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View Full Version : Chloe has been licking lately. Is this Fly Catcher's? (VIDEO)



ChloeTheCavalier
22nd March 2011, 01:31 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cipvr38BQzE

Background: Chloe is a 4.5 year old Cavalier. She was diagnosed with SM in September 2010 and has been medically treated since. Last week, she started licking her mouth/making chewing motions repeatedly (video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNbRhylJNow). She hasn't done it again since, from what I have seen, but started doing it again tonight as seen in the video above.

Is this what Fly Catcher's? I've looked at other videos of Fly Catcher's and while it's similar, Chloe seems like a subdued version.

(Note: I have already contacted Chloe's SM neurologist after her first licking episode, and showed him the video. I on sending him tonight's video as well.)

Soushiruiuma
22nd March 2011, 04:55 AM
That's subdued? You definitely did the right thing contacting your neurologist.

If you distract her during an episode (by calling her name or something) will she stop/pause or is she too distracted? *** edit, nevermind, I had only watched the second video, you try this in the first video. ***

My guess is that this can be managed by adjusting her SM meds. Are you using the treatment guidelines from Clare Rusbridge for medicating?

Ddavis
23rd March 2011, 06:36 AM
Wow, this is exactly what my Megan does.

Hope someone is able to clarify whether this is a issue or not. :confused:

ChloeTheCavalier
23rd March 2011, 06:01 PM
That's subdued? You definitely did the right thing contacting your neurologist.

If you distract her during an episode (by calling her name or something) will she stop/pause or is she too distracted? *** edit, nevermind, I had only watched the second video, you try this in the first video. ***

My guess is that this can be managed by adjusting her SM meds. Are you using the treatment guidelines from Clare Rusbridge for medicating?
Yes, the first time I saw her doing it, I filmed it and emailed him the video right away. I sent him the later two videos as well, still waiting to hear back.

But his response to the first video was that it's definitely NOT normal, and while the licking/Fly Catcher's has been linked to SM/neurological conditions, the link isn't clear. He said it could also likely be an obsessive compulsive behavior. He wanted to hold off on treating it because it was the first time she ever did it and it may have been a random occurence, but the said if it happened more frequently, to definitely let him know. Will update with what he says after watching the other videos.

I noticed that she has only done it only when she had nothing else to do (bored), which leads to her being anxious. In one of the videos I took, there was a noise that caused her to stop licking and look out the door, so she definitely does stop when distracted.

She has been taking Gabapentin and Prilosec everyday since she was diagnosed with SM.

ChloeTheCavalier
23rd March 2011, 06:02 PM
Oh and the reason I said "subdued" is because while she is definitely licking compulsively, she isn't moving her head/"watching" flies in front of her face as much as Cavaliers in other videos do.

cavawampus
19th June 2011, 05:55 PM
Our Guinevere does the same thing but also compulsively licks our pillows, spots on fabric, etc. Do Cavs get OCD, because that is what it seems like?

Reptigirl
20th June 2011, 04:59 AM
Blitz did almost exactly that from time to time before meds. His neuro said it was probably some kind of focal seizure related to his SM. Since starting Gabapention & Omeprazole he doesn't do it that bad anymore. My neuro wanted to do Gabapention INSTEAD of Lyrica because he said it would work better for the licking. Now he only licks a little.. Its not as dramatic as it used to be. I usually wont even notice it unless he is sitting in my lap. He also used to lick things uncontrollably (My arm, his feet, the couch, the blanket, etc.) That all stopped after starting the medication.

cavawampus
20th June 2011, 05:39 AM
Thanks for this. Our Cav has mild SM. I'll mention these meds to her neuro.

Nicki
20th June 2011, 09:21 AM
So sorry to see this it is distressing for you to watch - and obviously for Chloe.

Cavaliers are one of the breeds very prone to obsessive compulsive disorders and it may well be something like that in response to the anxiety as you mention - your neurologist is in the best position to advise you. It's brilliant that you have the video sent to him that's very helpful.

from Clare Rusbridge's sitehttp://www.veterinary-neurologist.co.uk/part3.htm#32

Fly catching behaviour
There is no evidence that this condition is associated with CM/SM although the two conditions could occur simultaneously. Fly catching is thought to be a compulsive disorder. Classically the dog acts as if watching / catching a fly. Some may also behave as if their ears or feet are irritated and some can also tail chase. Compulsive disorders are compared to obsessive compulsive disorders in humans and are poorly understood; it has been suggested in the Cavalier that there is an underlying neurochemical and/or metabolic imbalance. Diagnosis is typically made on the basis of clinical history and elimination of other behavioural, medical, metabolic, and neurological disorders. Compulsive disorders are managed with a programme of training to interrupt the behaviour sometimes combined with drugs such as selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitors. High protein diets, i.e. high meat content, tend to make compulsive behaviours worse and conversion to a low protein diet can result in improvement of signs although in some dogs this may be only temporary.




There are various things you can do to help with anxiety, from my recent post about DAP:

Richard Allport wrote an article about anxiety relief in the Dogs Today magazine - MAY 2011

He had found that 14 studies on the use of pheromones [sold in the UK as DAP - dog-appeasing pheromone and Feliway - feline facial pheromone] were reviewed and assessed by researchers at the University of Montreal

11 of the 14 reports reviewed provided insufficient evidence and 1 provided lack of support for effectiveness of pheromones for the treatment of undesirable behaviour in cats and dogs

More information here http://pubget.com/search?q=authors%3...ane%20Frank%22 (http://pubget.com/search?q=authors%3A%22Diane%20Frank%22)

Like most things it is worth trying to see if it would help your animal, but there are other things available that have been found to be far more effective - such as Scullcap and Valierian [Dorwest herbs], Homoeopathic remedies, Kalm Aid www.viovet.co.uk (http://www.viovet.co.uk/) and Dr Petals' elixirs.

Love my Cavaliers
20th June 2011, 04:33 PM
Just for my own information, Oz obsessively licks textured things - carpets, chairs, sofas, bedspreads, etc. He has been diagnosed by MRI with mild CM, but no syrinx and shows no signs of SM. Is this OCD behavior enough to warrant a trip to the neurologist? He certainly doesn't seem anxious but he does it all day, every day. He will stop - briefly - if you tell him too, but always goes back to it. He does not do the fly catching at all. Should I take him to the neurologist or just keep telling him to stop it? Thanks.

goda
20th June 2011, 04:37 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cipvr38BQzE

Background: Chloe is a 4.5 year old Cavalier. She was diagnosed with SM in September 2010 and has been medically treated since. Last week, she started licking her mouth/making chewing motions repeatedly (video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNbRhylJNow). She hasn't done it again since, from what I have seen, but started doing it again tonight as seen in the video above.

Is this what Fly Catcher's? I've looked at other videos of Fly Catcher's and while it's similar, Chloe seems like a subdued version.

(Note: I have already contacted Chloe's SM neurologist after her first licking episode, and showed him the video. I on sending him tonight's video as well.)

I am so sorry, it does look neurological.

Nicki
20th June 2011, 06:39 PM
Just for my own information, Oz obsessively licks textured things - carpets, chairs, sofas, bedspreads, etc. He has been diagnosed by MRI with mild CM, but no syrinx and shows no signs of SM. Is this OCD behavior enough to warrant a trip to the neurologist? He certainly doesn't seem anxious but he does it all day, every day. He will stop - briefly - if you tell him too, but always goes back to it. He does not do the fly catching at all. Should I take him to the neurologist or just keep telling him to stop it? Thanks.

Bev, that frequency of this kind of behaviour would in my opinion merit a trip to the neurologist. It's a difficult problem to treat as not enough is known about it - but there are things to try and you also want to make sure nothing else is going on.

DO you use things like stuffed kongs to distract him? Any kind of things that require his concentration.

Love my Cavaliers
20th June 2011, 09:29 PM
Thanks Nicki. He used to be a big chewer and I could distract him that way. Now the chewing obsession has pretty much stopped (he's almost 4). I had to get rid of the stuffed kongs here. They were such a high quality treat that everyone always wanted everyone else's - even if they were identical. And Oz was so fast at "unstuffing" that he would then hover around Madison and Riley to see if he could just manange to sneak theirs away from them. I decided they weren't worth fighting over.

By the way, he had his MRI at 11 months, because he had an episode of what I thought was EFS, but because Riley had just been diagnosed with SM, I talked to her neurologist and decided to MRI him just to be sure it wasn't SM. I'll give the neuro a call and get an appointment.