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Thread: Would you buy another one?

  1. #31
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    Default It is a dreadfull decease

    My eldest darling Totti has confirmed SM. I have cried my heart out. When you see how fast the decease takes over and all the side effects of the medicines, you understand just how awfull this particular decease is. In just three months since his SM was confirmed and he has received treatment, he is not himself. Totally worn down. I dont think he is in pain but nevertheless he cannot lead the same happy life as he did before. We still decided to get a new puppy and he started showing symptoms (scratching) MRI'd which showed a hernia in the cerebellum which could develop into SM. I could have left him back and get refunded but we were already in love with him so we will just wait and enjoy him for as long as we can. If Totti continues getting worse we will put him to sleep since we don't want him to suffer. The thought breaks my heart.

    So, no I don't think I would get another one. And I do truly love the Cavalier's

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolina View Post
    My eldest darling Totti has confirmed SM. I have cried my heart out. When you see how fast the decease takes over and all the side effects of the medicines, you understand just how awfull this particular decease is. In just three months since his SM was confirmed and he has received treatment, he is not himself. Totally worn down. I dont think he is in pain but nevertheless he cannot lead the same happy life as he did before. We still decided to get a new puppy and he started showing symptoms (scratching) MRI'd which showed a hernia in the cerebellum which could develop into SM. I could have left him back and get refunded but we were already in love with him so we will just wait and enjoy him for as long as we can. If Totti continues getting worse we will put him to sleep since we don't want him to suffer. The thought breaks my heart.

    So, no I don't think I would get another one. And I do truly love the Cavalier's
    Carolina, I am so sorry for your Totti. I hope he's symptom gets better

  3. #33
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    With much respect for those with sick dogs, keep in mind that the internet is an echo chamber for problems. There is a great deal of focus on potential health problems online. The reality is that most people have healthy dogs.

  4. #34
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    With all respect eyesurgeon,

    can you please explain how I have have owned four affected Cavaliers with SM, a question mark on another until scanned and one with progression towards SM if most people have healthy Cavaliers? and that not one Cavalier that I have taken or assisted somehow for MRI scans for other owners have ever scanned totally clear either?
    Having been concerned and involved with Cavaliers and pet owners for just about 6 yrs thats a good number of Cavaliers going for MRI scans, not to mention the owners that phone for information and help when concerned about their dogs when over and over vets dismiss or do not know enough about the condition.

    SM is a very serious condition in Cavaliers with a high percentage of Cavaliers being affected. It isn't a "potential" problem it is with us now and a huge one at that. This is the harsh reality.

    You say many people have healthy dogs, perhaps of other breeds perhaps then, but Cavaliers seem to be a breed on their own regarding health problems, they have far to many.

    If the internet is an echo chamber for information regarding health concerns including those about SM, then may it echo loud and clear worldwide.

    Alison.

  5. #35
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    The reality is that most people have healthy dogs.
    I am afraid that the reality is that half of us will have cavaliers with heart murmurs by age 5. If you are in the medical field yourself you will understand how wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong this is, especially as breeders have simple tools in their hands to address this problem. It is an absolutely shocking incidence of a serious health problem.

    If at a conservative estimate, nearly one in three cavaliers will eventually get SM, and 9 in 10 have a skull too small for their brain, placing constant pressure on the hindbrain and in a considerable number, forcing part of the brain out into the spinal cord, how can this be said to be a normal, healthy dog leading a normal, healthy life? Humans with this condition endure ongoing headaches. Dogs cannot explain they have chronic headaches.

    The majority of my rescue dogs coming in -- total random sample, will have heart murmurs if they are around 5-6. Every dog older that 6 has had a murmur. I have many friends and acquaintances who do general rescue or rescue for other breeds who never see this level of heart problems in young dogs. Most of my rescues do not come in as neglected pound or puppy farm dogs. They are people's pets that they need to rehome. I now see about 50-70 dogs annually (depending on the year) -- more than many of the US regional breed rescues -- so I think I see a pretty good random sample.

    One of the reasons that I set up this site, with an MVD/SM forum, was because there were so few places people with this breed and these problems could go to share information and get support. On many sites, mention SM and you are practically banned -- having worked for two national AIDS foundations in the US then in Ireland in the 1990s (San Francisco AIDS Foundation, then Aidswise in Dublin), it reminded me a lot of how nobody wanted to know about the problem. People had few places to go if they found they had it, where conversation about the condition was OK.

    If anyone has problems with this site's support for dogs with these conditions and owners whose dogs have this condition, believe me, you will find that the majority of the sites and email lists are quite happy to focus almost entirely on discussions about the cuteness of their dogs, buying leash accessories, and the latest TV or film appearance of a cavalier. Those topics are welcome here too but I will not pretend that there are not serious issues with this breed and will always work to get that health info out to people. People also need to understand these problems exist before they decide on this breed, both to identify problems if they arise and keep suffering to a minimum, and because at least with MVD, almost every cavalier owner is going to deal with this, most of the *sooner* rather than *later* -- those are the statistics. I have never found that knowing about the health issues has put a single person off taking one of my rescue dogs. In addition, contrary to all the dire predictions voiced by some clubs in the UK, in Ireland, which also gets the BBC, we have not had a single cavalier come into any of the rescue or pounds that I know of due to the BBC programme (and I work with all the major rescues and several of the large and smaller pounds and SPCAs. The people involved in the programme were told by several breeders that due to the programme, there would be floods of rescue dogs dumped by owners. Hasn't happened going by the UK rescue listings, or for us in Ireland). Since the programme I have had two cavaliers come in -- one due to its owner going into care, and a second due to the arrival of a baby. In other words, the normal rate at which I get cavaliers, and the common reasons. People generally don't abandon their cavaliers due to the possibility of a future health issue and only very rarely when they have them. Likewise most people who own them will likely get them again I think though if you have dealt with a hard health problem -- especially something as distressing as SM or say curly coat or EFS -- many may feel differently.

  6. #36
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    Yes I would have another cavalier I know what the risk are
    ---Aileen and (Barney--Jazzie)
    Cavaliers at the bridge Mattie and Rocky& Sam
    Better to light a candle for one lost dog than to curse the darkness of man's indifference.Saving just one dog won't change the world but it surely will change the world for that one dog.

  7. #37
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    Carolina,

    I am so sorry, what can I say to make you feel any better, sending you a huge hug though ((x)) thinking about you all.

    Keep positive.

    Alison.

  8. #38
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    Karlin,

    I really appreciate your candidness on this site. As I think many of you know, I run a similar forum (Slippertalk) that discusses Ladyslipper orchids and, believe it or not, we have a lot of controversy over that subject too. I started the forum because there was another slipper orchid forum that wasn't allowing free speech and often banned members whenever anyone mentioned something controversial.

    This information you are providing here is SO important for us new Cav. owners.
    I've been thinking, if I were to get a pup myself, I might get a Cav., even knowing the risks. Right now we're still dealing with the Binster as our first at about 5 months. I think she is exhibiting signs of SM, but my mom doesn't want to hear about it.
    I have read so much here so I am aware, but I am scared that mom isn't going to admit there is a problem because we've both bonded so quickly with Binne. I also have days when I have to tell myself to STOP reading here because I get so worried.

    We have a fair amount of tail chasing going on, a little foot chewing (while making a funny, but not pain oriented, noise), and a lot of scratching around her collar. Again, no yelping or whining or anything really painful sounding but I'm still concerned. We also know more about the mom than the dad (though we do know he was younger than he should have been but we'd already fallen in love...grrr.)

    Anyway, thank you Karlin, and everyone else here, for all of your information! It's invaluable.
    ~Heather
    Natura non facit saltum

  9. #39
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    Default Thank you again

    Thank you again with all my heart for all your kind words and support. This forum is helping so many people to live through the pain and stress to which we unfortunately are victims of.
    AHM I can understand that you are worried. We had our little Chili scanned because of similar symptoms. The scratching mainly, which is getting worse. Since he is still so young the vet doesn't want to give him medications. I think they may simply not know what to do. It is not usual for a little 8 week old puppy to start showing symptoms. Now he is 3 and a half months and I will continue contacting several specialists to see if anything can be done. He is happy but I do wonder how he feels. Scratching can be a sign for pain or at least uncomfort. I really don't know what to do.

    It is necesary to ventilate all infomation on this decease and I admire Karlin who wisely understand that the only way to protect and ensure a future for the cavaliers is in fact by openly ventilating the problem and sharing information. This will hopefully make breeders aware of how widely spread SM is and lead to taking meassures to prevent further spreading of it.

    Alison I am so sorry for what you have been through. It must be so distressing for you. Big hug to you

  10. #40
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    Carolina,

    If your little one is in discomfort your vet must give meds to give some pain relief and calm the scratching down, go back and ask to see a neurologist ASAP if you think the vet is out of his depth in dealing with this, don't leave such a small puppy in this way please. Scratching can drive us all mad!

    Alison.

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