Scanning

[honeymonster]

I am not a breeder but was in conversation on the phone recently to a breeder whose name I was given as responsible and health conscious. She told me she was rather disillusioned with scanning at the moment and the results and was unsure what to do next. One of her bitches was pts with late onset SM but when younger had been clear and produced a litter. The sire of the litter was scanned on the bitches death and seen to be one of the worst cases of SM the Neurologist had ever seen. The litter produced, now over 2.5 years, have been scanned and are all clear. This must be a terrible dilemma for breeders to face if they have clear stock ready for mating but fearful that their scanning clear may be a smoke screen. 2 bad cases producing a clear litter. To breed or not? Can I ask what should they do? Bet, Karlin, BrianM. I ask you because you are knowledgeable people with an opinion.

[Bet]

honeymaster,

I have been checking up on what Dr C Rusbridge mentions about different circumstances producing SM ,hope somebody else will add to what I am mentioning.

Having read your Post ,it looks as if the Cavalier Bitch in question developed SM later on ,but had been mated to Cavalier Dog who was suffering from SM.

The subsequent Litter had resulted in all clear Cavaliers with no sign of SM at 2.5 years, why does'nt the Cavalier Breeder mentioned , get in touch with Dr C Rusbridge,the Neurologist who is involved with the Research SM Problem in our Cavalier Breed for her advice about this situation.

For me ,if I was the Breeder I might be a bit concerned in-case some of the Litter could be Carriers of the SM Gene/Genes.

This is why it's so important that the SM Genome Research succeeds in Canada.

I would also sugest that the Cavalier Breeder reads Dr C Rusbridge's New Web site,

www.veterinary-neurologist.co.uk

Bet(Hargreaves)

[WoodHaven]

honeymaster,

i have been checking up on what dr c rusbridge mentions about different circumstances producing sm ,hope somebody else will add to what i am mentioning.

Having read your post ,it looks as if the cavalier bitch in question developed sm later on ,but had been mated to cavalier dog who was suffering from sm.

The subsequent litter had resulted in all clear cavaliers with no sign of sm at 2.5 years, why does'nt the cavalier breeder mentioned , get in touch with dr c rusbridge,the neurologist who is involved with the research sm problem in our cavalier breed for her advice about this situation.


For me ,if i was the breeder i might be a bit concerned in-case some of the litter could be carriers of the sm gene/genes.

This is why it's so important that the sm genome research succeeds in canada.

I would also sugest that the cavalier breeder reads dr c rusbridge's new web site,

www.veterinary-neurologist.co.uk

bet(hargreaves)

who would breed a dog that was symptomatic (suffering) from sm???

[Bet]

I think the question asked ,was whether any of the SM clear Litter should be being Bred from , I only mentioned ,that perhaps they could be SM Carriers, and this will never be discovered until the SM Gene/Genes are discovered.

Bet(Hargreaves)

[WoodHaven]

I think the question asked ,was whether any of the SM clear Litter should be being Bred from , I only mentioned ,that perhaps they could be SM Carriers, and this will never be discovered until the SM Gene/Genes are discovered.

Bet(Hargreaves)

No -- You said, "but had been mated to cavalier dog who was suffering from sm". Which would be unconscionable.

(they could be SM Carriers, and this will never be discovered until the SM Gene/Genes are discovered) AND yes, that is why some breeders don't want to bet everything on a clear scan.

I have 7 in my breeding program scanned and info sent on to research. But a scan isn't the whole picture and shouldn't be thought of as such.

[sins]

The litter produced, now over 2.5 years, have been scanned and are all clear.

Wow, Has this breeder been able to hold back an entire litter until the age of 2.5 years?
Regardless of their Mri status, surely not all of them are suitable for breeding anyway. Have some been placed in pet homes?

Sins

[honeymonster]

I think there were only 2 in the litter.

[WoodHaven]

Wow, Has this breeder been able to hold back an entire litter until the age of 2.5 years?
Regardless of their Mri status, surely not all of them are suitable for breeding anyway. Have some been placed in pet homes?

Sins

ROUGHLY
An average litter of cavaliers is about 3.7 (per statistics obtained from CKCSC,USA over about a year). Carefully placed, that wouldn't be too hard to follow.

[Bet]

Does it not mean ,if a Cavalier has a Syrinx, this denotes SM , so shouldn't be Bred From, the same as with the Cavalier MVD Problem, if the Sire or Dam has a Heart Condition , then they should not be being used for Breeding.

Maybe I should'nt be quoting this, but on another List , it's been mentioned, that it's because Cavalier Pet Owners let their Cavaliers get over -weight ,that's how they have Heart Trouble, yes ,if a Cavalier is over- weight and has a Heart Condition ,that sure can be a problem, but I have known Cavaliers who were a normal weight ,and still had MVD.

Back to the Breeder mentioned by Honeymonster, why did she not ask to see the Sire's MRI Scan ,since her Bitch had been MRI Scanned.

Bet( Hargreaves )

[sins]

"but had been mated to cavalier dog who was suffering from sm". Which would be unconscionable

But if he was one of the worst cases of SM ever seen by a neurologist,surely he would be symptomatic????and yes breeding from him would be unconscionable!!
Did the breeder own both sire and dam?
It also strikes me as strange that a bitch who was scanned clear and bred from, just over 2.5 years ago went from clear MRI to dead in approx 3 years......
Why was the sire scanned following the bitch's death if the pups were healthy?
Would it not have been better to scan him before mating the pair rather than waiting until his mate was dead and then scanning him!
This all sounds very illogical to me.
Sins