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Karen and Ruby
22nd May 2010, 01:12 PM
Hi everyone

I posted a few months back about Ruby becoming slightly incontinent. At that point she was wetting the bed occasionally at night even though she was having her last toilet stop at around 11pm.
Karlin suggested giving her Frusominde a bit earlier in the evening so for the last few months she has been having her tablets 12 hourly at 7.30am and 7.30pm
This has worked really well and no bed wetting at night.

However in the fortnight or so she has been wetting herself during the day while Im at work. I do walk them for 30mins before I leave for work at 7.30am then the dog walker takes them out between 11.30am and midday for another half hour and Im home at 4.30pm
She cant last this long and everyday I come home to a wet patch on my sofas.

Yesterday and today I have been off work and she has had access to the garden at all times and they have been walked. Today I got back from our walk at 11.45am- she had about 10 wees while we were out and she has just leaked a massive puddle on the floor while laying down and she is just walking around the living room dribbling everywhere! She doesnt realise it is happening but apart from that I just dont know where it is coming from!! I thought she would have well and truely emptied herself up the park?
The same thing happened yesterday. She just doesnt seem to acknowledge it is happening.
I reaslise I will need to get her some pants - does anyone know where I can get them from that are made for urine incontinence rather than bitches in season?

Is it worth reassessing her tablets and maybe changing them would help?

I realised this would happen as she has been spayed and she drinks litres of water a day-especially with the weather turning its just very upsetting to see her this way:(

Just seen this on my search- has anyone had experience with it??
http://www.canineconcepts.co.uk/item--HomeoPet-Leaks-No-More--hp-leaks-no-more---dogs

Love my Cavaliers
22nd May 2010, 03:35 PM
The first thing I would do is to make sure she does not have a bladder infection. I think incontinence of urine is one of the hallmark signs. It must be so frustrating and heartbreaking at the same time to have to deal with this. Poor Ruby. As you've witnessed, she doesn't seem to have control of it so at least it's not a conscious thing. That's why I would suggest a trip to the vet for an assessment. There are medications that they can give a dog to give them better bladder control. My German Shepherd took it while she was on anti-seizure medication because it just relaxed her enough that she just went anywhere, anytime. But the meds seemd to work. Good luck Karen.

Love my Cavaliers
22nd May 2010, 03:38 PM
Forgot to add in my last post that you can use the little pants that are made for when a dog is in season - just put a self sticking sanitary napkin in. It does a good job of holding the urine. I have gotten them at Petsmart here in the US.

Nicki
22nd May 2010, 07:24 PM
Sorry to hear that you are having these problems :( It doesn't sound if Ruby can help it, she doesn't seem to even know it's happening...

It is quite common with SM - it depends which nerves are affected.

I too think that a check up at the vet is in order, take a sample with you, just to make sure there is nothing else going on.

Frusemide takes about 45 mins plus to go through the system, so giving her the tablet and then going straight to work is going to mean she needs to pee pretty soon after you leave.

Could you perhaps give it at 6.30am? or even slightly earlier if poss, then 12 hours later, which would give her time to pee before you leave.

Propolin is a preparation available from the vet, which helps with incontinence and may also help. {It's something she would need to take for life though}


Pants are a good solution - this rescue sometimes has them http://www.pekeatzurescue.com/storefurbaby.htm

Otherwise even little girls pants can work - generally age 3 or so, sometimes you can get them in a charity shop to try. You cut a hole for the tail, and then attach a pad inside - the cheap ones for incontinence from the supermarket are pretty effective.

Something like these could be placed on Ruby's chair - or perhaps you could arrange so that she is in a smaller, easy to clean area, with one of these on her bed?
http://overthetop.co.uk/index.php?pg=2&action=dept&id=44&pid=138&p=

or

http://overthetop.co.uk/index.php?pg=2&action=dept&id=7&pid=65&p=

Keep us posted and I hope you can find a solution.

*Pauline*
23rd May 2010, 08:15 PM
These are what I bought for Dylan for when we visit people as he marks.
http://www.dog-nappy.co.uk/default.asp
I found them hard to get on as you have to put the tail through a hole. If Ruby will stand still for you, this will be fine, otherwise I found I needed someone to help me. I switched to a belly band, perfect solution for us but not ok for bitches. This company are the best in my opinion, very well made and strong. They supply their own huge thick pads, Tenna Lady might work for her also. They are expensive (24.50 for one, 44.00 for 2, not including pads) but they used to say on their website, you can claim for them on your insurance, I can't find that now. There was a reduction if you buy two or more which I didn't do but wish I had, so when one is in the wash you have one dry.

Zoe bowie
23rd May 2010, 10:28 PM
I am sorry ruby is having this problem, the poor little soul!I've never experienced this with any of my dogs but I have modified baby nappies for whenmy girls went into season...worked a treat, judy had to cut a hole in back for the tail, maybe this might work for you, they are easy to put on & off & once on they don't even notice as they are lite & stey in place...I used the newborn size but then
my girls were very small & still puppies,weigh her first & buy a size comparable...hope this helps a little..best of luck & give Ruby a cuddle from me, poor little thing :hug:

Karen and Ruby
23rd May 2010, 11:35 PM
Thanks everyone for your replys!!

Im going to get her to the vets just incase there is anything...

Will definitly look to changing the times of her meds around but it does get difficult as I work shifts and sometimes im out during the day and sometimes all evening.

I was always hoping that it wouldnt get any worse than it had been as up untill this week i was only while she was asleep and she would wake up wet.
It is upsetting as since I found out about the SM just over a year ago I can still look at her as a normal girl. For a stranger looking on they wouldnt know anything was wrong with her and although I havent got my head in the sand I still look at her as normal.
Sticking pants on her would mean looking at a sick dog everyday and taking some of her dignity away that she fights this disease with every single day :(
She loathes wearing any sort of clothing at all and feel she will be really irritated with pants.

Still .... we shall muddle on as always. Thanks again for all the suggestions they are very helpfull indeed x

waldor
23rd May 2010, 11:51 PM
If you or anyone in your family sews, you can purchase a pattern to make the doggie diapers from [/URL][URL]http://www.parksbird.com/ss_dog_diaper.htm (http://www.parksbird.com/)

They come as an email attachment or download upon receipt of payment. As best I recall, the pattern I bought came as an attachment to a confirmation email. It's multi-sized. I don't need this right now, but bought it in case it would be helpful in the future with Sophie.

I made a Onesie dress from the free pattern on their site. Directions were good and it was very easy to work up.

*Pauline*
24th May 2010, 02:16 AM
If you or anyone in your family sews, you can purchase a pattern to make the doggie diapers from [/URL][URL]http://www.parksbird.com/ss_dog_diaper.htm (http://www.parksbird.com/)

Now that is very useful. :thmbsup:

Sabby
25th May 2010, 12:19 AM
My Honey an X Breed well before I had Cavaliers became incontinent when she was 13. As she was a big dog she never got up on the furniture but always wet her bed. The medicine the vet gave her was very good and completely stopped it but like Nicki said she was on it for the rest of her live.

Karen and Ruby
1st June 2010, 07:57 PM
Thought I would update on Ruby.

Took her to the vets on Friday and my vet did blood tests, electrolyte tests and enzyme tests while we were there. All came back fine and we did a sterile urine test and that has come back clear also.
So no underlying problems there.

The wetting has got even worse over the last few days, ive tried baby nappies but they restricted her movement too much and she looked miserable wearing it.
So i got my creative head on and made her a pair of pants and bought incontinence pads from the supermarket. She was more than happy to wear them too!! RESULT..... well thats until they came under test!! FAILED ... miserably!!
The problem is with Rubys incontinence is that its not a little bit at a time dribbling out its a whole bladder full and no incontinence pad is going to hold tha much liquid in.
So im back to the drawing board.....

*Pauline*
1st June 2010, 08:02 PM
These are good Karen. Designed for completely incontinent dogs.

http://www.dog-nappy.co.uk/How_they_work.htm

Karlin
2nd June 2010, 01:10 AM
Hmmm. Maybe the inco ntinence is unrelated to the medication or SM -- maybe try Propalin (sp!) -- which they give for incontinent females?

But first: have you tried cimetidine or omeprazole or similar rather than frusemide? I switched from frusemide because Leo sometimes would wee as well, it would come and go even if I'd walked him. Other medications can do the same basic task as frusemide. Maybe ask Clare about trying one of the alternatives?

Nicki may be right too that she is having issues because of the SM and not the medication. Still, my first inclination would be to change meds unless she needs the frusemide for heart issues.

To me this just sounds like it must be something with her kidneys or bladder -- might want the vets to try retesting. I know people who have had urine tests come back clear but the animal has actually had a urinary or kidney infection. Just seems odd that it is only all of a sudden and that she has so little control; it seems to fit the profile of an infection or other bladder/kidney problem.

Tania
2nd June 2010, 02:33 PM
[QUOTE=Nicki;361518]
Propolin is a preparation available from the vet, which helps with incontinence and may also help. {It's something she would need to take for life though}
QUOTE]

Karen I am sorry poor Ruby has this problem, I have heard of dogs on propolin, it works a treat. Keep us posted and let us know what the vet thinks .

kind regards

Karen and Ruby
3rd June 2010, 02:46 PM
[QUOTE=Nicki;361518]
Propolin is a preparation available from the vet, which helps with incontinence and may also help. {It's something she would need to take for life though}
QUOTE]

Karen I am sorry poor Ruby has this problem, I have heard of dogs on propolin, it works a treat. Keep us posted and let us know what the vet thinks .

kind regards

Ive purchased a herbal treatment for incontinence- wanted to give it a try before pumping any more drugs in to her!!
our dog walker used it on her greyhound and said it worked a treat!!


Im also going to put her back on Cimetidine as that is what Charlie is on so maybe that will tell a difference?
But yes I will keep you all updated x

Thankyou so much for all the help and advise as always xx

Karlin
3rd June 2010, 05:42 PM
Only frusemide causes them to have to wee --cimetidine does not. So if you get the some benefit from either I'd switch to cimetidine or one of the other CSF inhibitors. That is where I would start if there's no reason she has to be on frusemide and to see if that halts the incontinence, before I tried any other approach. Some dogs get a better response from one CSF drug than another.

Karen and Ruby
16th June 2010, 09:22 PM
Only frusemide causes them to have to wee --cimetidine does not. So if you get the some benefit from either I'd switch to cimetidine or one of the other CSF inhibitors. That is where I would start if there's no reason she has to be on frusemide and to see if that halts the incontinence, before I tried any other approach. Some dogs get a better response from one CSF drug than another.


Just thought I would update on Little Ruby.
She has been back on Cimetidine now for just over a week and so far so good :D

No weeing AT ALL!!! Not even a dribble since the day I did the trade- so all in all a good result!!

Thanks every one for all the advice as usual!!