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Vaccination Nightmare!

If i remember right, the intranasal bordatella vaccination is faster acting than the injection, you can have it done relatively last minute if you need it for unexpected boarding or something, but immunity doesn't last as long as the injection. And the injection doesn't last that long as it is.

See for example
http://www.vetinfo.com/dencyclopedia/debort.html

This page
http://www.petplace.com/dogs/nasal-or-injectable-which-vaccine-is-best-for-your-dog/page1.aspx
(scroll down)

has some information I hadn't heard before--they say the intranasal should only be given the first time, and not for boosters, and not if the dog has previously had bordetella. I dont know why, they don't say, but they say this conclusion is based on research--something to look into.
They also discuss potential side effects of the intranasal vaccination--good to know about if you're going to use it so that you'll know why the symptoms are happening.

Here's an abstract of the study referred to in the article linked above. The bottom line is that in this study, the intranasal vaccine was found to not be effective in dogs that had been previously vaccinated or otherwise exposed to bordetella. The researchers recommend that it not be used except as an initial vaccination. I wonder if there's other research that shows a different finding.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12680446&dopt=Abstract
 
This is from the UC Davis Veterinary Medicine Teaching Hospital vaccination guidelines, based on current research findings:

Canine Non-Core Vaccines
Non-core vaccines are optional vaccines that should be considered in light of the exposure risk of the
animal, ie. based on geographic distribution and the lifestyle of the pet. Several of the diseases involved
are often self-limiting or respond readily to treatment. Vaccines considered as non-core vaccines are
canine parainfluenza virus (CPiV), distemper-measles combination vaccine, Bordetella bronchiseptica,
Leptospira spp., and Borrelia burgdorferi. Vaccination with these vaccines is generally less effective in
protecting against disease than vaccination with the core vaccines.
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http://www.vmth.ucdavis.edu/vmth/cl..."efficacy of intranasal bordetella injection"
 
Lisa_T said:
Wow! I'm another who's pretty certain that doesn't happen in the UK. I rather think that puppy shots (ie, first vaccs, at least) are combined with a full health check before the pup(s) are sold. Of course, you're still supposed to bring your new pup to your own vet regardless of the pup's vacc and breeder declared status!
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Ours go for a final health check a week or so before they go to their forever homes; that's also when they get their microchip. And, yes, we strongly recommend (but don't require) that puppy people bring their puppy to their own vet within a week or so of getting the puppy.

Our vet knows we vaccinate the puppies (and our own dogs) ourselves and there are never any questions. With the thousands of dollars we spend every year and all the new patients we have sent them, I don't think she would want to make us mad ;) . In fact, we have been kidding her about building a new wing and naming it after us :D
 
Kingston's Mom,

I hate to say this but you have just learned a BIG lesson about Vets and nice areas!

Just because someone is in a nice area it doesn't mean they are a nice person or a good Vet :(

We have 3 practices in our town. The first is a HUGE animal hospital in the centre of town. They are grossly overpriced, run an apoointments system and the staff are stand offish and rude.

The second is in an expensive part of town and has just been bought into by one of the Vets who used to work in my own Vets. No one can understand her as she's bought into a practice that has an appalling reputation and tbh I am really surprised that the Vet who has owned it for many years and is now retiring, hasn't been struck off. I think everyone who has used his surgery over the years has a horrific story to tell - I know I have :yikes

The third practice and the one that I use, is in an old part of town nestled in amongst Victorian terraced houses. It has a tiny car park where we all jostle for space and it is just a 'sit and wait' system. You announce your arrival and get logged in then just wait until you are called. If an emergency comes in, it is taken for granted that they will be attended to first. The Vets are all wonderful and whenever I have had a poorly animal I have been told that if I am worried out of hours then just ring their emergency number - I have done in the past and either got advice or a Vet has come out.

Their prices are really good too but above all, they have the nicest staff and the Vets are wonderful :D Alison wishes she was nearer to me so she could bring her babies there too as she thinks my Vet is lovely :lol:

In all the years I have been going there, I have never had a cause to complain about them. How many practices would let their Vets spend 45 minutes talking to someone on the phone about their animal without charging them a penny?
 
Donna,

Your James is the best vet on this earth, and what makes it even better is that he has three Cav's himself and he UNDERSTANDS the breed.

Thats where they all seem to go wrong these vets and like every breeder will tell you ..."Every breed is so different" and how very right they are. Different health issues, different temperments....just all so different.

So while we quite rightly out of worry and frustration give them all a hard time try to help your vet along a bit, make them understand your breed, your particular problems/concerns....take with you concerning health articles, teach them! YOU pay the bill for them to look after YOUR dog, if you are not happy shop around, ask for friends opinions to their vets, ask to see the practice inside and out, and only when you are 100% happy take your baby along.

Yes Donna I really wish I had James on my doorstep, you are so very lucky, he was marvelous with darling Annie-Belle when you looked after her for me when on my holls, he is 1 in a million!

A pleasure to visit as well may I add girls!! ;) quite yummy!

Alison, Wilts, U.K.
 
Hey Donna,

On reading your post, I would have assumed you were going to my vet!!!

Those vets that are really local and "advertised" do charge the higher prices and don't form a bond with any of their patients owners in any way.

My vet (is one that we as a family have used for over 20 years) - they originally only dealt with farm animals and then small animals so they all have a tendancy to bond with you in the same way they would a farmer.

Even the girls on reception will give you advice and will calm you down if you are in a panic.

The vets themselves are fabulous especially uncle Ian and Aunty Hilary ( of Rufford Vetinary group) who are currently treating one of my mum's goldens who has lymphoma sarcoma - even to the point they have given my mum their home numbers in case she needs help in the middle of the night. So I would like to say that there are some VERY good vets out there, it just takes time to find the right one for you and your fur babies.
 
KingstonsMom said:
Thank you for all the comments. It makes me feel much better to know that many breeders do their own vaccinations. I'm going to contact my breeder and ask her if she can come up with an official shot record for me somehow.

I promised Kingston that I will NEVER take him back to that vet after what happened last week. Kingston started having a bad case of diarhea so I called the vet for help. I was told "Sorry, we can't see him today." No advice, no nothing. I naively thought this would be a good veterinarian because he's located in the nicest part of the city. Too bad they tried to get me to buy everything under the sun, including a rattlesnake vaccine!!! (I live in an urban apartment!)

But thanks again for your concern. Kingston is doing much better today! I'm going to search for a vet who does the bordatella through the nose. No more shots for my little guy!
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Kingstonsmom,
If you're not already doing this, give little Kingston little yummy treats when he is at the vets office to help him see this as a positive experience, not a negative one. We have been doing this with our cavvies, and they actually love going to the vets.

BTW, Kingston's photo is absolutely adorable!

Also, the bordetella drops for the nose are usually given when you need quicker protection, like if you're due for a bordetella shot, but you're boarding your dog within a short period of time. The vet may still want to give a bordetella shot at your next appointment to provide longer protection. So the nose drops are considered to be more temporary. :flwr:
 
If your vet was uncertain as to whether or not the breeder really gave the vaccinations.....why couldn't your vet have done titers?? I guess if it were me, I wouldn't trust that vet any more. Too many vets like to load up dogs and puppies with way too many vaccinations. And I do realize that most vaccinations are very necessary, especially puppies. But, a couple friends of mine have titers drawn to see whether or not a vaccination is even needed. A lot less stress on the dog.
 
Alison_Leighfield said:
Yes Donna I really wish I had James on my doorstep, you are so very lucky, he was marvelous with darling Annie-Belle when you looked after her for me when on my holls, he is 1 in a million!

A pleasure to visit as well may I add girls!! ;) quite yummy!

Alison, Wilts, U.K.
Click to expand...

Well, you know the answer - move nearer :lol: Yes, I think he's one in a million & so do all the Cavalier owners around here too. He upset my neighbour the other week though. They took Harvey (GSD) to see him and he told them that they wouldn't have so many problems if they got a 'proper' dog like a Cavalier :lol: He was joking but they didn't see it that way hahahaha

And yes, Alison, he is a pleasure to visit but he's far too young for either of us and he got married last year too. His poor wife has to put up with him losing everything as soon as he puts it down and just generally leaving mass destruction behind him - she's a lovely girl who has my sympathies :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: They had all three dogs dressed up for the wedding but the vicar wouldn't let them in the church :x

I was one of the chosen few who were allowed to view the wedding snaps too :D At least he had his hair a normal colour for the wedding too - it's usally blond with reds, blues, greens and yellows in it - sometimes a bit of purple too :lol:
 
WoodHaven said:
Lisa_T said:
Wow! I'm another who's pretty certain that doesn't happen in the UK. I rather think that puppy shots (ie, first vaccs, at least) are combined with a full health check before the pup(s) are sold. Of course, you're still supposed to bring your new pup to your own vet regardless of the pup's vacc and breeder declared status!
Click to expand...

remember that in taking the pups to the vet-- you could very well expose them to the deadly disease (a decent argument ). I take mine to the vet-- I HATE stabbing the lil guys.
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True, but I am in the UK. Given the way we seem to do things here, I'm not sure I have any choice. In any case, I don't get the puppy (currently known as Katie Claret- my mum objected to 'Claret' on the valid grounds that it sounds like 'Carrot' :roll: ) :roll: until after she's had all her puppy shots, and I'll probably wait a month or two before I bring her to the vet.
 
Not sure if its purely physcological but I will be taking my baby to the vets but I will ensure that he does not touch the floor or any other dogs so no greater risk than at home. That's how I did it with Merls and he has been fine.....

I see your point though Bruce/Woodhaven etc., In the UK we seem to be more " it won't happen to me" than you guys in the US. It may or may not be to our benefit in years to come!
 
Do you know if they really sterilize the examing table after the previous patient? I know that one of my vets offices didn't, i watched the other dog walk out and i was told i could go in. And maybe that dog was just there for allergy or a hurt leg, and was vaccinated and not otherwise sick, but i had already wondered that at a previous vet i'd gone to because they are so busy, they see patients all day long, and it wouldn't surprise me if they don't always do it. I've had them come in and clean up after i'm already in the room. I'd like to hope though that if a dog came in with distemper or kennel cough, they would be sure to wash down the table. Most dogs are likely to be vaccinated against distemper of course (and the vaccine is likely to result in lifetime immunity), but something like lepto or kennel cough, the vaccines are short acting and only protect against a small number of the actual strains, so hopefully if those diseases are suspected, they would wash up the exam room. Still, every doctor knows, doctors offices should be avoided as much as possible, they are not the healthiest places in the world to be, and unnecessary trips should be avoided. If breeders can vaccinate puppies as well as vet techs can, that would be safer for a puppy with a vulnerable undeveloped immune system.
 
Judy, I know my vet does - the table is always damp and you can see the wipe marks. My vets are very particular - they even provide treats for those dogs that need other stimulation when having injections. I do think they do think a lot more of their patients that we give them credit for sometimes..... perhaps we are just lucky with our vet
 
Lisa_T said:
True, but I am in the UK. Given the way we seem to do things here, I'm not sure I have any choice. In any case, I don't get the puppy (currently known as Katie Claret- my mum objected to 'Claret' on the valid grounds that it sounds like 'Carrot' :roll: ) :roll: until after she's had all her puppy shots, and I'll probably wait a month or two before I bring her to the vet.
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Hey, I (like many in the USA thought that was a french word)
Here is what I found:

Claret is frequently pronounced in United States English as /klæ'ɹeɪ/ as it is believed to be a French word. Although it is originally from the French word "clairet" the word "claret" is an English invention and thus is traditionally pronounced according to English orthography rules as /klæ'ɹɛt/.

Everyone needs to be aware of the laws of their cities, counties and countries--- Here in the USA - the only shot required is rabies. Each state in the USA individually decides if you need a prescription for the syringe-- but the drugs are available without (as far as I know). IF I need a silly antibiotic-- I need a vet prescription to buy. UNLESS I buy it for fish-- then I can get the meds without (I don't get this at all). IF I want Oxygen for welding-- no prescription---IF I want Oxygen for the puppies-- I need a prescription. (I don't get this at all). Weird
 
WoodHaven said:
Lisa_T said:
Everyone needs to be aware of the laws of their cities, counties and countries--- Here in the USA - the only shot required is rabies. Each state in the USA individually decides if you need a prescription for the syringe-- but the drugs are available without (as far as I know). IF I need a silly antibiotic-- I need a vet prescription to buy. UNLESS I buy it for fish-- then I can get the meds without (I don't get this at all). IF I want Oxygen for welding-- no prescription---IF I want Oxygen for the puppies-- I need a prescription. (I don't get this at all). Weird
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I'm with you on the oxygen thing; I REALLY don't get that at all! Years back when we were getting set up, we ran into the same thing; couldn't get medical oxygen to save our life. Finally, one of the sales reps at a medical supply house told us just to buy welding oxygen. He claimed it was exactly the same thing and purity as medical oxygen. Said it was very important to not have impurities in oxygen used for welding. Been doing that ever since and it's a LOT cheaper; just not packaged in fancy bottles. In fact, for a long time we used an welding oxygen regulator (I used to do some gas welding), a little fussy, but it worked.
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