred, their body goes through the same cycle after heat.

Prov31
8th January 2008, 06:24 PM
It sounds like you've gotten some good advice so far. I'm probably out of the loop here--but it does take two to "tango". Is there a reason that Harvey isn't getting the "snip" to solve the problem? That would definitely prevent pregnancies now and in the future. Good luck!

ppotterfield
8th January 2008, 07:10 PM
It sounds like you've gotten some good advice so far. I'm probably out of the loop here--but it does take two to "tango". Is there a reason that Harvey isn't getting the "snip" to solve the problem? That would definitely prevent pregnancies now and in the future. Good luck!

This does seem like a good solution to the problem. If I remember Harvey should be over a year old now and it would probably be a good time to get him fixed. You can then save up and in 100 days have Bella done. :thmbsup:

Emma n Renco
8th January 2008, 09:35 PM
Yup and that is my logical thought as well - in fact Harvey is a year old next week and was booked in for the operation but Renco was very unsure about having him done before we booked the appointment. After reading all of the literature given by the vet, hearing the vets opinion and reading all the different views from board members on here about the possible negatives of having Harvey 'done' he really didn't want to go ahead with the op. I know there are arguments for and against but the main factor is that Bella deserves the op to give her body a rest from the over breeding, and is our main priority to be spayed.

As we came to the decision (right or wrong) before Bella came into heat we are going to stick by it and are just going to have to work this frustrating situation out. After ringing around we thankfully have a volunteer fur baby sitter willing to take Harvey if needed for a while which we will take advantage of next week.

Thanks for all of your posts about this all advice has been gratefully received... xx