should i try to contact the breeder?

you might have seen my earlier posts about having no clue about these puppies i have. they are 10 months old and we are their third owner that i know of, in addition to a breeder in kansas. i just got the original owner to mail me their 'papers'. this consisted of a self-typed list of vaccinations and the dates given which she says applies to both dogs, copies of rabies vaccination certificate signed by a doc in kansas (transferable to state of VA?), and two examination reports from banfield at petsmart.
i think i have located the breeder through some internet research, and i have emailed the woman to ask if she had a litter on 8.25.07. i really just want to know what my responsibilies would be to the breeder if any. my friend tells me that most breeders have clauses in their contracts which state the date that a puppy must be neutered by, and also that if you, the buyer, are unable to care for the dog it must be returned to the breeder for placement.
i don't want to get the original owner in trouble with the breeder, but i do want to know if the dogs have already been microchipped (as this particular breeder advertises), and have access to any health guarantee, etc. i also don't want any legal issues to arise out of having these dogs if they were supposed to be returned to the breeder instead of being given away.
have i made a major blunder in trying to find and contact the breeder for my puppies??

I'm sure you will have more thorough responses from the breeders on this board, but I will try to help you with what I know...I assume that the rabies certificates would be transferrable to VA, but you would have to check with a local vet. I would request the name of the previous vet and ask them to send the dogs' records to your vet so you know what injections they have already received, so you don't vaccinate them for something that they just recently were vaccinated against. Your vet should also be able to scan the dogs with a universal microchip scanner to verify that they are really chipped; and if they are, you will want to change the registered contact to you ASAP. A health guarantee isn't worth anything, so I wouldn't bother asking the breeder about it. You could ask for heart/eye clearances, etc. on the dogs' parents and grandparents so you would have a better idea of their potential for health issues.

If the breeder is a good, reputable breeder he/she will want to know where these puppies are. I think that it is a very good thing that you have reached out to the breeder, and he/she should be willing to help you in any way they can.

Correct me if I'm wrong but did the breeder sell her pups to Petsmart? If so, then I'd say she didn't give a dam about them in the first place and wouldn't care if she didn't hear about them again!

not sold to petsmart

the original owner just took them to petsmart to see the vet there. at least that's the papers that she sent me, but she quoted another vet in her email to me. i have absolutely nothing from that vet's office. i don't know the woman at all (she gave the puppies to my friend, who i got them from) but it seems like she doesn't want to give me any information on them. she did ask for pictures, but my husband suspects that she might be wanting to use the pictures to send to the breeder and pretend all is well. i'm not so cynical, but after reading stuff about puppy mills and dangers of petstores, i'm really worried about the lack of information on the dogs. i know i got them for free and maybe i'm not entitled to much, but i feel that the dogs are only going to get the best vet care if i know the bigger picture. does that make sense? these dogs are a huge part of my family already!!

Well, it depends on how much you want to stir up.

To be totally honest, the chances are that if the dogs came from a breeder in Kansas, they came from a backyard breeder or puppy mill to start with -- it is a HUGE industry there and there are very very few reputable, club registered breeders in Kansas.

You might be better off contacting the regional breed club to see if the breeder is a member (check both ACKCSC and CKCSC) before pursuing the breeder.

If you have the vet contacts, then you really have all the info you will need -- the existing vet history for the dogs. They are only 10 months and there is unlikely to be much anyway -- just vax etc.

Most reputable breeders would never have homed two puppies together at the same time to start with -- this is generally rare because reputable breeders know the challenges of taking two puppies at once and they want the best for each individual pup. I would only ever place two young puppies into a very experienced dog owning home (adults or young adults are a different matter ) and most rescues would be the same, for the same reasons. In addition, two puppies from a reputable breeder would have been $4000 or so worth of dogs. It just seems unlikely that someone would have given away this much money's worth of dogs -- any reputable breeder would have taken the dogs back in the first place with a refund or partial refund.

Very few breeders outside of the reputable show breeders (or rescues) would be concerned to have dogs back of their breeding or provenance and I'd be reluctant to return them to a mill or BYB where they'll just be bred or possibly even put down as too old to sell.

I'd leave things be and enjoy your new dogs, or work directly with regional cavalier breed rescue if you are concerned about keeping both. Rescue would responsibly home the second dog which, depending on how you are finding things, might be easier for you, and better for the dogs -- sometimes it is better to split two challenging dogs than keep them together. Just some things to consider; I am not sure if you are finding them that difficult or not but it sounds like perhaps you were from previous posts.

PS as others say, any vet can tell you if they are microchipped -- just ask and they will scan the dogs. Usually a vet will have done this on your first visit.

inoubliable said:

you might have seen my earlier posts about having no clue about these puppies i have. they are 10 months old and we are their third owner that i know of, in addition to a breeder in kansas. i just got the original owner to mail me their 'papers'. this consisted of a self-typed list of vaccinations and the dates given which she says applies to both dogs, copies of rabies vaccination certificate signed by a doc in kansas (transferable to state of VA?), and two examination reports from banfield at petsmart.
i think i have located the breeder through some internet research, and i have emailed the woman to ask if she had a litter on 8.25.07. i really just want to know what my responsibilies would be to the breeder if any. my friend tells me that most breeders have clauses in their contracts which state the date that a puppy must be neutered by, and also that if you, the buyer, are unable to care for the dog it must be returned to the breeder for placement.
i don't want to get the original owner in trouble with the breeder, but i do want to know if the dogs have already been microchipped (as this particular breeder advertises), and have access to any health guarantee, etc. i also don't want any legal issues to arise out of having these dogs if they were supposed to be returned to the breeder instead of being given away.
have i made a major blunder in trying to find and contact the breeder for my puppies??

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A one year rabies shot given in any state by a vet should qualify.

You didn't have any agreement for the original breeder. IF I were the breeder-- I'D have someone is court asap. I only sell with a 4 page contract of what I can expect and what they can expect. If you are the third owners, I'd say that there probably was no such agreement in the works.

Any vet should be able to scan for a micro chip.

VERY few breeders have a health guarantee that would follow the pups 10 months into their lives, especially if they've been passed around that much.

I am not sure what you were trying to get out of for contacting the possible breeder. IF they are a good breeder, they may have a contract that says they should be returned. IF they are a bad breeder-- they may not test etc...

Do you have the registered names of the dogs? If so you could research through their pedigrees.

One extra note for you, as it is unclear and probably unlikely that the parents/grandparents were health screened before breeding, you might want to look into purchasing Pet Insurance coverage on the pups. If they have been treated for any ailment in the past, other than just well puppy checks and vaccinations, those problems will be exempt from coverage. However, anything not yet documented, such as eye, patella and heart/mitral valve disease, will be covered, should they ever arise.

You can purchase a good policy from PetPlan (www.gopetplan.com) or several others that do not preclude breed health issues from their policies.

Good luck with your puppies and have fun with them. You probably have your hands full with twice the fun (or double trouble, as some see it.)

Oh sorry I jumped the gun when I heard Petsmart and I assumed the worst (puppy farm).

I'd just enjoy your dogs and try not to worry, you will get first class info on health problems on this forum and face those problems IF they arise. Get insurance now before anything problems do come along or you won't be covered for any previous illness if you take the insurance after.

inoubliable said:

the original owner just took them to petsmart to see the vet there. at least that's the papers that she sent me, but she quoted another vet in her email to me. i have absolutely nothing from that vet's office. i don't know the woman at all (she gave the puppies to my friend, who i got them from) but it seems like she doesn't want to give me any information on them. she did ask for pictures, but my husband suspects that she might be wanting to use the pictures to send to the breeder and pretend all is well. i'm not so cynical, but after reading stuff about puppy mills and dangers of petstores, i'm really worried about the lack of information on the dogs. i know i got them for free and maybe i'm not entitled to much, but i feel that the dogs are only going to get the best vet care if i know the bigger picture. does that make sense? these dogs are a huge part of my family already!!

Click to expand...

Most of the rescues we get in have little or no previous health information on them. I agree with others, I would at least for a while, get some insurance.

Actually, Petsmart and Petco don't ever sell puppies. They do work with local rescues where dogs are brought in on weekends. Petland, however, is a different story... We have one in our town and they sell tons of puppies, many of whom have health problems -- no surprise!