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View Full Version : Is corn in dog food bad for dogs?



Karlin
23rd February 2009, 11:15 PM
Not according to the always-interesting Terrierman blog (http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/02/you-make-iditarod-winner-with-good-dog.html).

Makes for some thoughtful and challenging reading that some won't want to hear.

I've written before that chicken and dairy products are among the ingredients most likely to cause allergies yet people always focus on grains (and lots of food-obsessed people who won;t go near grain in a dog food add yoghurt or cheese -- yet this is just about as likely to be the cause of an allergic reaction as a grain!). In reality very few dogs have allergies. And I think that as has been proven in children, what adults take to be allergies are not allergies at all.

I wouldn't agree about feeding a supermarket food, just because I think they are actually very poor value for the ingredients (they may seem cheaper but if you buy the large bags of a quality food they work out the same or the quality food can even be cheaper...) and there's so much filler, colourings etc -- but I sure don't care about grains and neither do any of my dogs or cats, or any other dog or cat that I have owned...

Karlin
23rd February 2009, 11:25 PM
And then follow up that post with this one (http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/02/no-evidence-and-dog-food-is-better-than.html).


"There's no scientific evidence that any food is better than the next," says Joseph Wakshlag, D.V.M., Ph.D., an assistant professor of clinical nutrition at the Cornell University College of Veterinary Medicine.

Consumer Reports goes on to note that most of the dog food debate is steeped in meaningless blarney and that "For pet food, there's no official definition of organic, human-grade, premium, no fillers, or gourmet."

...

Finally, while the vet experts had not seen dogs or cats made sick by cheap commercial dog food, half had seen pets become ill from eating homemade pet food, due to contamination, spoilage, and the failure to serve dogs a balanced diet.


Which goes back to a point I try to make when people ask about feeding raw or homemade foods.

Do your research, do NOT take anything you read on the internet as fact and truth (including Terrierman -- I posted these to give a different perspective than what tends to be given on a lot of dog boards and lists.... :) ), be cautious about food discussion lists and advice given there, handle ingredients with the same care you would if you were making your own dinner, and be especially careful handling raw food or diets.



I like feeding a mix of things including commercial dry food, myself. :)

WoodHaven
23rd February 2009, 11:45 PM
Processed dog foods here in the US were making dogs sick. The addition of Melamine (from China) as a protein booster has made many of us scared. Hundreds of dogs died from Kidney issues.

If you had a performance dog or a whelping bitch-- the addition of grains can help the animal gain (or maintain) weight. Guess what they feed cows to fatten them up??- Corn. Guess what they sometimes add to that to make it palatable- sugar. Kinda reminds me of a kids sugared breakfast cereal-- not something I'd want my dogs to eat (at least not all the time). jmo

kmatt
23rd February 2009, 11:55 PM
I either feed Teddy Fresh food. lightly cooked protein, some raw veggies, little bit of fruit and a dollop of cottage cheese.

That Royal Canin Half Mimi Dental Hygiene 24 & Mini Adult 27

http://www.royalcanin.us/products/default.aspx

Teddy loves it, though I don't really know any good treats to give him. He is a great little boy, but I haven't found anything that is small and I can give him often.

Melissa
24th February 2009, 12:27 AM
It's always interesting to see other's points of view. I have spent nearly a year finding a food that didn't make Maverick itch, I'm happy I finally did.

frecklesmom
24th February 2009, 12:39 AM
I have a friend who lives on acreage with various animals and among them is an eleven year old lab-Sam. Sam delights in all the corn that grows around his place and in the summer gets a bit stout. He went to the Vet a few weeks ago, she pronounced him in excellent health and thought his teeth could equal a yr.old dog. He's been supplementing his diet with corn for years-an Iowa "boy".

chloe92us
24th February 2009, 01:12 AM
Interesting article. My perspective is most dog foods sold in grocery stores ARE nutritionally acceptable. However, I want the BEST for my dogs, and it comes not from Purina or Pedigree. I notice a huge difference in coat & poop quality when I feed the premium foods. And, let's face it, we're all dog snobs. :D

brotymo
24th February 2009, 01:13 AM
I have more concerns about the additives, dyes and contaminants in food. With dog's lifespans being so condensed, cancer causing ingredients or additives are more of an issue with dogs, the same as how environmental contaminants have more of an impact on dogs than humans. Additionally, Kaya itched herself raw (hundreds a year in vet bills) until I took her off grain. I must say, I think for her it made a massive difference.

I avoid the dies and preservatives as much as possible. I did find when I fed a food that was corn based I had to feed quite a bit more than I do now. I used to feed 80 lbs of dog food a month, but now keep the dogs in perfectly good condition on 50-60 lbs of grain free food and I pick up WAY less poop in the yard.

Trucav
24th February 2009, 10:10 AM
I am not a big lover of any processed dog foods.Knew someone that worked in a dog food manufacturing plant,he said to me if you could see what went into dog food you would not ever feed it again.

I feed fresh Tripe and Wholemeal biscuit,have always fed it ever sice I have had Cavvies.My eldest is now 13 years young and is in good health,slim and fit,only a couple of upset tummies in her life and NEVER any skin complaints.I don't use any supplement either,animals in the wild do not have access to Holland & Barrett or Dorwest Herbs !!!!!! I would certainly never put supplements on Complete dried food,that is just overload.Puppies get extras,scrambled eggs and chicken & rice and yes puppy complete,I do use Royal Canin,because it smells good and I think dogs eat by smell.Hence the love of Tripe!!!!All my dogs look great,bright eyes,wet black noses and lovely shiny coats.

Feeding this regime I have never had any skin problems,irriation or coat loss etc.All dogs get upset tummies,so do mine,I just starve them for 24 hours and then back to normal.

This is my way,not necessarily the RIGHT way.Feed what you are happy with and don't keep changing the food,because somebody recommends another product,usally does more harm than good.

Mindysmom
24th February 2009, 12:36 PM
I do believe that the grocery store food is nutritionally acceptable. It is going to meet the AAFCO standards. I don't think it's the best though. I've never fed a corn based diet to my dogs but I don't think corn is "bad". I think there are better quality ingredients. Our retriever was always more sensitive to food than Mindy. He would get hot spots if I tried to change his food too much. We always have fed a high quality food. I know some industry people so I do feel comfortable with certain companies. Right now both my dogs are eating grain free. I switched Max back to it after he was itching on food I put him on. I don't think it's an allergy as both foods are chicken based but it might have more fat in it that helps his skin this time of year. I'll try switching back in the spring as I'm leery about the high protein level. I switched Mindy as well just to see if it made a difference to her. The last two weeks at agility the trainer has watched her and just said "WOW". Not sure if it's because she is liking the apparatus we are doing right now or if it's food related.

WoodHaven
24th February 2009, 04:50 PM
I am not a big lover of any processed dog foods.Knew someone that worked in a dog food manufacturing plant,he said to me if you could see what went into dog food you would not ever feed it again.

I feed fresh Tripe and Wholemeal biscuit,have always fed it ever sice I have had Cavvies.My eldest is now 13 years young and is in good health,slim and fit,only a couple of upset tummies in her life and NEVER any skin complaints.I don't use any supplement either,animals in the wild do not have access to Holland & Barrett or Dorwest Herbs !!!!!! I would certainly never put supplements on Complete dried food,that is just overload.Puppies get extras,scrambled eggs and chicken & rice and yes puppy complete,I do use Royal Canin,because it smells good and I think dogs eat by smell.Hence the love of Tripe!!!!All my dogs look great,bright eyes,wet black noses and lovely shiny coats.

Feeding this regime I have never had any skin problems,irriation or coat loss etc.All dogs get upset tummies,so do mine,I just starve them for 24 hours and then back to normal.

This is my way,not necessarily the RIGHT way.Feed what you are happy with and don't keep changing the food,because somebody recommends another product,usally does more harm than good.

Giggle-- As someone who has handled fresh green tripe-- I found the statement "if you could see what went into dog food you would not ever feed it again" very humorous. Don't handle green tripe if you have a low gag reflex. But yes, we have tripe with our dinners-- it is full of enzymes and all the dogs love it.

petcrazyme
24th February 2009, 05:34 PM
I bought a can of BG Tripe for my cav. She enjoyed it but I don't know if I can buy it again ...the smell was enough to make me gag. Is it always this smelly?

WoodHaven
24th February 2009, 05:43 PM
I bought a can of BG Tripe for my cav. She enjoyed it but I don't know if I can buy it again ...the smell was enough to make me gag. Is it always this smelly?

Green tripe is always stinky. The stuff you can get at a market is bleached and not as healthy.

arasara
24th February 2009, 06:07 PM
I have a can of BG tripe in the dog cupboard. I've had it there for about a month and still haven't found the courage to open it yet :lol:

Faith was on canned nutro natural choice chicken & rice which was recalled last year and I really got "dog food scared" and am extremely picky when it comes to foods now.

As for corn, Avi fed Kosmo about 1/4 ear of corn off the cob when he was younger and I seen what it did to him :eek: . . . needless to say we try to avoid corn :lol:

I try to find foods with one or two manufacturing facilities (I know it's difficult but it's a necessary evil to me after what happened with the recall) and with a fairly simple ingredient list that I can pretty easily pronounce as well as ethoxyquin free.

Karlin
24th February 2009, 06:49 PM
With dog's lifespans being so condensed, cancer causing ingredients or additives are more of an issue with dogs, the same as how environmental contaminants have more of an impact on dogs than humans.

Actually it should be the opposite -- given that dogs have a much shorter lifespan, and given that it still takes time for any health condition to develop that is progressive, certain problems are less likely to develop to the stage where they compromise the animal's life. Likewise this is true for drugs not being a risk, that might be a risk to humans over a longer lifespan. This is true of one of the drugs given for SM for example -- a dog doesn't live long enough for some problems to arise as it won't be on the drug long enough over a typical lifespan.

Melamine is a tough one -- but affected many quality foods as well as inexpensive ones. A fresh diet is a great choice of people make sure they are feeding a complete diet. Some of the 'advice' out on the web is just plain wrong though and I'd never trust just someone's opinion on a good diet as posted to a list or board. Research!

To be honest on the broader issue of quality of foods -- I have never seen much difference in coat quality or health due to type of diet. Some of the longest lived cavaliers I have encountered are neighbour dogs that have had supermarket food all their lives. Our pet animals when I was a kid all were fed supermarket foods (and not the better quality ones either back then!!). All looked great, had wonderful teeth, and in the case of our giant breed, lived to an ancient age for a Pyrenees (13-14).

However, I prefer to feed a better quality food for many reasons -- the same reason I don't like eating junk foods much myself or overly processed foods and avoid colourants and preservatives. :) But supermarket AAFCO foods are nutritionally complete and certainly would be a better choice than giving an incomplete fresh diet due to lack of knowledge about canine nutrition or unknowingly feeding foods that are actually a health risk (eg grapes, raisons, chocolate covered items etc).

Karlin
24th February 2009, 06:51 PM
With dog's lifespans being so condensed, cancer causing ingredients or additives are more of an issue with dogs, the same as how environmental contaminants have more of an impact on dogs than humans.

Actually it should be the opposite -- given that dogs have a much shorter lifespan, and given that it still takes time for any health condition to develop that is progressive, certain problems are less likely to develop to the stage where they compromise the animal's life. Likewise this is true for drugs not being a risk, that might be a risk to humans over a longer lifespan. This is true of one of the drugs given for SM for example -- a dog doesn't live long enough for some problems to arise as it won't be on the drug long enough over a typical lifespan.

Melamine is a tough one -- but affected many quality foods as well as inexpensive ones. :eek:

A fresh diet is a great choice if people make sure they are feeding a complete diet. Some of the 'advice' out on the web is just plain wrong though and I'd never trust just someone's opinion on a good diet as posted to a list or board. Research!

To be honest on the broader issue of quality of foods -- I have never seen much difference in coat quality or health due to type of diet. Some of the longest lived cavaliers I have encountered are neighbour dogs that have had supermarket food all their lives. Our pet animals when I was a kid all were fed supermarket foods (and not the better quality ones either back then!!). All looked great, had wonderful teeth, and in the case of our giant breed, lived to an ancient age for a Pyrenees (13-14).

However, I prefer to feed a better quality food for many reasons -- the same reason I don't like eating junk foods much myself or overly processed foods and avoid colourants and preservatives. :) But supermarket AAFCO foods are nutritionally complete and certainly would be a better choice than giving an incomplete fresh diet due to lack of knowledge about canine nutrition or unknowingly feeding foods that are actually a health risk (eg grapes, raisons, chocolate covered items etc).

brotymo
24th February 2009, 07:49 PM
Actually it should be the opposite -- given that dogs have a much shorter lifespan, and given that it still takes time for any health condition to develop that is progressive, certain problems are less likely to develop to the stage where they compromise the animal's life. Likewise this is true for drugs not being a risk, that might be a risk to humans over a longer lifespan. This is true of one of the drugs given for SM for example -- a dog doesn't live long enough for some problems to arise as it won't be on the drug long enough over a typical lifespan.




While logic would seem to make this true, I had said what I said based on research I encountered a couple months ago that seems to say the opposite.
The whole article is here:
http://www.ewg.org/files/dogfency_0902.pdf

The article said "dogs are even more vulnerable than people. Because they have compressed lifespans...experts say they develop health problems from chemical exposures more rapidly than people."
It also quotes the Perdue Univ. Dept. of Veterinary Pathobiology as revealing that "cancer is the second leading cause of death in dogs."

Here is the study that, I believe even the Dog Fancy Article is getting their facts from: http://www.ewg.org/reports/pets

In this extensive study, here were alarming findings:

...with their compressed lifespans, developing and aging seven or more times faster than children, pets also develop health problems from exposures much more rapidly.
For dogs, blood and urine samples were contaminated with 35 chemicals altogether, including 11 carcinogens, 31 chemicals toxic to the reproductive system, and 24 neurotoxins. The carcinogens are of particular concern, since dogs have much higher rates of many kinds of cancer than do people, including 35 times more skin cancer, 4 times more breast tumors, 8 times more bone cancer, and twice the incidence of leukemia, according to the Texas A&M Veterinary Medical Center Between 20 and 25 percent of dogs die of cancer, making it the second leading cause of death in dogs (Purdue University Department of Veterinary Pathobiology 2000).

There is a great deal of info in there and some informative tips on helping reduce your pet's exposure to many environmental chemicals which seems to be making at least as much of an impact, if not moreso that what we feed them.

Trucav
24th February 2009, 08:31 PM
Surely anything that comes out of a can or a packet is Processed.

So where does fresh food fall down on Canine nutrition? It's what dogs should eat,natural food.Not little brown pellets,which in alot of cases cause many of the food allergies that are posted on this forum