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Blondie on gabapentin and question about pill dispenser

Blondiemonster

Well-known member
So we visited Dr. West for a 6 month check up and he decided to put her on Gabapentin. According to him there here isn't any real "decline" and no signs of muscle weakness but he did notice a increase in something which I can't remember the word of but it starts with "hyper" :) He say that when she doesn't see u coming and you touch her there is some kind of "ghost" neuropathic reflex associated with pain. Anyways, he wants to try gabapapentin at 150 mg 3 times a day. It's messy coz I have to break capsules in half and the powder falls out etc.. I tried the greenies pillpockets just now and they are too big so some of the powder fell out when she ate it. But ayways. Do any of you guys have advice? Also any of you use an automatic pill dispenser you can time??? I'm a real forgetful person and the 3 time a day thing is going to be a real challenge.
 
Someone said the greenies pill pockets are very bad for them. (Although ella has used them and I would split them up). You break open the gabapentin capsule? Some have suggested putting in yogurt. I have to be honest and say that I put a little cream cheese on hers. Ella was quite good at spitting out the pills but people always suggested opening the capsule but if its messy... have you tried to give her a full capsule? Does it not come in 150mg capsules? I'm trying to remember.

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No they only had 100 mg capsules... Yoghurt. That may not be a bad idea.
Or peanut butter. The greenies pill capsules r so big and chewy!!!!
 
I use the cat pill pockets for Riley. They're much smaller than the dog pill pockets - even the smaller sized ones. She takes prednisone every day and those pills are so small. I can squish her prednisone and her pepcid in the cat pill pocket together.
 
Bosco is so greedy he will eat his pred and Lyrica when I put them in with his breakfast. He doesn't seem to notice that they are there. I give him his second dose of Lyrica in the evening with a piece of carrot - I just offer them both to him at the same time, and sometimes the capsule might be 'ejected', but a second piece of carrot sorts that out. :p
I'm sure you have the right dose, but 150mgs seems quite a high dosage to start with - it was definitely 150 mgs 3x daily, and not in total?
 
Hey Charlifarley. No its defenitely a 150 mg... I asked Dr. West about the dosage. He said it was the lowest dosage he believes works. He says that if Gabapentin is given below a certain dosage, it doesn't work at all. What are the usual dosages for cavaliers? Is this something I should ask him about? Her symtoms are quite minor, and honestly i haven't seen a change in last time we went and he said she didnt have to be on anything at all. But i know that neurologists can pick up on subtle things, so that's why we went back after 6 months... But there is no head rubbing, no scratching, no weakness, she plays all day, but there is an occasional yelp out of nowhere a few times week, also when she gets excited and touched the wrong way she may yelp too so gotta assume there is some level of discomfort. I also dont feel like i have another choice but to trust him...
 
Btw, day 2 on gabapentin and shes a total ragdoll/zombie which hurts my heart coz she is usually such a playfull girl who wants to play tug o war all the time :(
 
Btw, day 2 on gabapentin and shes a total ragdoll/zombie which hurts my heart coz she is usually such a playfull girl who wants to play tug o war all the time :(
I know, its a difficult decision, to put them on meds that are supposed to help the pain, and then see them doped up to the eyeballs as a result. I have found it very hard to come to terms with this to be honest. If it helps - Bosco was doped on the lower dose of 3 x 100mg too.
 
You might look into getting the 600mg tablets and splitting them in fourths with a pill cutter. That's what I did for Leo for some time. Now he is on 200mg 3x so is back to 100mg capsules. Why did he decide to start on 150mg? That would be kind of high to start with unless you have a larger cavalier. (oops just reread previous post ...) I disagree totally with him -- while it is true that sometimes dosage needs to be increased over time, many manage perfectly well on far lower than that.Clare Rusbridge's treatment diagram has the starting dosages. leo did perfectly well on far lower doses for a year or more each time. A dog should not have to be doped -- it would be better to lower the gabapentin and add a painkiller and CSF inhibitor, try Lyrica, etc to get a better mix for any dog that is doped.

I think the Greenies pill pockets are really great for dogs and cats that have trouble taking meds. My dogs are all Greenie fans anyway... :)
 
Is Gabapentin Allowed in US?

I just read an interesting article stating that gabapentin isn't licensed for dogs in the US. What exactly does that mean? Are vets not supposed to be prescribing it?

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/dog/health/nerv/Syringomyelia.php

I hope Blondie gets back to her normal self soon, I would imagine after she gets used to the medication she won't be so doped up anymore. Did the vet say she will act this way until her body acclimates to the new medication?
 
Hey Karlin, I asked him about the dosage and he said he thinks "it's the lowest dosage that can be effective", meaning that according to him a certain minimum dosage of Gabapantin is needed to be effective at all, and that dosage seemed to be 150 mg...
Is this something I should question more? She is only 18 pounds.
@ ZUmie; yes I was warned about the doped up thing.
 
I just read an interesting article stating that gabapentin isn't licensed for dogs in the US. What exactly does that mean? Are vets not supposed to be prescribing it?

That just means that it is being used "off label" for dogs. This is quite common; many drugs for dogs are used "off label." There is no negative meaning here. (I do understand that some insurance companies won't pay for off label drugs prescribed for dogs, though......)

Pat

http://www.petmd.com/blogs/fullyvet...label-usesand-why-some-vet-drugs-cost-so-much

http://www.bsava.com/Advice/BSAVAGu...gcascadeandofflabeluse/tabid/360/Default.aspx
 
Gabapentin isn't licensed for dogs in the UK either - I have to get a monthly prescription from the vet and take it to the (human) pharmacy next door. Last month they had new stock of Gabapentin - price for 90 x 100mg had jumped from £5.50 to £24!! World shortage of the 100mg tablets apparently (but not of the higher doses).

Kate, Oliver and Aled
 
I think the Greenies pill pockets are really great for dogs and cats that have trouble taking meds. My dogs are all Greenie fans anyway... :)

Well thank goodness! I was in canine cafe Saturday (barbara the owner makes treats and sells them around the country) saying that someone said they were not healthy. She reviewed the ingredients and said she can't see why. Maybe they are just fattening. They work so well but I suggest getting the bigger ones and splitting them. (More for money).




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Gabapentin isn't licensed for dogs in the UK either - I have to get a monthly prescription from the vet and take it to the (human) pharmacy next door. Last month they had new stock of Gabapentin - price for 90 x 100mg had jumped from £5.50 to £24!! World shortage of the 100mg tablets apparently (but not of the higher doses).

Kate, Oliver and Aled

That is a huge jump but still better than lyrica.

Lynn,

I think overall it takes time, adjustment and changes to get the right match. What works for one may not for another but that does seem like a high dose to start out with. I would personally like to start low, increase etc.


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There were several cases in the UK last year or the year before of the Greenies treats swelling in the stomach and causing life-threatening problems (I seem to remember some dogs actually died). Not surprisingly, this got Greenies generally a bad name. If they are OK now, I would guess they have changed the ingredients to prevent these problems, but my local pet shop won't stock them.

Kate, Oliver and Aled
 
Hey Karlin, I asked him about the dosage and he said he thinks "it's the lowest dosage that can be effective", meaning that according to him a certain minimum dosage of Gabapantin is needed to be effective at all, and that dosage seemed to be 150 mg...
Is this something I should question more? She is only 18 pounds.
@ ZUmie; yes I was warned about the doped up thing.

I added to my first post as I saw you'd explained why he made that choice but must not have edited it fast enough! This is what I said:

I disagree totally with him -- while it is true that sometimes dosage needs to be increased over time, many manage perfectly well on far lower than that.Clare Rusbridge's treatment diagram has the starting dosages. leo did perfectly well on far lower doses for a year or more each time. A dog should not have to be doped -- it would be better to lower the gabapentin and add a painkiller and CSF inhibitor, try Lyrica, etc to get a better mix for any dog that is doped.

I know of very few dogs that have ended up 'doped'. Most just need their meds adjusted around. 150mg 3x is pretty high as a starting dose. If leo had started on that he'd have been sleepy too. But now he needs more than that to manage his symptoms and is not at all lethargic on a higher dose.
 
Hey Karlin. Thanks so much for the info. I'm a little worried now.. Why this much? Dr. West was so conservative in his treatment last time (CSF reducers only 6 months ago) and I have not seen any change in clinical signs since then, she was and is doing well even without painkillers. He picked up on a subtle change during clinical exam, but said he wouldnt call it "a decline" he said he may have just caught her on a bad day but has to go with what he sees.
So Im confused why all of a sudden such a high dose? I will phone him and ask. What is the usual starting dosage on claire's scheme? Would it be crazy to lower her dose to 100 mg 3 times a day myself until I get a hold of him? She is also on 8 mg of omeprazole once a day.
 
Well thank goodness! I was in canine cafe Saturday (barbara the owner makes treats and sells them around the country) saying that someone said they were not healthy. She reviewed the ingredients and said she can't see why. Maybe they are just fattening. They work so well but I suggest getting the bigger ones and splitting them. (More for money).

Active Ingredient(s): For dogs; Chicken, Wheat flour, Glycerin, Vegetable oil, Dried corn syrup, Wheat gluten, Corn flour, Natural flavors, Lecithin, Brewer's dried yeast, Potassium sorbate (to preserve freshness), Salt, Methylcellulose, L-ascorbic acid phosphate (source of vitamin C) mixed tocopherols, Vitamin E supplement.

Well, yeah, these are crap ingredients and added salt in addition! I wouldn't use them. I've had great success coating pills with raw honey and I use cheese spread (low fat, low sodium) for dogs not in heart failure or kidney failure. I wouldn't feed any food, even small amounts, containing most of these ingredients.

Pat
 
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