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Puppy Farms.

B

Bet

Well-known member
I have started this as a new Thread after reading the Article in to-day's Daily Express about Puppy Farming.

What I have just found out from the Kennel Club after phoning them , since they were quoted in the Article, is that the KC cannot refuse to Register Puppies from a Puppy Farm unless there has been a Complaint made to the County Council or the RSPCA and the Puppy Farm referred to, has been Prosecuted ,the KC has to accept the Puppies for Registration.

This is why the KC is telling Prospective Puppy Buyers , only buy from Accredited Breeders, this way the KC has control over how Puppies are being Bred.

The Daily Express Article ,I think will make Puppy Buyers aware of the conditions that the Breeding Stock is kept in.

Never ,ever buy Puppies from an unregistered Pet Shop, at a Car Boot Sale or ON-LINE.

Hopefully this Article will be being read by many who thinking about buying a Puppy ,and as the Kennel Club is pushing for, go to an Accredited Breeder.

Bet
 
An experienced breeder friend who keeps an eye on the KC registrations for Cavaliers would probably reckon that about 50% come from people nobody has ever heard of - and the same people year after year register three or four suspiciously large litters every quarter, which usually means they have bred more litters than that and divide the puppies between the registered litters to stop the KC getting suspicious. But I can see why the KC can't act against them just on hearsay, gossip or suspicion - everyone trying to act against puppy farmers needs evidence, and unfortunately there are a lot of legal restrictions on raiding people's homes. That's where change needs to start.

Kate, Oliver and Aled
 
Puppy Farms

Kate H said:
An experienced breeder friend who keeps an eye on the KC registrations for Cavaliers would probably reckon that about 50% come from people nobody has ever heard of - and the same people year after year register three or four suspiciously large litters every quarter, which usually means they have bred more litters than that and divide the puppies between the registered litters to stop the KC getting suspicious. But I can see why the KC can't act against them just on hearsay, gossip or suspicion - everyone trying to act against puppy farmers needs evidence, and unfortunately there are a lot of legal restrictions on raiding people's homes. That's where change needs to start.

Kate, Oliver and Aled
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About 6 years ago from the Kennel Club Breed Breed Supplement for that year for Cavaliers I was able to ,as far as I was aware to get figures for Litters of Cavalier Registrations .

There were around 700 Litters Registered by Members of Cavalier Clubs.

Around 1,800 Litters ,as far as I was aware from Breeders who were out-with Cavalier Clubs.

Yes ,Kate as you say ,now I can understand the KC's point of View ,that the Puppy Farms must have been prosecuted before the KC can , for Legal reasons ,refuse to Register the Litters of Puppies from Puppy Farms.

The only way forward in this Problem, is to get the Puppy Buying Public aware of the conditions of the Puppy Farms for Dogs and as the KC wants, only buy from Accredited Breeders, over whom the KC has control.

The other hope is for the Puppy Contract to become avaliable, and Puppy Buyers can take the Dog Breeder to Court if their Puppy developes a Hereditary Problem known to a Particular Breed, and the Breeder has not Health Tested for it.

With my mention of the Cavalier Litters I have mentioned ,I do hope that some Cavalier Breeders will not be using this as their usual Excuse for the MVD and SM Problems in Cavaliers ,..

That those Health Problems in Cavaliers are all to do with Cavaliers from Puppy Farms and BYB's.

I can only say again , I can't say about the Cavaliers' SM Problem, but it was Cavalier Breeders from Cavalier Clubs who were warned by Dr.P.Darke, the CKCS CLUB's Cardiologist, 27 years ago about how Wide-Spread and Serious the MVD Problem was in the Cavalier Breed, and that it was CKCS CLUB Members who given MVD Breeding Guidelines from the UK CKCS CLUB in 1987.

Those are the Breeders , that I believe , are to Blame for the Mess the Cavalier Breed is in to-day with their MVD Problem.

If only they had Heeded the Warning from Dr P.Darke,at that time, maybe many Cavaliers would have had the chance of Healthier. Longer Lives.

Even some of To-days Cavalier Breeders are still not following MVD Breeding Guidelines ,as is seen in the KC Breed Supplements, which have been give by the MVD Researchers.

Will They Never Learn!!!

Bet
 
There shouldn't be a two tiered system for KC registration. All KC registered dogs should have the same protection.. .. Am I right in thinking that to be on ABS register you simply have to pay another fee and cm/sm and mvd are only recommended and no minimum standards are set? The ordinary puppy buyer needs much better guidance that given by the KC. The information and advice is deceiving and misleading.
Spetember 19th the KC are holding Pup Aid to help bring awareness to Puppy Farming and raise funds for nominated rescues. Last year the charities never received a penny. All the money was used for, was to pay for the venue while the KC promoted themselves as the great guys. There is another date set for September 19th, Puppy Love themselves are holding an awareness day on this date there only interest is to stop these people inflicting pain and suffering and to stop these poor dogs living in these hell holes.

I think the Kennel Club is needed but at the moment it has vested interests and accountability only to its members. It should not be allowed to continue to self regulate, like any other business it should be externally regulated to protect animal welfare.
 
Hi Tania

Fully agree ,they are there purely to line their own pockets and offer very little if any protection to our dogs they are charged to be looking after .So where does their money go ? ,does anybody have a copy of their last accounts or do I suspect they are not openly published .All my girls are KC reg and I bought their 5 generation certs ,so what happens to the cash ,how many employees are there and who earns what .As Tania says it is crying out for a complete overhaul and regulation by an external authority .

List of K C Fees

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/364

Accounts 2007

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/download/4527/ctaccounts2007.pdf

Not a lot of in depth info
 
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I am not sure but I would think because it is a Private Members Club the full
financial position will be Private....but I don't know !
 
In fairness to the KC, they don't have any shareholders and any surplus goes to the KC Charitable Trust - from which Cavaliers and many other breeds have benefited enormously over the years. And they don't just register dogs, they also regulate Agility, Obedience, Working Trials, Field Trials, Dog Shows, Good Citizens, provide field officers to spot check all these activities, finance the councils of lay participants who regulate each of these activities, train judges, prosecute wrongdoers, and quite a few other things - and have the best dog library and art gallery in the world. All of which take staff and therefore money. I don't think the actual Council members get paid anything except expenses, so can hardly be accused of lining their own pockets.

And if Brian's attitude is typical, get no thanks for doing any of it.

And yes, the Accredited Breeeders scheme needs many more teeth, but they're moving in that direction slowly (when does any organistion in the UK change things quickly?!). I think the whole KC (not just the Charitable Trust) should become a not-for-profit charity - though that doesn't seem to have done much good to the RSPCA!

Kate, Oliver and Aled
 
In fairness to the KC, they don't have any shareholders and any surplus goes to the KC Charitable Trust - from which Cavaliers and many other breeds have benefited enormously over the years. And they don't just register dogs, they also regulate Agility, Obedience, Working Trials, Field Trials, Dog Shows, Good Citizens, provide field officers to spot check all these activities, finance the councils of lay participants who regulate each of these activities, train judges, prosecute wrongdoers, and quite a few other things - and have the best dog library and art gallery in the world.
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I do not disagree with this, I think they do a fabulous job. However, in the meantime in Wales alone there are almost 3,000 bitches living a life of hell and over 500 stud dogs living almost in total isolation. The puppies produced from such cruelty then go onto become KC Registered.

Whilst the Kennel Club are able to put on fantastic shows and have great libraries, I think I would prefer to see much stricter controls over animal welfare and the KC created Health problems associated with these poor breeds.

All of which take staff and therefore money. I don't think the actual Council members get paid anything except expenses, so can hardly be accused of lining their own pockets.
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This is a closed book, so we don't really know who gets paid what! Don't forget a lot of money that is donated from the "Charitable Trust" to fund health projects, a lot of this money is donated from Pet Owners. In 2006 the KC boast they donated money to Dr. Rusbridges SM research, the KC were notified of this horrendous problem in 1999, why did it take so long for them to help?

I think there will be some changes and for the good. Hopefully this will mean the KC will no longer just be a glossy cover of a book that is only half written!

The priotrity has got to be to Stop these horrendous Puppy Farmers!
 
Hi

I would of thought that if one volunteers for anything you do so because you want to and therefore would not expect either a round of applause or a pat on the back ,and are The KC now moving in the right direction albeit slowly or are they being physically pushed .I have never had much faith in any organisation that self regulates, and after paying all my fees for registration ,generation certs ,good citizen etc I firmly believe that health and welfare of all dogs should be their first directive .So Tania's enlightening post about the Pup Aid incident just confirms all that is wrong with this private members club named "The Kennel Club" and its lack of will to address the registration of the huge number of puppy farm bred Cavaliers ,so we hope The KC will soon agree to implement some form of Puppy Contract to address this legal stumbling block and end the horrible suffering that is happening at those awful places .
I do so admire all the hard work that you do with your annual fundays which do so much to help all our beloved dogs and wish you continuing success with these wonderful days which I hope some day to attend .
With Thanks
brian

PS Poppy and Rosie came to me through breeders sourced from the ABS then as I became more aware Daisy and Lily came with help and guidance from forum members .
 
There are some really good breeders in the Kennel Club ABS, but the more astute puppy farmers and commercial breeders also realised that it was a way of promoting themselves.

The health checks that must actually be carried out are very few, simply because they must be official health schemes and there are not many of them.
Even with those few mandatory tests the results can be ignored and affected dogs can still be bred from.

Cavalier ABS breeders do not have to MRI scan or check for heart murmurs and they can breed from very young dogs.
They must have the cavaliers' eyes tested, but they can breed from a dog that has been found to have inherited eye disease.

One of the objections to the ABS is that most good breeders are doing a lot more than the very basic requirements demanded by the scheme, and those good breeders do not want to be associated with the opportunists who have jumped on that particular bandwagon.

If the Kennel Club wanted to they could make the few basic ABS demands a requirement before they registered any puppy, but that would reduce their income.

The Charitable Trust does give money for health research and this gives the KC a lot of influence as to what health issues are researched and who gets the grants.

The KC is also a very wealthy private members club, accountable only to themselves, and located in a very valuable property in the middle of London. Cynics would suggest that a fall in income could be offset by a move to a more central location in the Midlands.
 
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