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Thread: Question on puppy-adult relationships...

  1. #1
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    Default Question on puppy-adult relationships...

    Holly is a bit neurotic for a variety of reasons, and she had minimal exposure to other dogs before the age of eight weeks. She likes other dogs, but very much on her terms (in other words, she likes to tease them and then run away from them).

    She's a sweetie with people, and so far has not been bad with Chloe. However, she won't tolerate Chloe too close to her- partly because Chloe still tends to nip. Should I let Holly take care of this discipline herself (which she does), or intervene myself? Will they naturally become closer as Chloe matures? Or will Holly's caution mean that their relationship will remain pretty much what it is?

    Holly doesn't seem interested in playing with Chloe, although they'll happily follow each other around the house and garden and give each other a good sniff. They also enjoy running after the ring in the park (Holly usually grabs it first and hangs on, but sometimes it seems that she lets Chloe take it, while other times preventing her from doing so)- but when Chloe barks and yips and play bows to Holly in the house, Holly just hides!

    How much of this is normal? Is this a good beginning? Chloe's a much bouncier, much more confident personality than Holly, even though Holly is a strong enough personality in her own way. Part of the problem at the moment is Chloe's youth and lack of training- am I right in assuming that training will help? Is there anything I can do to desensitise Holly to Chloe being nearby? How do I deal with their refusal to sit together and let me pet them- it seems they each want all the attention! Oddly, they both travelled reasonably happily on my lap in the car- but normally Chloe would be in a crate. I also feel guilty since the puppy is taking up more of my time and while I try to redress this while Chloe is sleeping, I'm wondering whether I'm going the wrong way about it. Holly is clearly top dog- should I pay her more attention than Chloe, even when Chloe's around? Any guidance on making this early period of puppy-dog relationship transition as smooth as possible would be greatly appreciated. Both dogs, it has to be said, are very sweet natured. Chloe's confident, but she seems willing to accept Holly's superiority- when Holly chooses to exert it!
    Holly - 7years
    Amber- 3 years

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    Lisa from what I've read is it sounds somewhat normal. Usually most older dogs don't really like putting up with a bouncing puppy in their face. But it all depends on the older dog's age or temperment... What I usually tell ppl who get a puppy who have another dog is the puppy gets everything second, so inotherwords when u come home if Chloe is first to greet u and Holly second u go pet Holly first then Chloe. Also done the same with feeding, getting treats etc... this will show Holly that she is not being replaced and will show Chloe that Holly is in charge...Usually u may need to do this for a couple of weeks to months...

    But as far a Holly being neuratic around Chloe u just need (this is my belief) is to when Chloe wants to play with Holly, who is refusing to play, get down on the floor and play with the 2 of them...Mayb this will take most of Chloe attention off Holly and onto u, and will hopefully let Holly get used to Chloe puppy antics...lol

    I hope it works out wit Holly and Chloe, take care
    Aaron, King and the rest of family
    living in NY

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    Lisa, this is normal. I would make sure to give each dog some private one-on-one time. I haven't experienced bringing a puppy into an adult dog home, but I'm sure others will have lots of great advice.
    Cathy Moon
    India(tri-F) Geordie(blen-M)Chocolate(b&t-F)Charlie(at the bridge)

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    I generally let the adult dog tell the pup off because then it is learning proper dog etticut ( sorry if spelled wrong). But I always supervise so that the older dog doesnt get carried away. Usually once the pup has yelped from shock of being told the older dog stops whats its doing anyway. Thats always been my experience. My friend told her dog off every time it growled at the pup, to the point that now she is too worried to tell the youngster off and he beats up on her. He hasnt learnt respect and now my friend is having other power problems with him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by selina
    I generally let the adult dog tell the pup off because then it is learning proper dog etticut ( sorry if spelled wrong). But I always supervise so that the older dog doesnt get carried away. Usually once the pup has yelped from shock of being told the older dog stops whats its doing anyway. Thats always been my experience. My friend told her dog off every time it growled at the pup, to the point that now she is too worried to tell the youngster off and he beats up on her. He hasnt learnt respect and now my friend is having other power problems with him.
    Lisa, I agree with Selina - they'll work it out. Merlin is the most patient, laid back fella ever and he has taken a lot more than we expected him too. When he's had enough of Oakley swinging on his ears he either plonks a paw on him and pushes him to the ground or goes and takes respbite behind the sofa.

    Have faith, the more worried you are the more worry Holly will be picking up......
    Kirsty
    Merlin and Oakleys Mum (Merlin -Male/B&T/5 years, Oakley - Male/Ruby/3.5years)

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    Glad you said that Kirsty, those are pretty much Holly's exact tactics, though she usually tries to hide first!

    Also, I know about doing everything first with Holly in theory, but it's not always easy. For feeding, for instance, should I crate Chloe, and feed Holly in front of Chloe? For attention, when I'm at work, Chloe comes with me in a doggy travel bag- and she stays in the bag until I've made a fuss of Holly. If both are at home, then I make a fuss of Holly before going to Chloe- but because they're in separate rooms, Chloe doesn't actually see that! Should I make it more visible?
    Holly - 7years
    Amber- 3 years

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    Not totally sure Lisa on the feeding - mine get fed at the same time - Merlin's goes down first and then Oakley's (because Merlin sits first time for his and Oakley doesn't yet)

    At breakfast and lunch I give Merlin a tripe stick before giving Oakley his lunch.....saying that Merlin has had close contact with other dogs at feeding time when he has been on his holidays at the two grandmas so he is used to being fed with and without other dogs present.
    Kirsty
    Merlin and Oakleys Mum (Merlin -Male/B&T/5 years, Oakley - Male/Ruby/3.5years)

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    Default Re: Question on puppy-adult relationships...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa_T
    ... but when Chloe barks and yips and play bows to Holly in the house, Holly just hides!

    How much of this is normal? Is this a good beginning? Chloe's a much bouncier, much more confident personality than Holly, even though Holly is a strong enough personality in her own way. Part of the problem at the moment is Chloe's youth and lack of training- am I right in assuming that training will help?
    i'm not sure but i think i remember you said chloe was 10 weeks when you got her? anyway, very young, and her behaviors are natural to her developmental stage, they do a lot of this with their littermates, they need to, they learn important social skills in the process. It continues throughout puppyhood. I thnk if you tried to train it away too soon, it would be counter to her developmental needs. I brought zack home at a little under 16 weeks. I had visited him three times before i got him, and he was always playing happily with the other puppies at that home, though also exploring around on his own, and coming with me forsome one on one when invited, but the big impression was how he loved bouncing and wrestling and biting with the other puppies. I remember he and a female, Sophie, playing tug with a bully stick, and running around, the day i brought him home.

    when i got him home, he still wanted to play of course, so he tried it with the cat, age 13 at the time, and she has never been of a very playful temperament anyway, so zack never got what he wanted there. I allowed him to play with me with soft biting on my hands, tug o war, rolling around on the floor, like he did with the puppy. It was not as good, but he needed something, because he needed to learn about what was too hard and what was ok just for fun, and when to stop if the othe person/dog said stop. Also it was just fun for me to see him that happy.

    he didn't have another dog to play with for a couple of months. Then my daughter's cavalier, belle, came for a two day visit, and Zack was in heaven. belle was a few months older and hadn't had puppies to play with either, and both played constantly for two days, nonstop. a month or so later i found out there was a dog park in walking distance from my house and started taking zack. He loved it so much, he would get emotional and cry in excitment and desperate longing when we'd get near, and the first couple of times, he continued that crying while he played with the other dogs. He sure seems to need that, less as time goes by, but he loves it.

    A couple of months ago my daughter got a kitten, and they call it "Belle's kitten," because of how they like to play together, they chase each other around. Like human children, playing with other playful peers seems to be a serious emotional and developmental need.

    If i had it to do over...i would find some kind of puppy playgroup for zack right from the beginning, or would take him to the small dog park, as soon as he had all his shots. I wish i'd known about it sooner.

    Choe's lucky that she has Holly, even just to chase around together and follow around in the park, puppies get that from their earlyy experiences at their breeders' homes too--having an older dog around to learn from is so valuable, another thing Zack didn't have. I tried to fill the role as best i could, and fortunately by the time i got him, he was very well socialized, he'd had almost 4 months with puppies, older dogs and lots of people, kids, adults, neighbors' kids, cats, etc.

    i think you're right, a puppy can benefit from age appropriate training. but i wouldn't see her horseplay at her age as somethnig in need of intervention except just letting her know if it's too hard or if it's time to stop, and otherwise joining in her fun, and i believe Holly can be the best judge of when to set limits within their relationship, however she decides to do that. you have to play it by ear of course, it sounds hard to see them not in sync.

    this reminds me a bit of the story of Kayla and Gillian's puppy Abby, the puppy was much more aggressive, and Kayla would go and hide, but i think that has evolved by now. And Linda's Dudley and Darby had some of this kind of adjustment, very normal. A passing stage, probably. Socialization.

  9. #9
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    Lisa,

    Some excellent advice above. Don't reprimand Holly if she tells Chloe off - obviously if she were ripping her to shreds you'd step in but you get my meaning

    Aaron gave you some excellent tips & he's had plenty of practice with puppies he's brought home for King to look after

    As for feeding them, I would just give Holly her food and then put Chloe's down - I wouldn't wait in between it's just the order the dishes go down in that matters the most. Maxx always gets his dinner and treats before charlie does and before any other dog that's here. He is top dog and always will be.

    When we've been out, Charlies goes crazy when we get in and Maxx is very often asleep. I tell Charlie 'go get Maxx' he runs up and wakens him and fetches him and Maxx gets fussed first and then Charlie. They both know they are going to get fussed but they know the pecking order!

    Maxx is very regal in his demeanour (except for when he's robbing the kids' bedroom bins ) and will sit and watch as Charlie winds him up but when he goes too far Maxx will give one low growl and Charlie immediately scuttles off - respect or what? I wish my kids responded to me like that hahahaha

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    Glad for all the comments. Although Chloe is my second Cav pup, Holly wasn't a 'typical' puppy in many ways, so some of this is new. Plus, Holly was 13 weeks when I got her- Chloe was just over 10, so there is a difference.

    A couple of little breakthroughs every day, though.

    Yesterday, both dogs lay nose to nose whilst chewing their sticks on the rug. Ok, so it didn't last long, but it happened completely voluntarily on their part!

    Today, they actually played tug of war a couple of times. OK, in each case I started it off by encouraging Chloe to tug the rope, and then (holding the middle of the rope) encouraging Holly, only letting go when both dogs were into it. Current score: 1 all. Then, this evening, Holly jumped up on my lap when Chloe was already there- not once, but twice! And she let Chloe cuddle to her a little.

    I think there is progress, slowly and steadily!
    Holly - 7years
    Amber- 3 years

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