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frecklesmom
22nd April 2009, 09:46 PM
2 weeks ago, I took Dazzle and Freckles in to have titers drawn for Distemper and Parvo. Dazzle had not had, except for rabies, any immunizations since she was a puppy and now she is 4 yrs old. Freckles was due for his 3 yr vaccinations.
The Titers came back and I am so delighted with the results. Both dogs are equally protected against Distemper/Parvo and need no vaccinations.
I was so pleased that I emailed Dr.Schultz at Wisconsin U (he and Dr.Dowd have long worked on vaccination protocols and are now working with the Rabies Challenge) and thanked him for all he's done.
Dr. Schultz emailed me back this am-how nice- told me the dogs were well protected and that I didn't need to titer again for 3 years-yaa! I hadn't asked about the retitering but figure it must be a FAQ. He gave me some great numbers to look at in titering-what a nice response. :)

Cathy T
22nd April 2009, 10:25 PM
That is great news!! Dr. Schultz was featured in an excellent article in Whole Dog Journal a while back. It was a really well written piece that explained in plain english what vaccines and titers are all about. Neither of my dogs are vaccinated anymore. We had titers done this year and I am satisfied they have sufficient immunity. One thing I try to explain to people is that I am not against vaccinating. I am against "boostering" the vaccines they have already received.

Dr. Dodds is another amazing human being. I had written to her about an issue I was having with elevated liver enzymes. She returned my e-mail promptly with some guidance and advice.

Let's pray the rabies challenge receives the funding it needs so that the rabies vaccination protocol finally receives a makeover....long overdue in my opinion. A 3 year span is fine and dandy but I sure would love to see a 7 year!!

cy1266
23rd April 2009, 05:56 PM
Dr. Schultz emailed me back this am-how nice- told me the dogs were well protected and that I didn't need to titer again for 3 years-yaa! I hadn't asked about the retitering but figure it must be a FAQ.


I was wondering myself how often to have the titer tests. Miles had his parvo and distemper vaccine in July/August 2007. He had the titer test in August 2008 for both and was protected.

Truman had his parvo and distemper vaccine in March 2008. He has not had a titer test yet, I was planning on bringing both of them in for the test this month. I know Truman needs the titer test, but what about Miles? Are you saying that Dr. Schultz said that they only need to be titered every 3 years? I wonder what his opinion is on the rabies vaccine?


Neither of my dogs are vaccinated anymore. We had titers done this year and I am satisfied they have sufficient immunity. One thing I try to explain to people is that I am not against vaccinating. I am against "boostering" the vaccines they have already received.

Cathy T, when were yours given the rabies vaccine? Were they just given one as puppies and they haven't had any more since? Miles and Truman both had theirs around 9 months old (Miles had his 08/07 and Truman had his 08/08), and they were given "1 year" vaccines. I'm not sure what the difference between the 1 and 3 year vaccine is :confused: I just talked to my vet and she said that the first vaccine is always a 1 year. So now I'm not sure whether to give them one more now or wait. Are yours still titered annually for parvo and distemper, or only every few years?

***I'm not asking for medical advice, just what other people are doing that aren't following the "typical" vaccine schedule*** :)

:thnku:

frecklesmom
23rd April 2009, 07:05 PM
This was facts part of my email to Dr. Schultz

Thought I would send on these titers by U of Michigan. Dogs are CKCS.
1) currently 4 yr old female purchased as failed breeder from reputable breeder in Minnesota. Vaccines received prior to my ownership-vaccines as puppy.
3/31/09 Canine Parvovirus HI Titer 160 serum
Canine Distemper Virus VN Titer 128 serum

Canine Parvovirus HI Titer-CPV antibody titer of 80 or higher is considered protective
Canine Distemper Virus VN Titer: A CDV antibody titer of 32 or higher considered protective

2) Prob.5-6 yr old male (puppy mill rescue) Received distemper/parvo vaccine 3 yr ago when rescued
3/31/09 His numbers are exactly the same as #1 exception is
Canine Distemper Virus VN Titer 32 serum
and this was his email back to me:

Pat,
]The antibody titers on both of your dogs are excellent (protective). If you send these same samples in the future (not more often than every 3 years), you need not be concerned about the titers for CPV-2 unless they fall to 20 or lower and don't worry about CDV unless it falls to 4 or lower.
R.D. Schultz
Since he and Dr.Dowds are heading the Rabies Challenge I would speculate they both feel that repetitive Rabies Vaccines are unnecessary. I, myself, did titer one dog for Rabies titer at 3 yr post vaccine (supposed to be getting the 3 yr vaccine again at that time) and the Titer came back with good protection so no vaccine given. State law here is Rabies Vaccine every 3 years.
This is definitely, at this time, a process you have to work through for yourself. Boarding kennels, obedience classes,etc. require up-to-date vaccinations and you have to work through it with them if they will accept titers. Groomer here states she accepts notation from Vet that dog has protection. Groomer also said she has new dogs that have come from California that have titer papers.
My Vet had never titered a dog re:vaccinations and so I needed to be educational, patient and enthusiastic about the titering. I'm sure they grumble when I leave-tough.Vets have "grown up" with vaccinating often and change is not always easy esp. coming on the heels of changing 1 yr vaccines to 3 yr vaccines. Although this is better for our pets it's hard on their cashflow.
An article I just reread http://www.vaclib.org/pdf/vaxscience-in-dogs.pdf is interesting and informative.
At this time, you have to go with your convictions. I believe , at some time, there will probably be a challenge at the State laws re:rabies by someone who has titered.

frecklesmom
23rd April 2009, 07:15 PM
First,excuse me for continually mangling Dr.Jean Dodds name :rolleyes:
The one year Rabies vaccine is composed of the same ingredients as the 3 yr vaccine. Somewhere, over the years, the vaccines have been interpreted as 2 different "strengths".

cy1266
23rd April 2009, 07:44 PM
The one year Rabies vaccine is composed of the same ingredients as the 3 yr vaccine. Somewhere, over the years, the vaccines have been interpreted as 2 different "strengths".


Pat,
That's what I thought! I asked the vet's office what the difference was (besides price, of course) and they couldn't tell me :rolleyes:. Interesting.

Thank you for sharing your correspondence with Dr. Schultz. Both vets I use titer but one actually recommends titering every 6 months! That seems excessive to me. I will have Truman titered very soon but I will probably wait at least another year to titer Miles. Did you send your results in somewhere? I wonder if I should do that?

frecklesmom
23rd April 2009, 08:20 PM
There is a Titer testing kit for Vets' and maybe yours has that. Mine sends it to whatever University is doing Titers-usually the closest. University of Michigan did the distemper/parvo-Vet sends it in. University of Kansas did the rabies titer. Dr. Jean Dodds Hemopet does titers and the owner sends the blood/serum-they have instructions on their site.
The cost of each titer ( ex. distemper)was 13.50 at the UofM -total cost of s/h and blood draw+spin down (if necessary) adds to cost. Single vaccine here of (ex.) distemper runs about $13.00. To me I think doing titers every 6 mo is very excessive, what is their thinking on this? I'm surely at the bottom of the learning curve on this but every 6 mo.,holy cow!

Cathy T
24th April 2009, 01:54 AM
To titer every 6 months is crazy....and totally unnecessary.



when were yours given the rabies vaccine? Were they just given one as puppies and they haven't had any more since


I'll have to check my records but both have received rabies vaccines past their intital puppy vaccines.



I'm not sure what the difference between the 1 and 3 year vaccine


No difference. It all has to do with what the label on the vaccine says but that's all. Also, a Great Dane will get the same amount of vaccine as a chihuahua :eek:

My vet has gotten really awesome about accepting my vaccination beliefs. 3 years ago was a different story.

You can have your vet draw the blood and package it for you. And then you can sent it directly to Dr. Dodds. That was what I planned to do the last time I did titers but my vet had a package going to her anyway and just put my samples in the package. Her website hemopet.com has all of the information on it.

luvhavinbgtwins
24th April 2009, 03:17 PM
Do you mind me asking where I can find out what Titers is and info?


I was curiuos about the whole shot thing after the puppy shots...some say you do, do every year some dont...I do want to find out what I can do....Thanks so much.

frecklesmom
24th April 2009, 03:54 PM
Here's a start for reading:

http://ezinearticles.com/?Titer-Testing-Dogs---The-Alternative-to-Over-Vaccinating&id=1652954


http://www.veterinarypracticenews.com/vet-dept/small-animal-dept/titers-join-debate-on-vaccine-frequency.aspx

Everyone comes to their own understanding of this by researching articles available. Dr.Jean Dodds and Dr.Ron Schultz are like minds when it comes to vaccines and duration of vaccines. Google them, google titers,google vaccines.