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markyyyyyy
22nd July 2012, 10:36 PM
Hi all,

We chose our puppy today (so cute!) and are collecting it in 3 weeks time.
A week after we move in, a group of my friends are coming up for two night out, and i do not really want to leave the puppy in the kitchen downstairs with my friends all night.

Would it be an error in terms of 'leadership' to let it sleep in my bedroom (on the floor in his crate) at such a young age? It would have only had 5 nights in our house before this weekend.

Many thanks for your advice

Mark

Karlin
23rd July 2012, 12:50 PM
Hi and welcome! What fun to be looking forward to a new puppy. :D

Here's the best advice I can give you -- forget whatever you have been reading that talks about 'leadership' and instead just enjoy yourself and use this wonderful, free book (After You Get Your Puppy) available as a download with one of the world's best trainers (and experts of puppies -- the first to really focus on puppy training). You can also download FREE the companion, Before You Get Your Puppy, which will be a perfect read right now as you prepare for the new arrival :):

www.dogstardaily.com/free-downloads

and also see: http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/sirius-puppy-raising-initiative-prospective-and-new-puppy-owners

Don't worry about having your puppy sleep in your bedroom :) (indeed many of us would advise it -- it can be very distressing for a young puppy to be yanked from its mother and siblings to a strange place then left alone all night long without the reassuring presence of the only people it now knows. Many trainers advise simply having the crate in your room at night anyway). Those other approaches are in the opinion of many leading trainers, hogwash and a very old and increasingly challenged view of raising and training a dog -- and one that IMHO is just so sad and makes the whole process out to be a grim battle for control by tiny puppies. Simply not true!! See

http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/alpha-fallacy

http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/misconceptions-mythical-alpha-dog


Today the Family — Tomorrow the World!

From an assortment of books, I have discovered the following cautionary “advice” for owners. Never let a dog stare or jump-up, never stand, crouch or kneel down in front of a dog, never look a dog in the eyes, or reach over his head, never loom over a dog and reach down around his neck, never get down on the floor or allow a dog to stand over you, never give a dog food treats or human food, never allow a dog to eat before the family or go out of a door first, never allow a dog on furniture, upstairs, in the bedroom, or on the bed, never let a dog mount your leg, never let a puppy mouth or bite, and never play chase, tug o' war, or play-fight with a dog. Instead, novice owners are routinely advised to enforce “elevation dominance”, “dominance down-stays”, physical restraint and discipline and especially, the “alpha-rollover” — grabbing a dog by the jowls and forcing him onto his back.

All of these recommendations destroy the fun and enjoyment of living with a dog, most recommendations are just too silly for words, some are counterproductive and others are downright dangerous.

The above behaviors and actions were misconstrued as the dog's intention of dominating people even though these behaviors and situations have absolutely nothing at all to do with social rank or aggression during dog-human interactions. Basically, if an owner is OK with the dog’s behavior, then there is no problem, whereas if the owner is worried about the dog’s behavior and can neither prevent nor control it, then there is a problem.

Chuck
23rd July 2012, 01:18 PM
OMG! I assumed that it was required that all Cavaliers sleep with you!!! We have a choice? The bed is for us humans?

MomObvious
23rd July 2012, 01:49 PM
Hi Welcome!!!

I also advise you to read After You Get Your Puppy. I have a 5 month old named Fletcher, he is my first EVER puppy. If you are going to have your puppy sleep in a crate at night it doesn't matter where the crate is. A lot of people here have their dogs in their bedrooms at night. My goal was to have Fletcher sleep in the bed with us at night AFTER he was potty trained. However, my puppy seems to enjoys chewing fabric, we have already had one indecent of going to the vet for x-rays! Yeah puppy proof as best you can but remember SUPERVISION!!! Fletcher sleeps in an X pen type area (kinda like pictured in Dunbar's book) off our kitchen, which for me works out great because he had access to a doggie door. He is also crate trained, we keep the crate in our living room where all the action is. Because of his chewing habits, Fletcher will be sleeping in his x-pan area until he can be trained out of/out grows this dangerous behavior I hope.

Melissa

My Henry Boy
23rd July 2012, 02:05 PM
Our Henry was in his crate in the living room, but he was waking us all up at 5:30 every day. As soon as he was pretty reliable with going to the bathroom, he's been sleeping in my bed, curled up right along my legs.

Karlin
23rd July 2012, 03:06 PM
OMG! I assumed that it was required that all Cavaliers sleep with you!!! We have a choice? The bed is for us humans?

:lol: yes and there is that angle to the question too.. :rotfl:

Personally I would keep young puppies in the bedroom at night til they reach the age where they easily sleep through the night (as you WILL need to be getting up at 3am or so to take your new puppy outside for a few weeks, almost certainly -- they cannot hold themselves all night). At that point I'd likely either keep them in the bedroom if you wish (the 'dominance' stuff is ridiculous -- it's simply a decision on whether you like having your dog in the room, or not. Lots do!) or set up a system as described in After You Get Your Puppy. But if you want your puppy, in that set-up, in the kitchen from the start, I'd buy a Snugglepuppy or similar to give the pup some comfort in the first few weeks of being entirely alone at night.

I used to have the dogs in my room where they slept on the bed. With a whole posse of dogs, though, it is easier for me to sleep well if they aren;t all there, shifting around all night, so they sleep in pairs in large crates in the next room. It wasn't hard to transition them (and they were already crate trained and are crated/penned in home boarding when I am away) so it wasn't a big shift. When I am out at my partner's house (about half the week) they sleep in a puppy pen in the kitchen, in two dog beds. So it is nonsense that they will think they run the house simply because they sleep in the bedroom or must be there from the start or will never be able to switch. I don't know why some books and trainers still peddle this idea. Owners simply need to put in the time to train their dog to do what they'd like and don't like. :D

sunshinekisses
23rd July 2012, 03:10 PM
All my dogs sleep in the bedroom. I made the mistake of letting my male cavalier sleep in bed with us when he was a little pup, and now at 2 years old he still is sleeping in our bed. Unfortunately now that he is older he requires more sleeping space. :)

Love my Cavaliers
23rd July 2012, 05:46 PM
My SM dog, Riley sleeps in the bed with us, but she sleeps at our feet and never moves all night. Oliver sleeps in our room but in his own bed. Maddie and Oz sleep together in a separate room. I could not sleep with them. They like to sleep pressed up against me or on top of me so that I can't move. I sleep far better without them in the room and they sleep just fine in the room by themselves. i keep two dog beds plus a really big crate with the door open in there. Usually they sleep together in the crate. But they're so adaptable. When they're at the pet sitters, they're all in crates at night and are just fine. When I'm out of town, my husband doesn't like to sleep with any of them in the bed or even in the room (they snore) so they all go in the room where Maddie and Oz sleep- and they're all fine.

DZee
23rd July 2012, 06:58 PM
Our ( 12 lb. Cavalier) Wrigley and our ( 108 lb. labrador) Zeb both sleep in our bedroom.
Wrigley stays there all night..but Zeb gets too hot..and will go lie on the cold floor in the kitchen.
It's not so bad w/ Wrigley in the bed...but sometimes w/ Zeb ..and my hubby..there is little room left for ME ! ;)

p.s. I might add that Wrigley was not allowed to sleep in the bed till he was completely potty-trained. He did however sleep in the room ( in his crate/pen)...and was quite happy there. He still goes to nap there at times.

Stacy De
23rd July 2012, 09:24 PM
Congratulations on your soon to be new addition!!!

Cody started out in his crate next to the bed from day one. It was easier on me to get up during the night to get him out. As soon as he was sleeping the entire night thru we let him sleep in our bed. I have to admit he has taken over my pillow, he sleeps on most of it, along with sleeping on my forehead or sometimes wrapped around my neck. Never thought I would be able to sleep like that, but somehow it works for the 2 of us :) My husband just laughs and says he is glad its my pillow and not his that Cody picked!!

Dillboy
23rd July 2012, 09:57 PM
When we first got Dillon he slept in his crate in the hallway where it was coolest (August is V. hot and humid here) I slept for weeks on our hallway sofa (I'm an easy sleeper...) and woke myself every 2-3 hours to take him outside, then back to his crate. Within weeks I'd gradually left longer and longer between get ups, so I was making just the one or two and quite soon he was going through the night and I'd moved back upstairs to bed....then once he was a little more trustworthy around the house we let him choose either his crate or with us - now its summer again and he's with us in the bedroom on the cold floor....Dillon is just turned 1 year. I can honestly say that only once did he cry at night and that was when he was teething so we just brought him to bed and he settled and slept fine. We have both our dogs in the bedroom and feel very comfortable with them being there, but I accept it is a matter of personal choice :)

CSutherland
23rd July 2012, 10:25 PM
Having never had an inside dog, we did so many things wrong with Bentley. He turned out wonderfully in spite of us. It never occurred to us to have him in our room at night; he slept in a crate in the next room andI was able to hear him if he needed to potty. That was from January to November when he had knee surgery. We couldn't get him in the crate with the 'cone' on his head so moved his bed to the bedroom and he's been there ever since. He can tell when it's about bedtime. He waddles in, usually before we start moving that way, and stays there all night without a peep. Hubby has been caught with him in the bed a couple of times, something he swore would NEVER happen! Of course, he swore we'd never have an inside dog, too...

ashleighelizabeth
23rd July 2012, 11:34 PM
When we first brought Sonny home he slept in his crate in our guest bedroom, however a couple of months ago we moved his crate to our bedroom. I love having his crate in our bedroom because I can hear his little sighs and soft little snores. So cute! He loves his crate and puts himself to bed when he is tired.

We chose crate training for a number of reasons, but I personally have stuck with it even after he has been potty trained because he seems to love his crate and I don't want him to become unaccustomed to it and then stress out when he has to sleep in there when he is at his dog sitter's house.

Dillboy
24th July 2012, 10:39 AM
We chose crate training for a number of reasons, but I personally have stuck with it even after he has been potty trained because he seems to love his crate and I don't want him to become unaccustomed to it and then stress out when he has to sleep in there when he is at his dog sitter's house.

Yes, we've kept our crate as our older dog, a cocker spaniel so likes it.....plus Dillon is very happy going in it when asked, and just a place of quiet and calm - in fact we hardly notice the crate is there anymore though we have tried to disguise it with a matching colour curtain over the top. He is totally at home in his den.........:)

MomObvious
24th July 2012, 12:02 PM
Yes, we've kept our crate as our older dog, a cocker spaniel so likes it.....plus Dillon is very happy going in it when asked, and just a place of quiet and calm - in fact we hardly notice the crate is there anymore though we have tried to disguise it with a matching colour curtain over the top. He is totally at home in his den.........:)


I believe dogs should continue to use their crates their whole lives. My parents learned this the hard way once. When we were kids we had a dog (small breed) actually get on TOP of the fridge and eat all our Halloween candy, 3 buckets full! Luckily it did not kill the dog but after that all dogs were crated whenever we left the house.

Melissa

markyyyyyy
24th July 2012, 12:31 PM
Hi all,

many thanks for your help, it has been so helpful.

So I think I will go ahead and allow our pup to sleep in the crate on the bedroom floor during the night.
As I have never had a pup before, do they make noises when they need the loo or is it just a case of waking up every couple of hours during the night to take him down to go to the toilet.

Many thanks

Mark

ashleighelizabeth
24th July 2012, 03:18 PM
Yes, we've kept our crate as our older dog, a cocker spaniel so likes it.....plus Dillon is very happy going in it when asked, and just a place of quiet and calm - in fact we hardly notice the crate is there anymore though we have tried to disguise it with a matching colour curtain over the top. He is totally at home in his den.........:)

http://www.etsy.com/listing/94727587/36l-dog-crate-cover-choose-from-100s-of?ref=sr_gallery_5&ga_search_query=dog+crate+covers&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_ship_to=ZZ&ga_min=0&ga_max=0&ga_search_type=all

I want to get one of these crate covers from Etsy eventually, but I keep waiting to see if we are going to need a bigger crate or not.

Dillboy
24th July 2012, 03:58 PM
Oh my goodness!!! please don't tempt me...............:D that cover is so much nicer than my efforts....

ashleighelizabeth
24th July 2012, 04:47 PM
Hi Mark,

Sonny from the beginning would always let us know when he needed to go out. I can't remember exact ages, but I know by about 3 or 4 months he was only waking up once a night. Remember to not let him have play time on these midnight outings, he should just go out there and do his business and then go right back to his crate. Good luck! Can't wait to see pics of your little one!


Hi all,

many thanks for your help, it has been so helpful.

So I think I will go ahead and allow our pup to sleep in the crate on the bedroom floor during the night.
As I have never had a pup before, do they make noises when they need the loo or is it just a case of waking up every couple of hours during the night to take him down to go to the toilet.

Many thanks

Mark

MomObvious
24th July 2012, 04:47 PM
Hi all,

many thanks for your help, it has been so helpful.

So I think I will go ahead and allow our pup to sleep in the crate on the bedroom floor during the night.
As I have never had a pup before, do they make noises when they need the loo or is it just a case of waking up every couple of hours during the night to take him down to go to the toilet.

Many thanks

Mark


Most dog do not want to potty where they sleep. If you hear your puppy wake during the night I would take him potty then right back in the crate. Since like babies, your goal is to get them to sleep thur the night so I would not recommend waking a puppy or a baby at night. Fletcher is my first puppy ever too, so I was super stressed about potty training but if you follow "the rules" it was easy.


The Rules:

1. Go out, go out , go out.......take your puppy to use the potty outside like every hour and a half or so, I found a schedule worked well. Praise when he does right.
2. SUPERVISION if the puppy is more than arms length away from someone actively watching them you are giving him too much freedom.
3. Clean up accidents quickly and all the way, use a good pet cleaner to clean up after accidents you need to try and remove all the smell.
4. Time, with Fletcher it really didn't take long. Tho he had not had an accident in more than 3 weeks, I still watch him closely....


Melissa

cpell009
24th July 2012, 05:23 PM
I let Lady sleep in bed with me from day 1, except she is also crate trained during the day because that is where she stays while I am at work (although Im considering moving towards the kitchen-crate set up). She did have a couple accidents in bed but I learned to tell when she wanted to go pee when she wakes up and starts walking around the bed. Im a pretty light sleeper so I wake up right away to take her out, but by 4 months she knew not to go on the bed anymore.

I remember reading a book about cavaliers before getting Lady, and the author mentioned that many become "cavalier bonnets" if you let them sleep in your bed. I wasnt dissapointed :) She sleeps curled around my neck or under the blankets in the crook of my knees, shes so funny. Im picking up a 3 year old year blenheim girl in a couple weeks, so it looks like I might be smothered, but Im SO looking forward to it. Future boyfriends may not be so impressed...LOL

PammyO
24th July 2012, 05:28 PM
So its kind of like having kids. You read all the books and try and do everything correct. I must have every book written about Cavaliers and read them all when I was waiting for Bodie. And then you get the puppy.... And it doesn't always work the way you thought it would. Bodie would have been soooo unhappy if he had not been close to us in the beginning. He slept quietly in his crate next to our bed for many months. Then he would end up in our bed from time to time and before long he was sleeping with us. We love having him in our bed and wouldn't have it any other way. But you will find what works best for you. There are no wrong answers with these guys as they just want to please you and make you happy. Enjoy every puppy moment- good and bad! They will only be that age once.

DZee
24th July 2012, 05:33 PM
So its kind of like having kids. You read all the books and try and do everything correct. I must have every book written about Cavaliers and read them all when I was waiting for Bodie. And then you get the puppy.... And it doesn't always work the way you thought it would. Bodie would have been soooo unhappy if he had not been close to us in the beginning. He slept quietly in his crate next to our bed for many months. Then he would end up in our bed from time to time and before long he was sleeping with us. We love having him in our bed and wouldn't have it any other way. But you will find what works best for you. There are no wrong answers with these guys as they just want to please you and make you happy. Enjoy every puppy moment- good and bad! They will only be that age once.

Great answer....and so true*

MomObvious
24th July 2012, 06:35 PM
So its kind of like having kids. You read all the books and try and do everything correct. I must have every book written about Cavaliers and read them all when I was waiting for Bodie. And then you get the puppy.... And it doesn't always work the way you thought it would. Bodie would have been soooo unhappy if he had not been close to us in the beginning. He slept quietly in his crate next to our bed for many months. Then he would end up in our bed from time to time and before long he was sleeping with us. We love having him in our bed and wouldn't have it any other way. But you will find what works best for you. There are no wrong answers with these guys as they just want to please you and make you happy. Enjoy every puppy moment- good and bad! They will only be that age once.


You may have read all the books but I'm sure your puppy hasn't read a word. Sometimes you just have to go with your heart when it comes to raising things.....pets, kids even the veggie garden.

Melissa

PammyO
26th July 2012, 12:48 AM
You are absolutely right and I have found that what worked for Bodie has not worked for my daughter's dog Buckley! They are as different as night and day coming from the same breed.

Lukesmom
31st July 2012, 04:56 AM
Luke started out in his crate in my room when I first got him. Once I could trust him through the night, he moved into my bed. He usually sleeps in the bottom corner. Sometimes he sleeps between my knees, but I usually move him or move my leg out from around him or it does all sorts of weirdness to my hips. Sometimes he'll go sleep on the floor. I had a bed for him when he was a puppy, but he always peed on it, so actually, the cat has that bed now. He got a bed for the holidays from a friend of mine (I am in a local dog walking group. We had a holiday party, and I decided to take the gift in the big box for him). He has slept on it occasionally, or sometimes he will sleep on a piece of laundry that missed the basket. I guess he does that if it gets too hot. Usually my other dog, who is 40lbs, sleeps in Luke's little bed. She is allowed in the bed, but I think I moved around too much and kicked her, so she left.