Barbara -- please reread -- I didn't say clubs put dogs to sleep because they have no papers, I said one club in particular will put dogs to sleep simply because they make judgements as to their health or temperament or how much of a hassle they will be to rehome (if they have behaviour problems) and make no effort to get any professional input nor will allow others to try and help those dogs. At least one other prominent club *definitely* refuses dogs that have no papers (though they will undoubtedly deny it now that this is an 'issue' but that's good if it benefits some puppy farm dogs with no pedigrees that come into rescue in future , isn't it?). I do know people within rescue and within clubs who are deeply disturbed by these two situations -- and by how much rescue money some clubs have but don't seem to find much use for even as they continue to fundraise for 'rescue' :bang: -- and some of those club members/breeders have direct experience of dogs encountering both these situations in these clubs. A few enquiries should elicit policies -- or do the clubs and rescue people talk to each other?
I also have not said ALL club rescue does this, of course! -- but some of you would no doubt be surprised to hear of how many of them operate, rather than the one you have directly worked with -- I hear from lots of groups across the US and UK and Canada and know individuals involved with same who have some pretty dire stories to tell. And the main point I was making is -- how dare some in the clubs tell people concerned about breed helth that they should be focusing on puppy farms, when numerous club rescues won't even accept non-pedigreed dogs into rescue, and do so little regarding puppy farms themselves? While sitting on very large rescue accounts?
Our rescues are not sat on mounds of money and what there is is spent on the dogs that come in. Some as said previously, have their medication paid for the rest of their lives if needed.
Perhaps not your club, but you do need to get ALL the UK clubs to reveal their rescue accounts at the national club AGM because this is very definitely not the case at all club rescues! I know of regional rescues with large 5 figure sums in the US, too. Clubs that then consider putting down dogs because they dispute whether to have the dog see vets for treatment for perfectly treatable medical conditions (not SM or MVD either). As surprising as it may seem, I do know people who serve on club boards and committees who reveal such things privately.
For my own part, I have many years of experience working with general and individual rescues both in Ireland and -- surprise! the UK (the same folks who won't talk to club breed rescue I guess... but they will work with me) and know often they won't give dogs to breed rescue because they know some of the approaches club rescue take -- and they are bombarded by club people who tell them they know nothing about the breed -- and generally in my experience club rescue charges far more than say, the RSPCA or the pounds! Some might even feel some club rescues are more in line to be accused of 'selling' dogs... The bottom line is, clubs SHOULD be spending on the health issues of dogs that come into rescue, otherwise it isn't really rescue, is it? All decent rescues incur large financial costs (I operate at a loss myself because donations and homing fees won;t cover my medical costs for dogs). At any rate, within Ireland, I have had no problems working with a range of general rescues and several of the regional pounds as well as the iSPCA. Maybe it is the attitude of club rescue when they approach these groups that causes the rift? icon_nwunsure
If breeders' backs are up because of my comments on rescue, then maybe some need to consider how many people's backs are up because of some club rescues sitting on pools of cash and taking this 'only with a pedigree' approach to rescue (and being told this isn't the case when it very clearly IS the case. I know this is true within other breeds as well because I have show breeder friends and relatives doing breed rescue who are disgusted with the approach of some in club rescue -- though I *absolutely agree* that this isn't all in club rescue). But: if some breeders in the UK and US weren't desperately trying to shift the focus on breed health over to puppy farms as a supposedly 'more important' issue -- as if we have no right to raise breed health as an issue -- when breed clubs and KC and AKC etc don't seem themselves to be doing much in regard to puppy farms and some don't even take in such dogs as rescues -- then to me this is a perfectly valid issue of discussion, brought on by this ridiculous assertion that 'if only you all worried more about 'real' issues like puppy farms rather than SM'.
So here's some questions for the UK national AGM: how many dogs are rehomed annually through club rescue in the UK? Is this statistic released each year? If not, why not? What is the income from each club towards rescue? How much is in each club's account? Where is it spent and why do they not operate on a break-even basis so that people aren't being pushed to donate towards a fund that is simply stockpiled... for what? How much is charged to rehome dogs by each club rescue, and where does that go?
Still, how bizarre that I -- not even a club member -- know more about some club's accounts than some of you in rescue do, though!
That really seems to indicate a lack of communication and lack of disclosure -- that some clubs want to hide away their financial status perhaps? Maybe because they might want to redirect that income towards, oh, a PR company at some point? :lol: I can't figure out why rescue income isn't general knowledge to the national club membership, for all constituent clubs. For my own part, I keep my accounts transparent. I do audited taxes separate from my own work income, audited by one of the largest tax firms in Ireland (Farrell Grant Sparks) and operate as a break even or loss-making trade.
Anyway: to fulfill your wishes expressed elsewhere, I will close your account here so you no longer need to be frustrated by the discussion. I do have a policy of not allowing additional breeder registrations and had that in place at the time you joined -- so actually, you should have been removed before you started posting anyway. Nothing personal.
