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View Full Version : Time for a rant..How dare she!



MurphysMummy
18th November 2010, 04:54 PM
As a cavalier owner I am very aware of most of the health issues and defects in the breed. I am also very aware about if my dog is overweight. I would say I am quite an educated cavalier owner (Most of us on here are)..But today, I was confronted by a lady, who thinks because she owns two black and tan cavaliers she can judge me and my ability to look after Murphy.

It started off with the "aww hes lovely"..Then she started to say how overweight he was. Murphy weighs 9.4kilos and at the moment is on a diet, more exercise and less food and he is doing very well..Which I explained to this lady, I then go on to say that EVERY CAVALIER IS DIFFERENT.:bang::bang:
But she seemed to think that my Murphy should weigh 5kilos and that I should feed him as little as possible and just one meal a day!!:bang: I then said if he was to weigh 5kilo's he would be almost underweight as hes quite a stocky cavi! I also explained he has mitral valve disease. Her reply..."What's that?" I was fuming.:mad:
I then confronted her and told her before judging me and my pet she should research and know about the breed she owns. She goes on to say "they are from a breeder so there is not going to be problems with them"...I then left the conversation as I was so angry and Murphy did not like this woman as he backed off from her petting him, which I found weird!...:confused::confused:

Alot more was said but this is just the basis. I can feel Murphy's rib's when I touch him so I know he is not massively over-weight.
He looks a little plump as he doesn't have a silky coat, its wavy and thick. But please what does it take to buy a book about cavaliers, to use google and search cavaliers, research is easy, neccesary and vital to owning any pet!
But how dare a member of the public tell me what to do with my cavalier when she doesn't even know about murmurs and MVD. Absolutely disgusted!

Also forgot to add - Murphy went for his boosters at the vets today, and the vet listened to his heart and described the sound "like a steam train" :(

sins
18th November 2010, 05:16 PM
An adult male cavalier at 20 lbs wouldn't be terribly overweight. Certainly dropping 2 lbs or so would be great but 5kg,which is 11lbs would be literally skin and bone.:shock:
Just don't allow some stranger to cause you that much distress.Just continue as you are and you'll get him to a level where you and your vet are happy with him.
It must be nice for that lady to feel so complacent about her own dogs health.
next time anyone criticises you over your dogs weight,just look them straight in the eye and say
"Yes, it's dreadful,since he gave up the cigarettes he's just piled on the pounds":-D

Sins

MurphysMummy
18th November 2010, 05:20 PM
An adult male cavalier at 20 lbs wouldn't be terribly overweight. Certainly dropping 2 lbs or so would be great but 5kg,which is 11lbs would be literally skin and bone.:shock:
Just don't allow some stranger to cause you that much distress.Just continue as you are and you'll get him to a level where you and your vet are happy with him.
It must be nice for that lady to feel so complacent about her own dogs health.
next time anyone criticises you over your dogs weight,just look them straight in the eye and say
"Yes, it's dreadful,since he gave up the cigarettes he's just piled on the pounds":-D

Sins

LOL! Thank you sins, the cigarettes joke made me giggle!!

*Pauline*
18th November 2010, 05:29 PM
:lol: If only we could all have a sense of humour like Sinead when we meet morons!

Cathy T
18th November 2010, 05:37 PM
LOL....great comeback!!

I saw a woman the other day with a hugely overweight dog. I heard someone make a negative comment about "how could she let that dog get in that condition". I responded "perhaps she's just adopted him and he came to her like that and she is working on helping him lose weight....you don't know her story" Really pisses me off when people are judgemental...especially when they don't know what they are talking about in the first place :bang::shock:

murphy's mum
18th November 2010, 06:09 PM
What a cheek! :mad:

My Murphy weighs 11kg, and stands 16 inches high at the withers. At his last visit to the vet I asked our vet if he was overweight, but he assured that he was great. You can easily feel all his ribs when you run your hands over his body, but you can't really see them all that well as his coats so fluffy. Misty weighs 9.2kg, but looks heavier than Murphy as she is smaller than him.

I reduce both their food in the winter as we are less active in the bad weather. Misty was not impressed at being dragged out for a walk tonight, she wanted to go home after she'd done her business :lol:

team bella
18th November 2010, 07:36 PM
Honestly some people leave you speechless. If he wieghed 5kg you'd probably have the RSPCA checking how you're feeding him. Bella weighs 9.6 and she's having her weight managed too. She's got a thick wavy coat so its not so slimming for her. One man stopped me one day and asked me if she was a pekingese :mad:. I nearly said would you like a squashed face !!:badgrin:
Anyway I think Sin's comment about the cigarettes is the best answer, really made me laugh.

anniemac
18th November 2010, 10:57 PM
Sins very funny! I can understand your frustration. I hate to say how much Ella weighs but I'm trying and its hard (limited activity) but I don't need to explain.

So many people advertize for small cavaliers. Saw one breeders website that went on and on about how picky, how healthy, perfect, etc her $3000 puppies were. A good friend (former breeder) pointed out that the beautiful website states the weight they will be (extremely small and unhealthy). Picture of champion dog was a Cavalier She knew and said owner would be very upset to see him on this website. (She said people will put pictures of champion cavaliers that are not their dogs). Came from Ireland.

Point is, if she did not know what MVD is, how on earth could she say "came from breeder no problems"

Last thing, in chain book store and both CKCS books did not mention SM, (shame) but not knowing what MVD is wow. Not surprised she us concerned with looks.

Most important! I'm so sorry about vets comment on Murphy's heart :(

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Daisy's Mom
19th November 2010, 02:01 PM
I feel your pain! Daisy is somewhat overweight, but I can feel her ribs and she has a waist, so I don't think it's extreme. (The vet rates her a 3.5 on the 1-5 body condition scale.) I took her to a Cavalier show a couple of years ago, and in addition to her getting kennel cough at the show from all those perfect dogs, I had to endure 2 people telling me that she was overweight to my face, and a couple more who made audible comments not directed to me, but to each other behind my back. Of course, none of these people put their hands on Daisy to feel her body condition. They just looked at her from 10 feet away and made those judgments.

Another person said "I think that's a rescue dog." to their companion. That hurt my feelings, too. Not because I have anything against rescue dogs, who are often incredibly beautiful cavaliers, but it was obviously said in a pejorative way to explain why she didn't look like all those show dogs. I paid a lot of money for Daisy from a very good show breeder. She is just a big girl all the way around and I don't know if spaying has anything to do with it, but she has always had enough hair for 3 Cavaliers.

Add that to the fact that the cardiologist had cancelled out and no one bothered to notify me, and you can imagine how happy I was that I drove 45 minutes to bring Daisy to that show. Although I would like to have Daisy heart-checked by a cardiologist every year and I would like to watch some of the showing, that experience left a really bad taste in my mouth. (Kennel cough, insults, and cancelled cardiologist.)

And to be honest, there were many of those show dogs who looked literally emaciated to me. I know I probably have a skewed perception because Daisy is a bigger dog, but there were a few of them that if I found them on the street, I would assume they had been starving for a while.

There are know-it-alls everywhere. I guess we just have to have the confidence to stand up to them, which it sounds like you did! And then Miss Ever-So-Knowledgeable never heard of MVD?!! Amazing.

meljoy
19th November 2010, 03:10 PM
What a cheek:-X

5kg's you say......Leo weighs 11 kg at the moment and is losing weight really well but I hope to god he never reaches 5kg.

Im trying to picture what he's look likeicon_nwunsure

Well done for standing up for Murphy try to understand the lady you met obviously hasnt got a clue when it comes to the health of our breed

ByFloSin
19th November 2010, 04:10 PM
Well done Murphy for standing your ground and preserving your self confidence.

Sins, your comment made me laugh so much I almost fell off the chair. I will remember that one.

The best mouthfull of crap I got from someone I hadn't seen at show before was that 'I know everything you know because i've already bred two litters from him' referring to her 18 months' old completely untested 'stud dog'. I pretended to see a friend across the hall, waved to no-one in particular and moved my dog and his stuff pretty smartly icon_devil

allie
19th November 2010, 06:31 PM
Sins - I too laughed out loud at your ciggies comment - love it:p

It is so frustrating when people launch into a rant about your dogs. The worst one I had was a few years ago when a woman came up to give off to me about my German Shepherd. She said one of her dogs was attacked by a Shepherd and while she was ranting at me her two wee rats were yipping and jumping all over Chelsea who just stood there and took it. To be honest, I'm not surprised another dog snapped and attacked at that behaviour. I'm still cross at myself for standing there taking it [and not booting her dogs up the backside!]

A neighbour of mine got his first ever dog [a husky] about a year ago and has become an "expert" on all dog matters. He's going to breed from her because it'll settle her down and be good for her temperament - I tried to tell him it'll not make a jot of difference & pounds are coming down with huskys but he knows it all :mad:

MurphysMummy
19th November 2010, 10:31 PM
I feel your pain! Daisy is somewhat overweight, but I can feel her ribs and she has a waist, so I don't think it's extreme. (The vet rates her a 3.5 on the 1-5 body condition scale.) I took her to a Cavalier show a couple of years ago, and in addition to her getting kennel cough at the show from all those perfect dogs, I had to endure 2 people telling me that she was overweight to my face, and a couple more who made audible comments not directed to me, but to each other behind my back. Of course, none of these people put their hands on Daisy to feel her body condition. They just looked at her from 10 feet away and made those judgments.

Another person said "I think that's a rescue dog." to their companion. That hurt my feelings, too. Not because I have anything against rescue dogs, who are often incredibly beautiful cavaliers, but it was obviously said in a pejorative way to explain why she didn't look like all those show dogs. I paid a lot of money for Daisy from a very good show breeder. She is just a big girl all the way around and I don't know if spaying has anything to do with it, but she has always had enough hair for 3 Cavaliers.

Add that to the fact that the cardiologist had cancelled out and no one bothered to notify me, and you can imagine how happy I was that I drove 45 minutes to bring Daisy to that show. Although I would like to have Daisy heart-checked by a cardiologist every year and I would like to watch some of the showing, that experience left a really bad taste in my mouth. (Kennel cough, insults, and cancelled cardiologist.)

And to be honest, there were many of those show dogs who looked literally emaciated to me. I know I probably have a skewed perception because Daisy is a bigger dog, but there were a few of them that if I found them on the street, I would assume they had been starving for a while.

There are know-it-alls everywhere. I guess we just have to have the confidence to stand up to them, which it sounds like you did! And then Miss Ever-So-Knowledgeable never heard of MVD?!! Amazing.

Almost the same experience as me when I visited a cavalier club show - worst outing experience of my life (so far), I disliked it alot and totally agree with you.
Also when I told her Murphy was rescued she was like.."Oh?!?!" Kind of shocked.
Thank God for us cavalier folk who love them dearly and consider health before looks.

anniemac
20th November 2010, 12:24 AM
Those are terrible stories of how you were treated at shows. We look to the breed clubs to educate the public and help our breed. When people have experiences like that, its no wonder they get a bad name no matter what they do.

Its a shame because I know rescue organizations want their volunteers to be members of clubs, educate, volunteer, etc. I know they would also feel bad for those comments because they spend time helping and come to love their fosters.

There is a lot to be said about education. The club shows should set an example and if someone feels snubbed, out of place, turned off, then something is wrong. Not all people, breeders, members are like that. However, one bad thing can overshadow any good.

The true beauty of a cavalier is their spirit. They love everything no matter what shape, color, size and accept all. I think that we should learn from that.

I read somewhere they were once prescribed for illness. Maybe we should return the favor and help their health now.



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Devilica
20th November 2010, 08:47 AM
I have both ends of the scale at home. My tilly is currently up at 10kg... a little too heavy but also on lots of medication with severe SM. she also has the thick wavy coat (having been spayed) which makes her look fatter. Saying that I now shave her very short all over as she can't stand grooming anymore.

Fern on the other hand is far too skinny. Everyone assumes she is a puppy even though she is 3. She has been spayed to try to encourage weight gain but still comes in at just over 6kg. She has allergies to everything.

Seeng how skinny Fern is I cannot imagine any adult cavalier being healthy at 5kg.

There will always be idiots in the world... as long as you are taking sensible advice from people who really do know what they are talking about and making informed decisions on the wellbeing of your dogs, ignore them.

ByFloSin
20th November 2010, 09:02 AM
Daisy's Mum, I am really shocked to read of your experience at a Club show. I have been a regular exhibitor at these shows for many years but have never seen or heard anything like this in all that time. Non show and rescue owners often turn up to see what is happening and to admire the entered dogs, few of which are actually placed, mine usually included.

Recently I arranged to meet a member of another list who wanted to see what a show was like and to meet exhibitors and their dogs. Even before he got there, when he rang to say he couldn't find the venue, friends gave prescise directions and once we met up I introduced him to most of the Cavalier people, who made him very welcome, showed him how to groom his dog to look his very best and listened sympathetically to the story of his rescue dog. Almost all those exhibitors are Club members with dogs frequently placed at champ. shows. I have pictures of the event to prove it.

One isolated and unforgiveable experience does not mean that all Club people are unfriendly and deirisory of rescue, or of pet dogs for that matter. Almost all of us have one thing in common - a love of our beautiful breed and an affinity with others who have them.:)

*Pauline*
20th November 2010, 09:08 AM
I read somewhere they were once prescribed for illness. Maybe we should return the favor and help their health now.


What a lovely sentiment :)

anniemac
20th November 2010, 01:02 PM
L
Daisy's Mum, I am really shocked to read of your experience at a Club show. I have been a regular exhibitor at these shows for many years but have never seen or heard anything like this in all that time. Non show and rescue owners often turn up to see what is happening and to admire the entered dogs, few of which are actually placed, mine usually included.

Recently I arranged to meet a member of another list who wanted to see what a show was like and to meet exhibitors and their dogs. Even before he got there, when he rang to say he couldn't find the venue, friends gave prescise directions and once we met up I introduced him to most of the Cavalier people, who made him very welcome, showed him how to groom his dog to look his very best and listened sympathetically to the story of his rescue dog. Almost all those exhibitors are Club members with dogs frequently placed at champ. shows. I have pictures of the event to prove it.

One isolated and unforgiveable experience does not mean that all Club people are unfriendly and deirisory of rescue, or of pet dogs for that matter. Almost all of us have one thing in common - a love of our beautiful breed and an affinity with others who have them.:)

I will write a blog b/c I wanted to share how I have become friends (through a forum) with someone on the board of a regional club in my state. She has been so helpful (she has two SM dogs) but I was going to meet her at a show. Two of them were going to meet me, talk about the show aspect etc. I did not end up going, but wanted to say that I was not only welcomed but helpful. My friend actually is the contact for rescue and currently has an extremely overweight foster who she has come attached to.

I too was scared of what a show experience would be and intimidated, however I was invited and assured to be helped. I just know the quote "one bad apple spoiles the bunch"





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Zumie05
21st November 2010, 05:40 AM
Well here's to hoping that you have at least educated that lady. Some people! Back when I had my last dog (a rottweiler) I did not neuter him until he was older because I wanted him to grow in full, and you would not believe the amount of people who asked me to let him breed with their dogs!!!!! Even after I told them he had hip dysplasia, they didn't care! Again.... Some people!!!

MurphysMummy
21st November 2010, 01:53 PM
Everyone has their own opinions on the Cavalier Club. Everyone's are different.



Well here's to hoping that you have at least educated that lady. Some people! Back when I had my last dog (a rottweiler) I did not neuter him until he was older because I wanted him to grow in full, and you would not believe the amount of people who asked me to let him breed with their dogs!!!!! Even after I told them he had hip dysplasia, they didn't care! Again.... Some people!!!
- Thats really bad, some people just don't care!! :bang::bang:

RodRussell
21st November 2010, 04:33 PM
...One isolated and unforgiveable experience does not mean that all Club people are unfriendly and deirisory of rescue, or of pet dogs for that matter. ...

I agree. Often it depends upon when you approach breeder/handlers at a show. If they are preparing to enter the ring, either grooming their dogs or walking them towards the ring, that definitely would be a bad time to expect a breeder to engage in a conversation.

When I show dogs, I set a schedule for myself to prepare for entering the ring, and that schedule usually is a tight one. So, I have not set aside any time for chit-chat during that process.

At speciality shows, a technique to use is to sit next to or near a breeder sitting ringside and who has a dog in her lap. If she does not appear very focused on the dogs in the ring at that time, then complimenting the dog and asking if you could pet it would be a good approach. If she says that it's okay, then she probably has the time to talk.

MurphysMummy
21st November 2010, 08:00 PM
When I went to a cavalier club event it was a Health Seminar, not a show.

Daisy's Mom
21st November 2010, 11:28 PM
I have been to several shows, and I agree there are definitely a lot of very nice people (exhibitors, breeders, rescue people, etc.) at the shows. Most people are very friendly. However, it doesn't take too many people treating you like a second class citizen to make you kind of not want to attend another show, and I haven't been to one in 2 years as a result. I would be very reluctant to bring Daisy to a show now, after that experience. I would seriously feel like I had to bring her in on a covert basis straight to the cardiologist's room and then straight back out to avoid another experience like I had.

So, it's a very mixed bag. I've seen and chatted with some exhibitors who I think are wonderful people who love their dogs dearly (as I do), and I've seen other exhibitors leave their dogs on top of grooming tables unattended for long periods of time, which I do not like. At one show, I had my then 8 year old daughter with me, and the dog who had been sitting unattended on the grooming table for at least an hour and a half (the whole time that I was there) growled very seriously at her as she walked past! She didn't approach him or extend her hand to him or anything. She just glanced over at him and he growled at her. Didn't exactly fit the Cavalier personality, I have to say! I've seen friendly people and I've seen people who obviously believe that they are better than anyone in the room. So it's like anything else, there's the good and the bad and you have to decide if the good outweighs the bad.

As far as approaching any of the exhibitors, I know better than to do that before they go in the ring. At the show I mentioned in my original post, I was just sitting in the room with Daisy on a leash, watching the show ring when these comments were made. I wasn't speaking to anyone.

Anyway, I wasn't trying to dissuade any pet owners from attending a show because I have enjoyed several of them, but I was just relating a similar experience to the OP with the unsolicited comments about my dog that I didn't appreciate.

MurphysMummy
26th November 2010, 01:51 PM
People(nobody on ct) must really have a problem with me.
I'm 16 and being accused of being a "snotty show person and breeder" Would love to know how I can breed from a neutered cav that doesn't meet breed standard to show??
All because I love cavaliers..oh dear..!!!

Chamberlain
26th November 2010, 01:56 PM
I hate how complete strangers feel the need to comment on our dogs. Good for Murphy for standing up and giving her the cold shoulder. I swear dogs have that "sense" about who is good and evil in the world!

Jitterbug
28th November 2010, 04:19 PM
Indeed every Cavalier is different!
My late Cavalier was underweight when he was at 10.5 kg (he was very ill at that time), you could clearly see his hipbones sticking out! Just something you should not be able to see so clearly on a dog.