21st April 2008, 10:35 PM
puppy diet advice, please
We have a 15 week old Cavalier named Ollie. The breeder had been feeding him that raw beef diet. Our vet mentioned that because of bacterial concerns (we have small children), we might want to switch to a dry dog food. He suggested mixing the two at first. That was going well . However, For the past two days, Ollie has refused the kibble/raw mix. He'll gobble up anything my kids give him, but he won't eat either the dry or the raw dog food. Also, he seems to have very watery poop (sorry!!). Any suggestions?
21st April 2008, 10:49 PM
I would go back to the raw...for now, at least, since that's what he's used to eating. In fact, Miles didn't know what to do with kibble the first time he had it! We were travelling and gave him some kibble and he just pushed it around in the bowl, like, "am I supposed to eat this?" You can also buy the frozen pre-made patties/medallions (like Primal or Nature's Variety) and all you have to do is thaw them in the refrigerator the night before and they're ready for the next day. I'm partial to feeding raw because my boys eat that way, so I would say to stick with it if you can As far as the bacterial concerns, yes you do have to be much more careful when feeding raw, but if you use SS bowls and wash them out with hot soapy water or throw them in the dishwasher each time (or use a paper plate and just throw it away each time!) you'll be fine...it's a lot harder to deal with those concerns if you're feeding raw chicken necks, etc, but it's easy for me to deal with...although we don't have any kids running around! Also, give him 15 minutes to eat, then take up his food. If he's really hungry he'll eventually eat! Good luck!
Carrie - Mom to my boys, Miles (a Ruby born 4/15/07) and Truman (a B&T born 11/28/07) and my girls, cats Hailey and Kayla (born @ 4/15/04 - they were found as strays )
22nd April 2008, 12:06 PM
I think the problem is behavioural and has nothing to do with the food. You need to address this -- or it can escalate. Basically he is looking for the attention that comes when he doesn't eat. You also really do want to control what children are offering to a puppy -- you don't want them giving extra side meals and snacks.
The approach you are doing with mixing the food to transition him is fine but you need to just offer the meal with no big fuss, give him 10-15 minutes to eat, and then at that point lift the dish and NO FOOD, NO SNACKS til the next scheduled meal. Do not allow meals to become social interaction periods for the dog or they quickly learn to hold out on eating in order to get the attention and this can cause major headaches for owners. If he skips a meal or even a whole day of eating, this doesn't matter. A healthy puppy will not starve itself.
Also see: http://board.cavaliertalk.com/showth...418#post259418
For controlling health risks when feeding raw, especially with children around, the entire prep area plus dishes needs to be kept sterile: meticulously washed down with hot soapy water and you need to wash your own hands with hot soapy after for at least a minute after handling. The dog also excretes the bacteria on raw food -- while the dog might tolerate and digest things like salmonella they will pass right through and end up in feces in the garden (one study showed 30% of dogs fed raw diets had salmonella in their stools -- so picking up stools immediately is essential). Raw premades in the US showed a lot of bacteria when lab tested a few years ago. Raw premades are also not widely available in the UK. Personally I think more of the risk of feeding raw is to the people in the home. I'd personally not feed a raw diet with children, especially young ones, around.
More info on handling raw: http://www.urbancarnivore.com/uc_online/pages.cfm?ID=36
In memory: Lucy
Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com
22nd April 2008, 12:13 PM
I knew when i read your thread that the first reaction you were going to get is..........don't let the children give snacks to the dog........
As karlin has told you.
Im no expert at all. You will do your best and get there eventually.
I don't allow my children to give anything to Ruby. As i said i'm not an expert so i won't tell you what to do. I just felt sorry because i knew people were going to say to you about the children giving the dog snacks and i thought you might feel bad.
You will get there.....
22nd April 2008, 12:25 PM
PS if he has the runs, you need to bring him to the vet if this lasts more than 24 hours. Diarrhea can be a serious health risk for a puppy so it's important to get a pup to a vet whenever it looks like more than a brief issue. It may just be the food adjustment but many things cause diarrhea in puppies and some can quickly become life-threatening. Because they can so easily get tummy upset, this is one reason why children should never be feeding the dog snacks -- lots of treats can make the dog ill. There are also many human foods which are deadly to animals, including chocolate and raisins, typical things kids might give a dog! So make it a rule that kids only give treats under supervision and only ever things you say are OK.
In memory: Lucy
Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com
22nd April 2008, 06:07 PM
I can't tell you anything about a raw food diet, but I wanted to let you know my puppy is named Ollie too! What color is yours? Mine is a b/t. haha, just thought it was funny since it is a rare name.
23rd April 2008, 05:23 AM
Well if he were mine, I'd go back to raw but to alleviate the fears that seem to be associated with raw meat in countries outside of Australia, I'd feed him human grade raw meats.... same as you give your own family. That way you only need clean up the benches etc just as you would when you prepare a nice steak for the family. With small dogs this isn't too expensive.
But I will admit, I am anti-kibble.
~ Sam, Sonny & Beau ~
23rd April 2008, 12:17 PM
23rd April 2008, 01:43 PM
Thank you for all of the info and suggestions. We changed his diet to the dry food, but switched to a Lamb and rice formula. He seems much happier. The upset belly episode lasted about 24 hours. Since we switched to the new food, he has seemed fine. No diarreha. I think had an upset belly and was testing us. We stood firm, and Ollie finally ate the dry food. Ollie is a blenheim, and is absolutely adorable. What a character!
23rd April 2008, 02:50 PM
Gus(blenhiem) Pippin(tri) DJ(ruby)