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Harley1
24th February 2009, 01:32 PM
:confused: Hey all,

My 1yr old cav is doing something pretty weird, I think. I get up for work at 5am, Harley gets up with me, potties, eats a bite, and then gets back in bed with hubby when I am ready to leave. By the way, he sleeps with us every night. Anyways, when I go over to kiss him goodbye, if I touch around his rib area like I am going to pick him up, he growls at me, or if I even stare at him for a few seconds like I am going to take him he growls. Well, i guess I could say anywhere past the neck area he growls. It's like he doesn't want me to take him from bed but he only does it right before I leave. He is just fine up to that point. AND my hubby comes home from work around 11pm and comes in to take him out or to spend some time with him, he growls at him to if he doesn't want to go. Now whoever is in bed with him can touch him but not the person out of bed. LOL Last week, I even pushed it too far I guess cause he nipped at me and bit my lip. I even cried cause it hurt my feelings......that's awful, huh? Isn't this odd behavior and does anyone have any suggestions??????

brotymo
24th February 2009, 01:50 PM
Hi Christy,
You do have what sounds like a worrying problem here. I am not a behaviorist, but I'd be thinking for starters he needs to come out of your bed and be given his own bed or crate for bedtime. Somewhere that he is left alone when he is there. A crate is probably better for that. You don't mention any other place this is a problem. He might be just fine with his own bed, or better yet crate, and that space is his sanctuary. He isn't bothered when he is in there at all. I imagine Karlin will weigh in on this as she has much more experience and many good places to refer you for help.

Good luck

harleyfarley
24th February 2009, 02:08 PM
Sounds like he is top dog and staying put, sounds nasty but i would crate him if necessary so he knows that bed is yours not his, which is hard cos the poor mite doesnt have one of his own.

arasara
24th February 2009, 02:22 PM
I agree that he thinks he's top dog in this situation. . . I've actually had some trouble with Faith growling at me before (and even sometimes still although it barely ever happens now) and she gets put in time out for stuff like that. We still have to "work" at things and I suspect we will forever. If she's chewing on something we play "trade" a lot, I make her wait until I go in the door first, etc. If either Kosmo or Faith had nipped at me I would have taken them out of the bed and put them in a time out right away.

Has Harley taken dog training classes? They might be helpful in establishing dominance - in addition, if he's nipped at you I might consider consulting a behavioral therapist.

Good luck :flwr:

Harley1
24th February 2009, 03:27 PM
Sounds like he is top dog and staying put, sounds nasty but i would crate him if necessary so he knows that bed is yours not his, which is hard cos the poor mite doesnt have one of his own.
LOL, he does have a crate that he goes in while we are gone and goes in wtih no problems. He has always slept with us at my choice. He's a great lil cuddle buddy! LOL I can't imagine not having him sleep with us. If I were to give him a time out for something like this, where would that be? He will also do it sometimes if I am on the couch with him cuddling and someone tries to take him from me or whoever has him.....it's not just the bed but happens more often there....

Harley1
24th February 2009, 03:45 PM
I agree that he thinks he's top dog in this situation. . . I've actually had some trouble with Faith growling at me before (and even sometimes still although it barely ever happens now) and she gets put in time out for stuff like that. We still have to "work" at things and I suspect we will forever. If she's chewing on something we play "trade" a lot, I make her wait until I go in the door first, etc. If either Kosmo or Faith had nipped at me I would have taken them out of the bed and put them in a time out right away.

Has Harley taken dog training classes? They might be helpful in establishing dominance - in addition, if he's nipped at you I might consider consulting a behavioral therapist.

Good luck :flwr:
Where would I put him on a time-out??

arasara
24th February 2009, 04:36 PM
For us, (and everybody has their different places) we put her in the powder room (it's a small bathroom with only a sink and a toilet) for a couple of minutes. When we had the play pen up here we put her in that and when we had the crate we put her in that - Some people have issues with the crate because they've worked so hard at associating the crate with being a good place that now it's a "bad place" but we didn't have a problem.

I think for each person it's individual, but this is the method that works for us. I am no dog trainer by any means, but Faith knows what a time out is and I think recognizes my tone of voice when I put her there. She's gotten the same treatment consistently in time outs since she was a puppy and was biting pant legs, hurting Kosmo, etc., so that may be why it works for us too. . ;)

Harley1
24th February 2009, 04:51 PM
For us, (and everybody has their different places) we put her in the powder room (it's a small bathroom with only a sink and a toilet) for a couple of minutes. When we had the play pen up here we put her in that and when we had the crate we put her in that - Some people have issues with the crate because they've worked so hard at associating the crate with being a good place that now it's a "bad place" but we didn't have a problem.

I think for each person it's individual, but this is the method that works for us. I am no dog trainer by any means, but Faith knows what a time out is and I think recognizes my tone of voice when I put her there. She's gotten the same treatment consistently in time outs since she was a puppy and was biting pant legs, hurting Kosmo, etc., so that may be why it works for us too. . ;)
I will have to try that. Maybe just separating him from the other two dogs will be enough punishment for him to know he's done something wrong. Thanks for your input.....I hope it works.....LOL

chloe92us
24th February 2009, 04:57 PM
I can imagine how hurt you must be- I don't know what I would do if one of mine bit me! I think by allowing him to stay on the bed you are just telling him that if he acts like that, he gets his way. It is reinforcing his bad behavior. I AM NO TRAINER...but what I would do is...put on gloves (to protect yourself!) and every morning go in with a treat in your hand and pick him up. If he tries to bite you, or growls, put him in the bathroom for a timeout. If he lets you pick him up without a word or a nip, give him a treat and place him back on the bed. Repeat the same exercise when he's on the sofa, or at other times when he tends to act out.

I would honestly call in a trainer or behaviorist for suggestions as this could get out of hand. If you haven't done obedience training yet, enroll today. That will help him to see you as a leader. "Nipping" (a nice word for biting) is completely unacceptable and you need to get it under control asap.

Please keep us updated.

Mindysmom
24th February 2009, 05:40 PM
One of the things I might try is giving him some warning when someone is going to pick him up from one of his favourite spots. One of my human kids didn't do transitions well so I used to say "in five minutes - you need to pick up your toys", "in four minutes" etc. I'm not sure how you would translate that into "dog" but maybe if you always had the same routine - tell him it's time to move, act the same way each time - and move him. It does seem like you might have to have him sleep in his crate at least for awhile.

The other thing I try not to do is pick up my dogs if they can move themselves. I do lift Max off the bed (he gets to come in for a morning cuddle but sleeps in his crate) because it's high and I don't want him jumping off. I would prefer to lift Mindy off but she'll have none of it and jumps off herself whenever I make a move to pick her up. If they are cuddling me on the couch I wouldn't have someone else come and pick them up - I'd let them call them and let the dog make the choice whether to stay or go. If I thought it was important that they go with someone else I'd get up myself and be the one to end the cuddle session.

LucyDog
24th February 2009, 05:57 PM
This sounds like a very serious problem and I would imagine the only way to stop it would be to not allow him on the bed for awhile at least. I really think you need to consult w/ a dog trainer that uses positive methods of course. But, I think it is something that you shouldn't allow to continue any longer. A dog that bites can very quickly end up having to be put to sleep if they bite a child or someone visiting your home. Please get some professional help with this ASAP!

brotymo
24th February 2009, 06:21 PM
I was thinking more about your situation, (probably because mine sleep with me and I hope I don't ever deal with this situation! They are both still young) and I think in addition to taking back your bed (at least for a while) and kicking him out of it, you might benefit from the types of training that rewards him for deferring to you. Do "take it/leave it" and "drop it" type training with nice positive rewards. Make him wait to eat, until you release him, and make him surrender his bowl, then reward him and let him have it back. I think the more little things you do to reinforce your position as boss and reward him for not resisting you, the better he will accept having to do things that he would rather not. Plus, lots of basic obedience work with rewards. All these things bring you closer to your dog and reinforce your ability to be in control.

Good luck!

SamT
25th February 2009, 09:33 PM
Our dog Sam does this. If he is on his sofa or in his bed and its time to go potty before we all settle down for the night he will growl at you when you go to life him, its his way of saying dont you dare move me Im comfortable. You have to show him who is boss and just pick him up. Sam used to snap but never made contact, we would always say no when he does this and make him get off the sofa and out the door. If you let the growling/snapping continue it will just get worse and he may become aggressive. Sam growls less now because he knows if he growls he gets put outside and if he doesnt he gets put outside before bed or in the morning.

Our other dog Charlie snapped at me one night over his toy kong, well he robbed Sams and I tried to take it off him. I got such a fright because he really went for me but we gave out to him and dont give them the kongs anymore.

You have to show them whos boss, you can discipline a dog and give affection just not at the same time. Our two are very happy dogs and well looked after however they know their limits and they know by my tone when they are being bold!

I would not be worried about your dog biting someone if you start to discipline him now. Sam will growl if our 9 year old disturbs him but he has never snapped at him and since we disciplined him as a puppy he does not snap at us anymore. Plus we have told Matt not to disturb the pups when they are sleeping. Unfortunately some dogs do not like being disturbed when they are comfortable and they growl and snap if they think it will stop you from trying to move them. The best thing you can do is move them even if they growl and if they snap to say NO and put them in time out either outside or in their bed. Our two know when they are in trouble and will get into their bed and look out at you but we just ignore them and if they get out of the bed we say "get into your bed" and they run back into it!!

Harley1
26th February 2009, 11:29 AM
Thanks for everybody's ideas, I will try them and see if I can get ahold of this NOW before it's too late. He did it to me this morning too or I should say he WANTED to but I just didn't push it and left him alone. I wasn't trying to get him to do anything just give him lovins before I left for work but that wasn't happening. Thanks again to everyone.......:paw:

harleyfarley
26th February 2009, 12:00 PM
hmmm he won again Christy, id make a point to making him get off the bed an dlet him know that behaviour is not tollerated. di

merlinsmum
26th February 2009, 12:32 PM
Thanks for everybody's ideas, I will try them and see if I can get ahold of this NOW before it's too late. He did it to me this morning too or I should say he WANTED to but I just didn't push it and left him alone. I wasn't trying to get him to do anything just give him lovins before I left for work but that wasn't happening. Thanks again to everyone.......:paw:

Hi there,

In this situation, if you know he will growl - don't leave it - don't lift him in case he bites but ask him firmly to get off the bed and reward him for doing so - as I think SamT has said, somedogs don't like being picked up esp if they are comfortable. - so reward him for getting of the bed when you ask - he will soon learn that you are the top dog as it IS YOUR bed and not his....

Ruth M
26th February 2009, 12:44 PM
Hi Christy - can Harley safely get on and off the bed himself? Tilly loves our bed - but I dont lift her off anymore I just point and say 'off' with authority. I use the 'broken record' system - just repeat it with more authority and larger gesture - and she will jump down (sometimes quicker than others) and gets a reward. I know they're supposed to respond very quickly - but if I persevere with a verbal comand and don't back down Tilly eventually responds and is then delighted by my tone of voice! It may be worth going back to basics with a clicker and treat so that he really understands the command.
With Tilly (has SM) I find it always better not to carry her etc - just 'encourage' her to move - and whatever triggers nipping (maybe the picking up) I would stop straight away and look into getting some expert help. Oh the joys of adolescent dogs! Good luck - Ruth x