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View Full Version : What would you do?



Karlin
1st August 2012, 08:15 PM
This happens to your dog, and you don't do the obvious? Sheesh- just build a fence!

http://www.ksdk.com/news/article/330653/3/Dog-collar-concerns

And use a safe and comfortable fabric or leather collar, while you're at it... :rolleyes:

karen baker
1st August 2012, 09:30 PM
o.m.g.!!! I,am actually lost for words, what is wrong with people?? I don.t even know how this collar managed to become available to pet owners, to me its inflicting pain. perhaps the pet owners should give it a try, I,am shocked. Karen,Ruby and Sadie :shock:

MomObvious
1st August 2012, 09:38 PM
Anyone dumb enough to use this system needs to try it on themselves first!!!!!! Who in their right mind would EVER consider shocking their dog???? That poor dog and the injury went unnoticed for days?!?!?!? Personally if you own a dog and need a fence buy a fence. These products should not be on the market period.

Melissa

DZee
1st August 2012, 10:56 PM
I agree..I would never have one of these ( I do not like them at all !!) ..but before we pass judgement..this incident is not entirely the pet owners fault.
They probably never imagined this device would do damage like that. We do not know how quickly this device caused this trauma either. Yes..they should of taken the collar off the dog while inside..and yes..they should of checked under the collar more frequently than they did.
However....We have friends that live in NEW subdivisions & they are not allowed to put up ANY fence!
They are even told what mailbox to put up....out door lighting...type of trees, etc.
SOOOO they have no alternative but to use these electronic fences or take their dog out on a leash constantly.
I am going to show our friends this video...but they..as I'm sure these owners... love their dog..and would never for a second want to be doing it harm.

We are blessed in that we have lived in our home now for 27 yrs....it is an older neighborhood...w/ established trees, etc...and we have the freedom to put up the fence we want. Our entire yard is fenced in...or I seriously do not know what we would do.

Kate H
2nd August 2012, 12:17 AM
But if you already have a dog, surely the need to keep it safe is one of the things you take into consideration when deciding to move into a new house? And if you live in an unfenced house - and aren't allowed to build a fence - perhaps you shouldn't have a dog while you live there? It's skewed thinking to buy a dog and only then start thinking about its welfare in your home.

Kate, Oliver and Aled

DZee
2nd August 2012, 01:21 AM
But if you already have a dog, surely the need to keep it safe is one of the things you take into consideration when deciding to move into a new house? And if you live in an unfenced house - and aren't allowed to build a fence - perhaps you shouldn't have a dog while you live there? It's skewed thinking to buy a dog and only then start thinking about its welfare in your home.

Kate, Oliver and Aled

Perhaps you're right. I do not like these things...so I am not advocating them...but I just doubt that most people would ever consider an electronic fence ( w/ the collar device) to cause such a traumatic injury.
If they did...I am sure no responsible pet owner would choose to have the system installed.

Truth is....those subdivisions where NO FENCES are part of the rules are all over here in the Midwest.
Almost all developers that have built homes within the last 15 yrs....have rules...NOT allowing fences is a part of them. It's a bit ridiculous IMO.

So moving & finding homes that do allow a fence?....a person would be looking into older neighborhoods like ours..and those homes are much harder to come by.

Council members and trustee's of the HOA need to change their guidelines in these new developments.
Less discrimination for pet owners.


I see in this video that these people's neighbors DO have a nice fence though...so perhaps they will have their electronic one removed ASAP..and opt for a real fence instead.

Karlin
2nd August 2012, 11:06 AM
I agree that this is an issue that needs dog owners to lobby those places that do not allow fences (though I would also argue that people are not entitled to a dog if they cannot provide a safe and appropriate environment for it --if they can't have a fence and won't put the active time into therefore walking and getting out with their dog, that they don't live in a situation appropriate to owning and giving quality time to a dog. Full stop).

For me, the bottom line is -- WHY do people feel that even if they can't build a fence, they need an invisible fence? There are so many known problems with invisible fences including that trainers regularly see dogs with all sorts of fear aggression problems or severe timidity that have been subjected to these stupid things (like the dog in the story! Just amazes me that they aren't thinking -- doh! I electrocuted my dog! I will never put this hideous device (that can malfunction, too), back on a dog I love! Instead they think -- oh, I'll just change the level at which I electrocute my dog).

Millions upon millions of people all over the world own dogs in places that do not have gardens and where dogs can never just be turned loose outside-- my city house for example. Like all those millions of millions of other dog owners, I just take the dogs to the park daily for a run --this is not a big deal for me or the dogs! And they get 4 walks a day (my partner has plenty of land and we have fenced an acre or so of it ourselves so dogs have plenty of room to run around when I am out there during the week -- and really, it makes little difference to them which place they are at).

Invisible fences do absolutely nothing that a caring owner should want for their dog. They do not prevent the dog from being attacked -- indeed they are left there like sitting ducks for any passing aggressive dog, cruel adult or child, with no where to go. They do not prevent the supposedly beloved pet from being taken by thieves or worse -- cavaliers in particular are attractive to thieves, one of the easiest most friendly dogs to take and easy to sell on to puppy farmers, backyard breeders or unsuspecting families or kept to use as a breeding dog. Or to be sold as fighting dog bait. And they do not ensure that a dog won't risk the shock to get out -- and never return. Perhaps to be immediately be hit by a car as it runs out into a road in front of the house.

Who could possibly want to risk their dog in these ways? :(

Sure, not being able to put the dog outside and then do something else, means the owner has more responsibility and needs to spend more time giving their dog some quality exercise, but why do people who don't want to give their dog this kind of time daily, and have this kind of active fun, get a dog in the first place? Just sticking the dog in the garden is NOT adequate exercise or activity. Any trainer will concur that a dog would much rather spend an hour with -- WITH! -- it's owner, on a long walk or hike or playing safely and freely in a local park, than be shunted into a garden where most will just lie about anyway, not 'exercise themselves'.

In much of Europe electric training collars are illegal -- these electric fence collars function autonomously in the same way and in the opinion of many, should also be illegal.

Soushiruiuma
2nd August 2012, 03:41 PM
I haven't been able to afford a home with a fenced yard for several years (got a nice one in Belgium though), but having a pet is part of my life. I really enjoy spending the time with my dogs. Playing with my dogs is an opportunity to de-stress from the day, clear my head, and get fresh air; one I might not bother to take if they weren't there. But they sit home all day, and really 30 minutes to hour of decent exercise is not very much for them to ask for all the love and sweetness they give.

It always baffles me why people get a dog just to be a lawn ornament, they really miss out on the good part of owning a pet, and the dog suffers.

I find it hard to believe this dog was so much a part of their family though, checking a collar takes literally 2 seconds while petting your dog. And wouldn't they have to take off a battery operated collar to bathe him? I didn't see anywhere they mentioned how long the collar was on, but I suspect "quite some time".

sunshinekisses
2nd August 2012, 08:34 PM
Lack of education combined with human laziness.

A few years ago we left our rottweiler with a boarding kennel and without our consent they used an electric collar on him the whole week stay. When we got home we found two injuries that looked like burn marks on his neck. The vet said it was from having the collar on the whole time and it caused the same injury as the dog in the story. Luckily it was only on for the week. We have never taken our dogs back to the facility. :(

I think people just don't understand how harmful these training devices are. They are only for training purposes and should not be used without supervision and only when training. So sad for the dog.

MomObvious
2nd August 2012, 09:32 PM
I find it hard to believe this dog was so much a part of their family though, checking a collar takes literally 2 seconds while petting your dog. And wouldn't they have to take off a battery operated collar to bathe him? I didn't see anywhere they mentioned how long the collar was on, but I suspect "quite some time".

Yeah I thought the same things this dog was not a loving member of the family, how did they not notice the wound faster. Could you imagine??? I hope they pay more attention to the dog now.

sunshinekisses- I would have had a fit at that place. I hope they paid the vet bills as least...Personally I would have wanted to the place charged with animal cruelty. But I have very little tolerance for people "doing harm" to children or animals.

Melissa

Soushiruiuma
3rd August 2012, 09:52 AM
Yeah I thought the same things this dog was not a loving member of the family...
Melissa

Just nitpicking. I suspect the dog was a loving family member, I'm doubting the people.

Imagine if you left a wrist watch on your child so tight for so long that the skin underneath died and got infected, they'd call the authorities!

Karlin
3rd August 2012, 12:24 PM
You do wonder how no one could notice the festering wound under the collar... :yikes I do totally understand missing other things like strange lumps and bumps or suddenly swollen anal glands for example as most dog owners don't handle their entire dog every single day or check all these places, but I'd handle/stroke/massage my dogs around the neck and face every day and handle their collars too (I mean if you are walking the dog daily most would be doing so on a collar, for a larger dog like this)-- and how tight must a collar be on, to miss such discomfort? :( There should always be a comfortable one or two-fingers' looseness on a dog collar; it should never ever be snug.

My Henry Boy
3rd August 2012, 03:32 PM
We are fenced, and Henry is still walked out on a leash several times a day. I wish they would outlaw these horrid devices! There are better options. I can't see how this poor dogs wounds festered and stank before being noticed. Like Karlin I brush over Henry everyday and feel all around his body while petting him. His collar is removed when he's put in his crate and when he comes to bed with me (his tags jingle). It's not that difficult to remove and clip on a collar :-/.

DZee
14th August 2012, 05:13 PM
As most of you mentioned...if this dog was a part of the family....one would think it would be petted and loved on "daily". It is rather sad this was not noticed sooner.
I just wonder if it was strictly used for hunting..and nothing more?

I know many times I see hunting dogs kept outside in what I consider " small" enclosures. My nephew is a well known Dentist in our area who is also an avid hunter. He lives in almost a million dollar home. He has 2 labradors. Neither of them are ever allowed inside. The poor things seem to have a life where they are ignored ( except for food & water) until time to go hunting.
I asked about this?..and was told that it makes for a better hunting dog if not shown a bunch of affection. He said it keeps them more focused if they just get praise when they bring back a duck/pheasant or what have you.
I didn't know what to say?
...I love my nephew..but does that sound like nonsense or what?

P.S. Glad my husband was never into hunting...

ashleighelizabeth
14th August 2012, 06:09 PM
As most of you mentioned...if this dog was a part of the family....one would think it would be petted and loved on "daily". It is rather sad this was not noticed sooner.
I just wonder if it was strictly used for hunting..and nothing more?

I know many times I see hunting dogs kept outside in what I consider " small" enclosures. My nephew is a well known Dentist in our area who is also an avid hunter. He lives in almost a million dollar home. He has 2 labradors. Neither of them are ever allowed inside. The poor things seem to have a life where they are ignored ( except for food & water) until time to go hunting.
I asked about this?..and was told that it makes for a better hunting dog if not shown a bunch of affection. He said it keeps them more focused if they just get praise when they bring back a duck/pheasant or what have you.
I didn't know what to say?
...I love my nephew..but does that sound like nonsense or what?

P.S. Glad my husband was never into hunting...

My husband's family belongs to a duck club and he grew up hunting with his dad, grandpa and brother. They had two golden retrievers at different times while he was growing up that they took hunting. Both of these dogs had been professionally trained to hunt at these summer camps they would go to for like 3 months at a time. My husband said it was so sad when they had to drop the dog off, but picking him up was always the best. But both of these dogs were always a part of their family and would be in the house and loved and cuddled like any other pet. That is so sad for the hunting dogs that are never given any affection and not treated like a pet. :(

Karlin
14th August 2012, 06:31 PM
A few years ago we left our rottweiler with a boarding kennel and without our consent they used an electric collar on him the whole week stay. When we got home we found two injuries that looked like burn marks on his neck. The vet said it was from having the collar on the whole time and it caused the same injury as the dog in the story. Luckily it was only on for the week. We have never taken our dogs back to the facility.

OMG, missed this before. Real jaw-dropping stuff -- I would think possibly the basis of legal action too if not specifically indicated to clients that they will treat dogs this way! And so sad -- I suspect they felt perhaps that a rottie because of breed had to be 'safely' managed in this inhumane and potentially dangerous way (not just to his physical health but also potentially creating an aggressive dog). Sad such ignorant people are running a dog care facility!! :yikes

The story of the labs makes me think of the line farmers often take with collies -- that they cannot neuter them or they don't manage sheep as well, hence the females often have endless litters they dump into pounds (at best) and very often simply drown or kill in other ways. :( I've known hunters with hunting dogs and all were family dogs as well. Labs are such people-oriented dogs -- hate to think of a life in kennels.

DZee
14th August 2012, 06:36 PM
My husband's family belongs to a duck club and he grew up hunting with his dad, grandpa and brother. They had two golden retrievers at different times while he was growing up that they took hunting. Both of these dogs had been professionally trained to hunt at these summer camps they would go to for like 3 months at a time. My husband said it was so sad when they had to drop the dog off, but picking him up was always the best. But both of these dogs were always a part of their family and would be in the house and loved and cuddled like any other pet. That is so sad for the hunting dogs that are never given any affection and not treated like a pet. :(

My brother-in-law..and our nephew?....yeah..they all belong to a Duck club as well. Hunting & fishing is their thing. They seem to go every weekend.
I don't understand though..this is how they have always viewed their dogs...and it makes me sad.
Truthfully..I would love to go sit in the kennel w/ them and hug on them awhile. I am sure he cares about them or loves them in his own way.....but to ME? ..it is selfish to to use a dog strictly like this. I think any animal deserves to be shown love and affection. Even if those dogs LIVE to go out hunting...I just believe it wouldn't deter their retrieving abilities one bit if allowed to be more a part of the family.
Our brother-in-law no longer owns a dog..but he did the same thing. Their dog/s were for hunting only & lived outdoors.
Just sad.