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Thread: Bad potty and destructive behavior!!

  1. #1
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    Default Bad potty and destructive behavior!!

    We just got a new puppy 3 weeks ago, and he is so BAD! Out first was such an angel, sure she had her potty-training issues, but she was so good compared to Charlie! He won't ever potty outside. We walk him for 15 minutes or more outside, and nothing. But within 5 minutes of bringing him in the house, he will pee on the carpet. He has made some progress with it the last few days, I would take him out and sit at the bottom of the stairs, and he would go eventually. But today he's back to the same old (I'm sure the fact that it was a weekend made some difference).

    Also, we have been leaving him with his kennel in the hallway to the bathroom with the bathroom door open, that way he has some carpet space to play or sleep, but can potty on the linoleum in the bathroom. But Friday when I came home he had torn up the carpet!


    I covered the carpet area today with a rug hoping he would leave it alone, but came home to see he tore apart more today! Now it's beyond repair (which means they take it out of our security deposit ) and he also tore apart the bath towel we use in his kennel (he pees in his kennel and then sleeps in it most nights, so I have been using towels instead of the bed we bought him, another thing our girl never did).

    And the thing I don't get, is he KNOWS what he does is wrong. He gets that sad face as soon as he sees you seeing what he did. So it's not like he doesn't know it's wrong! I just don't know what to do with him! Can anyone please offer some advice??? He's just so horrible!

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    Your dog's not horrible at all, but he is confused. He looks sad when you see him do it because he knows your not pleased but he doenst associate your displeasure over him soiling his crate. He has not made the connection he is to go outside.

    1. His scent is all over himself which is only putting his scent back on a clean towel so he smells it - therefore thinks its where he is to go.

    2. Was he raised in a kennel where he had no option but to go in a crate? He may not realize he is to go elsewhere.

    3. Besides just taking him out and sitting on the steps do you take time to make it an enjoyable outing and praise him for going with a treat and kind words.

    4. Dont scold him for mistakes, ignore him, clean it with an enzyme cleaner.

    5. When you are home take him out every 30min.

    6. You can buy sprays which encourage them where to go that can be used outside if he needs a helping hand understanding where to go

    7. Puppies will be puppies, mine has chewed the edge on 3 area mats right through and she is not out of my site a minute. Left alone you must put them in an area where there arent any rugs and use apple bitter spray on things you dont want chewed - it tastes horrid to most dogs.

    8. If your dog believes he pleases you he will look to please you more. I hope you dont really think your dog is bad or horrid! Its obvious he isnt, he is just untrained. Training falls on you.

    9. Buy "How to housetrain you dog in 7 days" look on amazon.com

    10. Sign up now for training classes where alot of this behaviour will be explained to you, so you can train him so he is happy.

  3. #3
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    Nah, he's not horrible, he's just a baby and it is up to you to give him some clear guidance, and some time to learn it. At that age he doesn't know that ripping up the carpet is the wrong thing to do. By the time you get home from work he has probably all but forgotten about doing it anyway. His sorry look is because he know you are mad with him right this minute, and he does not link this up with the carpet destruction.

    Kalin has put together some excellent articles to teach humans how to guide their puppies. You'll find them at http://www.cavaliertalk.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=9
    ~ Sam, Sonny & Beau ~

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    Can I ask....are you home most of the day with this little one to show him some sort of routine? or is he left for long periods of time alone?

    Alison.

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    Well he has people home, because we all leave at different times of the day, but I know a lot of this is due to us having to work and not being home with him. Indy was the same way kinda, "good" on the weekends and "bad" during the week. I used to work close enough to home to come home at lunch to play with her, take he out, etc, but we live further away now and I rely on my roommate to do my job in the afternoon (which he does).

    I know he's not horrible, I know he's just a puppy, I just get so frustrated sometimes and need to vent. And it's even more frustrating that he destroyed the carpet beyond repair

    I know he'll learn eventually, and honestly the bad potty isn't the worst part, it's just the destructive behavior I'm not sure how to deal with.

    And to respond to Kodee:
    1. Should I get some of those bath wipes to clean him when he does it?
    2. He was raised in an outdoor "playpen" and there was a dog house for all the puppies.
    3. Yes, I bring a treat with me and use my sweet voice and pet him and tell him "Charlie go potty, good boy go potty" like we did with Indy. And I like sitting on the stairs instead of walking him cause he seems to get less disctracted. When we walk him, he doesn't potty, so this way seems to give him the time to realize why we're there and he takes care of business sooner.
    4. The training books he's made say if you catch them in the act you're supposed to scold them by saying "bad" or "bad potty" and then show them what's good instead. Is this not recommended by Cav owners? Also, is there an Enzyme cleaner you recommend? We have a Woolite pet cleaner spray we use, it seems to work better than the last thing we got a PetSmart.
    5. We do take him out frequently. Sometimes he just doesn't want to go.
    6. Is that spray available at PetSmart? I think I'll try to look for some after work today.
    7. Once again, is that available at PetSmart?
    8. I can tell he wants to please me, and even when he bad potties, he seems to self-punish, and he will come sit by my feet after and look sad. I know he MEANS WELL.
    9. I have Dog Training for Dummies. Any good?
    10. I'll check out the classes available locally.

    Thanks everyone for your input!

  6. #6
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    A dog NEVER 'knows' that it has done wrong -- a dog's mind is not capable of forethought like this. He DOES know that you seem upset and has no idea why but is fearful and reacting to your anger. Thus he may look 'guilty' but this is fear.

    Please get Shirlee Kalstone's book on housetraining a dog -- this will help you deal with this situation and many others and give you schedules for different home situations and help you go thru this important training period.

    You need to remember a puppy is only a baby and has no idea that going inside is wrong and that he should go outside EXCEPT if you give him the right motiviation and reward for doing so, at which point he will gradually learn. A little puppy is way too young to be consistently able to go outdoors -- some manage this but it is VERY, VERY rare. So please do not feel anger and frustration at a puppy who is only being absolutely normal! Again, the Kalstone book will teach you how to train thru motivation, not punishment; using the latter tends to confuse dogs and make problems like this WORSE. For example if you punish in any way after the fact he has absolutely no idea why you are suddenly doing this -- he will not connect it with the fact that he went indoors, especially not if someone uses discredited and cruel approaches like rubbing noses in their poop and so on (no one would do this to a human toddler, who is a lot more intelligent than a puppy but also would have absolutely no idea why a parent would do such a thing and only grow feerful of the parent's erratic behaviour. Funny how we think a little puppy will make a connection a toddler can't! Sometimes you have to back up and try to think in 'dog logic' which is a lot different from human logic! )

    In a nutshell: it is up to you to keep the pup under such a close eye that he never, ever gets the chance to go inside. This means if he hasn;t gone when outside, then he must be in your arms, on your lap, within arm's reach, or crated until the next time you take him out. At the point that he goes praise lavishly and reward well with a bit of cheese or hot dog or a similar high value treat. Then repeat. A dog this young is way too young to ever be allowed out of sight.

    Puppies also destroy things -- just as toddlers break toys etc in the process of exploring their world. If the puppy is bored -- eg left alone for long periods -- it will be a lot more likely to find entertain,ment in destroying things. Chewing carpets or furniture is very normal behaviour up til age 1 or more -- therefore you need to keep your puppy in an area where he has no opportunity to destory anything you value (that also means do not leave shoes, socks, clothing, anything valuable on the floor or within reach). Puppies also are growing new teeth and NEED to chew. Which means he needs appropriate chew toys in an area where he can;t opt for substitutes like carpetting.

    I'd strongly recommend getting this book:

    http://www.amazon.com/Before-After-G...490033-5137505

    which will take you through the developmental stages puppies go through and give some great guidance on training too.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Leo Lily Tansy Libby (foster) Mindy (foster)
    In memory: Lucy
    Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com

  7. #7
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    Oops, posted that first reply while you were posting your answers so some of my questions you've covered.

    Still generally: A puppy has a very hard time left alone all day -- especially this breed -- is there any way someone can come midday to take him ourt or you can take him at least a few times a week to a doggie daycare facility?

    While this is 'destructive' behaviour from our viewpoint -- it is actually normal puppy play and some 'boredom' behaviour for a dog -- and for him right now, it is more interesting to stay occupied in shredding things or chewing things than with whatever toys you are leaving for him. It is frustrating but the goal is to find him other things that are more entertaining and eliminate the possibility for the behaviour you do not want -- eg don;t keep him in an area where he can access carpet to chew, for example.

    Have you read about Kongs and could you leave one of these for him? Have you read up on other things that could be done to keep him busy?

    Can you get a daily dog walker in or one of you get home midday every day (a puppy needs a midday break as does an adult dog -- this is simply too long to for him to last alone 5 days a week). How long is he generally left alone at a stretch before your roommate can take him out?

    You will have more problems housetraining because he isn't getting any consistent message right now on what to do. It will probably take a bit longer than otherwise.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Leo Lily Tansy Libby (foster) Mindy (foster)
    In memory: Lucy
    Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com

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    This is what I just went through.. and how I dealt with it (the potty training perspective)

    I just picked up my puppy on the 30th of January. Her foster mom told me that I was most likely going to have the hardest time on earth potty training her - she didn't seem to make the connection.

    When she came home I decided to take her out every 15 minutes.. maybe excessive, but she went outside enough times and I was able to go out there with her that she got the connection. She would go potty and I would literally kneel down on the grass and take her up in my arms and give her love and hugs and kisses.. When we came inside I went to my other half and said "guess who was a good girl?!" And he would give her praise too.. Even after she went I would take her out on the 15 minute intervals when she was up and playing. When she slept I would let her sleep but immediately upon awaking we went right back outside. She goes out when she wakes up, when she's done eating, before bed, after playing, etc.. all the time! lol

    She's now 17 weeks and I still am waking up one time in the middle of the night with her to go out to go pee.

    I did find that I had to watch how much water she drank and when she drank it. I will let her drink for a good 10 seconds and then squeak a toy or something to play with her so she doesn't get too much. Too much water means LOTSA peeing.. I still watch her like a hawk - she's under constant supervision. Things are still not perfect but in the last 2 weeks we've had 1 accident - pretty good for a little one who would pee every 15 minutes 6 weeks ago!
    Sara, mommy to Kosmo ~ 4 year blenheim boy and Faith 3 year b/t girl *rescue*

  9. #9
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    That you for your advise. I know a lot of this already, and we already try to do most of what has been suggested, especially monitoring the drinking, and we feed on a schedule, so he eats all at once, and we take him to potty shortly after. Schedule wise, I leave around 7am, so Charlie comes out with me to play and potty, then my boyfriend is up at 9 and leaves at 10, and my roommate leaves for work at 2. At the latest we are back at 7pm, and I'm usually home a few hours before that. I do leave the Kong for him, but he honestly doesn't seem to keen on any of his toys, so I'm never sure what to leave with him, and I can't leave him everything, or Indy would have nothing to play with.

    And as for the him looking sad when I'm mad, that's not even the case. I don't get mad and yell and then he looks sad, he looks sad and I have to go find what he did wrong. Or with the carpet, as soon as Toan saw it, he didn't even get upset or yell, Charlie ran to the corner to hide. And Indy is the same way, as soon as she knows we see something she did bad, without getting upset or anything, she punishes herself by going to her house. I guess that's a lot of it too, the fact that she was pretty easy, makes it seem that much harder with Charlie. I've heard than neutering makes males calm down a lot, does that hold true with Cavs? We plan to neuter him, I'm just wondering if it will make any difference. We also decided to put him in the kitchen. He has taken to pooping there if he does it inside anyway (which is desirable to us, rather he does it on the linoleum than the carpet). I'm just afraid he will then chew the cabinets there, which means bye bye to more of the deposit. So I'm not sure the best place to put him where he can't destroy anything, other than in his kennel.

    I'm going to PetSmart today after work to see what aids I can find.

  10. #10
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    are you referring to leaving? How old is he? You are leaving him to run throughout the house?!

    In my honest opinion that's a huge mistake! I would never trust Faith (17 weeks) on her own in my house while I am gone. That gives her the opportunity to pee and or poo wherever she wants and also it's really unsafe. God only knows what she would find to get into. I don't want to take the chance with my cupboards, carpets, coffee tables etc. If he's still teething he'll chew anything!

    I recommend getting an X pen to leave him in while you are out. That's at least a safe environment for him.

    Puppies need to be monitered 100% of the time when they are "out and about." Faith is never allowed out of my site in the house for the simple reason that I don't know what she is doing. I believe that 90% of potty training comes from catching them in the act!
    Sara, mommy to Kosmo ~ 4 year blenheim boy and Faith 3 year b/t girl *rescue*

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