Pooping on carpet - it's getting very frustrating!!

Our 10 month old Cavalier keeps pooping on the carpet, he only does it down stairs in the basement, he's pretty much house broken, but he does this a couple times a week. We take him out side often, so it's not like he just can't hold it anymore. When he does it we tell him "no" and he knows he's done something wrong, but it doesn't seem to set in. My wife and I have just about had enough, don't know how much more of this we can take. Also, our house smells like pee in some areas, but I haven't found any wet spots on the carpets. Any advise?

Thanks,
Seanboy

you have my sympathy, it's such a helpless feeling when this happens.
Here is a highly recommended book
Shirlee Kalstone's How to Housebreak Your Dog in Seven Days
CLICK
It addresses training an older dog and relapsing dogs.

I think you should get a black light and in the dark, take the light and move it around your carpet , pee will show up as bright spots. Then try drenching the rug in those areas with an enzyme pet mess cleaner such as Natures Miracle, follow the directions. As long as there is pee smell in your house, your dog will be getting the message that inside the house is a legitimate place to eliminate, even though you scold him each time. The smell of pee is like a mixed message to the dog, "yes it's ok to pee in here," even as he is told not to do it.

Getting the smell out should be high urgent priority as otherwise the dog will keep going in the house, pee or poo, the smell says "do it here." Once the smell is removed, he will probably get used to going only outside. You will probably need to use a crate for a while. He can learn what you expect of him.


[edit: fixed link]

Do you have a toilet routine and do you stick to it? do you reward after he has been? do you pop him out after waking, after feeding, after playing. Has something perhaps worried him outside so that he is fearful of going there? can you keep him out of the basement unless one of you is with him?

At ten months alot is changing for him, he is now an adolescent with hormones etc now playing a part as well, perhaps some of this is also scent marking? is he a whole dog, is he an only dog?

I hope you can sort something out, go back to the very basics and try again.

Alison.

I'd buy the book above and restart housetraining from the beginning. As he is mostly housetrained this will be pretty easy -- but what has probably happened is that early on, he was allowed more freedom than his actual level of housetraining warranted. EG you probably thought he was better housetrained than he was and thus did not keep an eye on him at all times, 100% of the time, whether by having him on your lap, tethered to you on a lead, under your eye within arm's reach, or crated (or asleep). If he is going inside a couple of times a week this dog isn't yet housebroken so you will really need to be vigilant and go at this problem carefully. Generally a pup must be watched with this high level of vigilence until around 6-7 months of age and sometimes longer and even then pups only learn VERY slowly, on a room by room basis, that a given room is part of their no-wee/poop area. So others rooms should have been kept off limits til you were 100% certain he was fully housetrained for a room. Just because he was housetrained in say the kitchen doesn;t mean the rest of the house -- it will be a couple of months before you can housetrain a whole house (and still expect the occasional accident for a while).

In general most pups need to be about 12 months before they are ever allowed to roam the house in rooms where you are not watching them otherwise they will (and I mean, WILL!) be going -- small wees that are not easy to see, and sometimes poops, the former in particular that you are unlikely to catch. This is why your house probably smells faintly of wee -- he has indeed been weeing inside and probably for months now. He has also found someplace he has housetrained himself to poop (basement) -- and the scent remains there for him to draw him back as the 'right' place unless you clean with special cleaners as noted above.

The obvious question is: how is it that he is allowed into the basement and is able to poop there without anyone knowing? This is the crux of the problem for you and I think the answer to why you are having the problem -- he is still being given too much freedom in the house if he is doing this and he shouldn't have the chance to keep reinforcing his own 'chosen spots' by the fact that no human has been there at the time to get him outside.

This isn't blaming you for anything as we have all been there -- especially with a small dog, it is easy to *think* the dog is housetrained, especially for first time dog owners or owners who had an especially easy dog to train in the past. This is the *number one mistake* dog owners make in housetraining -- thinking that because the dog hasn't had an accident in a week or two weeks, it is now housetrained and can be left to wander the house.

But a dog can only learn what we are there to teach. It makes NO sense to the dog that it isn;t allowed to wee and poop in house, which is no different to it than the area outside its whelping box as a tiny puppy. The only way it learns is in small and conistent incerements, where the pup is never allowed the opportunity to make a mistake and praised and rewarded for going where we want. Note this is totally different from PUNISHING a dog for what WE perceive as a mistake. Punishing a dog during housetraining is totally counterproductive as it will just associate the punishment with 1) going when you are around or 2) going in that place. Hence scolding, slapping, putting the dog's nose in it, etc, just pushes the dog to go in secret in other rooms which it thinks must be the *right* thing to do. I don't know if this might have anything to do with his stealth wees and poops but think back over how you've tried to housetrain and whether maybe he got some wrong messages by mistake. We tend to think in human logic not dog logic -- we assume the dog can reason when it can't. It's not like talking to a small child. Related to this: saying NO after the fact is just totally confusing to him -- he has no idea why you are saying no and the 'guilty'look is not guilt but a mix of fear and uncerrtainty *because* he knows you are angry and cannot understand why. The only time you should ever say NO in housetraining is if you catch him actually *in the act* -- then quickly say no, scoop him up and carry him outside to finish, then praise and praise once he finishes outside where you want him to. Successful and swift housetraining is based on praise and reward for doing right, eg motivation -- not punishment -- eg fear. I am sure you are far more likely to work hard for your employer when offered the reward of a boonus rather than the punishment of docked pay for not meeting target. Exactly the same with a dog. And we all learn better when motivated positively rather than threatened.

Do get the Kalstone book, which will be big help for you; it explains how to manage just this situation and gives all sorts of schedules and guuidance; and start from square one. Shut the doors in the house to limit his access to all rooms you cannot watch (especially the room where he is pooping! Simply blocking access is one of the best things you can do to get over that particular problem!). Keep him by you at all times or crate him when you can't to make sure he cannot go anywhere else. Thoroughly clean the basement area and consider that you may need to take up the carpet.

If you are very consident you will probably resolve 90% of this problem within about 2-3 weeks -- but I'd keep the basement and other rooms off limits unless you are there with him. Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Very good advice that alot of us can learn from ....thanks Karlin

Jake had developed a lovely little habit of going and pooping in the living room. That was a room we rarely used. So, I gated off that room for several months and cleaned the carpet really well. No more problems.

hi

that's great advice from karlin and the others----follow it carefully!

indy started to do the same thing at about 10 months and we have had to start crate training again. yes---be sure that your dog is never ever uncrated without supervision. they are speedy little devils----indy has been known to sneak out and pee while i'm in the bathroom!

cleaning the house with the right kind of pet cleaner is key!!! we've been doing a lot better since scouring the place because they find the strangest places to make tiny droplets that you could never find :sl*p:

good luck!
k

I got my puppy Charlie 12 days ago. He is an absolute blessing. Anyhow, Charlie has only had one accident in the house, and it was our fault for not realizing he needed to poop, after we just brought him in from his pee. He is being crate trained, and he always goes outside when we bring him out...even if it is just a little wee. After reading this post, I wonder if he is actually having a little wee here and there without us noticing? Although he is always in our sight, I have noticed the 'peeing' motion, but would swear that he didn't go. Something I will now keep a closer eye on. I might try to find a black light...

Thanks for all the informative info!!! This has been such a big help for a new Cavy owner.

Don't feel bad, my Bentley is a year and a half and he still sneaks off to pee in the house, and poo as well. I blame it on myself though, I guess I just haven't been as diligent as I should have been. And when I was working full-time I really should have gated off one room for the dogs, but living in an apartment with a very open floor plan made that hard to do. Nature's Miracle has been a life-saver though! And now that I am not working right now, I am trying to re-train the little stinker. Hang in there, it will get better!

Cathy T said:

Jake had developed a lovely little habit of going and pooping in the living room. That was a room we rarely used. So, I gated off that room for several months and cleaned the carpet really well. No more problems.

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We had a similar experience with Chocolate. One year ago when she joined our family, she quickly noticed that we don't use our dining room. So I'd find pee spots on the carpeting in there. I cleaned the carpet and gated the room off. I'm amazed at how smart these cavs are!!

Well, I am at my wit's end also....I got a new slipcover for my couch, and yep, you guessed it...Bentley has peed all over the corner of it. And, to make me even more furious I JUST had him outside not 30 minutes ago, and he went potty for me outside just fine....yet he just now peed on my slipcover....I live in an apartment that is pretty much all one room/open floor plan (except the bedroom), so I can't really confine him to a room. And I don't use crates (I had a very bad experience with a crate). I guess I will have to just try and keep him right next to me at all times till we get over this piddling inside thing.
:?

Renee, I feel for you! Hopefully the slipcover can go in the wash? You might want to spray Simple Solution on the sofa underneath the slipcover in case the urine soaked through. Have you got a black light for finding wee spots as described by Judy?

Hang in there and you'll get through to him! :flwr: :flwr:

I'm sure the original poster will appreciate your response Karlin - but I also really really appreciate it. See, Kodee is very well behaved - too well behaved as in its so easy to just let her be. She is sometimes blocked off in the kitchen with us when I know its about time to go out and after meals till she looks ready to go out. Once out, I open the gates to the front hall and den for her to roam and play. BUT I FOLLOW HER IF SHE GETS UP. IF SHE IS TOO ACTIVE GOING HERE THERE, I CONTAIN HER TO ONE ROOM AGAIN. But my husband who is not with her all day comes home to a usually subdued dog that is very sleepy. He thinks she is always fine "Cause i just had her out" and will let her wander to den but be in kitchen and announce "i can hear her, she is fine". OH lots of fights on this one. HA I just emailed him this thread and pointed out if he looks in the snow he will see her wee sometimes is half a dime! He wouldnt have a clue if she was doing it here and there. Unless he wants this same problem in 10mths he'd better smarten up - cause I am not dealing with it should it arise - he will be :badgrin:

Cathy Moon said:

Renee, I feel for you! Hopefully the slipcover can go in the wash? You might want to spray Simple Solution on the sofa underneath the slipcover in case the urine soaked through. Have you got a black light for finding wee spots as described by Judy?

Hang in there and you'll get through to him! :flwr: :flwr:

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Whoa! I didnt know a black light could do that! My daughter has one and between kodee being little and not sure if I got it all and my older lab not being very consistant in last few mths, my rugs could use a check! I mean we rented a rug cleaner and used a industrial enzyme cleaner by the rug company after to be safe to remove all our other dogs urine before kodee came - but you never know! So glad I found this! Thanks Judy - how did you ever learn this?

i don't know what to say about Belle. Zack had long been housetrained. He would hold it all night, for more than 8 hours, more than 9, he just laid on the loveseat all night in the living room, quietly. I would come in from the bedroom and we would cuddle on the couch, he didn't act in a hurry to go out. He wanted to play. then i'd say 'wanna go outside?' and he'd jump down, pick up a toy and run to the door, and i'd let him out, and he'd run around a little and then go pee, usually a long one.

Almost always I come home from work at lunch time and let him out, but on rare occasions, i have not made it home for 9 hours or so, and he has been fine, no pees, no poops.

Belle is another story. She has been staying with me for several seeks while Lisa and Joe are staying with my mom and looking for an apartment. Belle will be two years old in June.

Belle was fine for the first three weeks. There was one pee in the kitchen, otherwise, she just waited for me to let them out in the morning or at lunch or after work. I left her free in the house when i wasn't there, with Zack. No problem, i made sure to come home and let them out at lunch because Belle was inconsistent about going in the house with Lisa and Joe, but they didn't come home during the day to let her out.

But one day they were going to be here at my place, so i figured they would let the dogs out so i didnt' come home to do it. When i did get home, Lisa and Joe had left, and i found poo strewn across the hall and living room and a pee right by the door to outside. Clearly the dogs hadn't been let out. It was a long cleaning job.

Since then, Belle has been inconsistent and at first, zack started peeing in the house too, one time, while i sat a few feet from him. so then, i started separating them when i wasn't home or during the night, so i could tell who was doing what. I leave belle in the kitchen. No more pees or poos from Zack. bElle has peed in the kitchen once or twice.

The other night, i came home from a short trip, an hour or so, they had not been kept in for more than that. When i got home, i didn't go right to the door and let them out. I sat down and took the thing i bought out of the bag. I heard Zack scratching on the door, after about 5 minutes or less, and i got up and let them out, there was a pee on the rug next to the door, from Belle. Zack peed outside when i let him out.

poor belle doesn't know how to ask to go out and isn't clear that she's supposed to go out. One problem with her is, she doesn't want to go out when i come home or get up in the morning, she wants to be with. She wants to cuddle, she wants to not separate. So, i of course now go outside with them, to encourage her, whereas i didn't need to before, the first three weeks she was here, and never did with zack. and i always cuddled with them first and the let them out, and she was ok with that. But now, she doesn't want to go out.

Last night took the cake. I came home, let her out of the kitchen, went to open the door to the outside in the living room, Zack ran out but Belle as she usuallly does, got up on the loveseat and wanted to be petted. I petted her a bit, but the way things have been, i wanted to get her outside ASAP, i would go out with her, and then wait until she goes, which has worked ok, when we go out, i casually walk around and she loses interest in me and goes and pees.

But this time, i opened the door and then came to get her to bring her outside, she moved away from me to avoid going outside, and just before i reached to pick her up she squatted and started to pee on the living room rug--as i was reaching for her! I was right by her and quickly picked her up, and put her out, and came back to wipe up the pee, there only just a drop because i caught it quick. But she seems to be showing that she has no clue about inside/outside for peeing.

The night before, i had felt really soft hearted and was considering letting her stay out in the living room wiht Zack over night, since there hadn't been a pee in a while in the kitchen, but my better judgement won out. This will take a lot of patience.

I had given my daughter the Shirlee Kalstone book months ago. I had gotten the book because the otherwise dependable housetrained Zack had peed on the bathroom rug (solved by now keeping the bathroom door closed) and also had peed in the same spot he lifted his leg the other day, while i sat nearby. But he didn't do it anymore after that so i didn't use the book and i gave it to Lisa. she never read it and i asked for it back but Lisa didnt' know where it was, and now everything is packed and she doesn't know where it is. So yesterday, i ordered myself another one on Amazon.
:?

Our Lexie is 4 1/2 months old and is close to 100% on the potty training. Our vet told us early on to hang a bell on a rope on the back door and show her to ring the bell when she wants to go out. It was amazing...we showed her a couple of times and she took over from there. She is really into it when she rings the bell with her paw.

You might want to give that a try...it really seems to work and I think they actually like ringing the bell to go outside!

Signed...
Lexie's Dad

Lucky gave me a little Valentine's present last night ... he decided to pee in his bed. He had been SOOOO good all day!!! He even held it all morning until NOON becuase he hated going out in the sleet ... then right in front of he me went on his bed. I caught him and immediately took him outside but still...

That said, he rarely has accidents (but he is rarely out of my sight ... I watch him like a hawk and he does know how to ring the bells, and uses them most times ...)

I think for Lucky it is just this cold weather. I just need to be patient and extra vigilent ...

For those with boys in particular, it's worth keeping the hair around the genitals cut short, as otherwise they can come in with droplets of wee on the hair, which then acts as scent markes for peeing indoors...

I was the one who originally posted this topic.

a couple nights ago I let Tripp outside, he walked into the garage and pee'd all over the floor, no big deal, it's cement it was easy to clean up. Right after that I took him back in the house and no more than 30 seconds later he pee'd on the front room floor. I was so mad, he had just gone outside, it wasn't like it had been hours since he had been out. Then the next day my wife was keeping an eye on him while I was at work, she was letting him out several times throughout the day, and twice that day, he came in and pooped on the carpet. My wife says she's had enough, and she's planning on finding him a new home.

Seanboy,

I hate for you to go to that extremes but to be completely honest if you guys aren't up for the challenge of having a puppy puppy then maybe it's the best solution. Maybe you can get a puppy that's a bit older that is better with house training issues. WE've all been through this. What it takes is persistence and consistency. Faith used to pee outside and then run in and pee again. She wasn't getting the connection. I caught her in the act and took her out enough times that she learned that outside is where she's supposed to go. How often are you taking your dog out? I take Faith out every 1/2 hour she's awake at least. Not that she needs to go that often, but I want her to have every ample opportunity. I have also sort of limited her water intake because I felt as if we were going backwards with potty training. I let her drink still, of course, but after a good 6 or 7 seconds I will squeak a toy or something to distract her. I take her out 5 minutes after she's had a drink and I know exactly when she's had one because my eyes never leave her..! Are you giving your guy training treats and loads of praise for going outside?? Faith gets a party every time she goes outside still. First I tell her what a good girl she is and then when we come in my other half continues the party so she knows she's done well on all sides. It takes a LOT of work, but it's really worth it in the end. Are you going outside with Tripp?? It's very important to know when he's gone and what he's done so you can better estimate of when he'll go again.

Good luck :flwr: