• If you're a past member of the board, but can't recall your password any more, you don't need to set up a new account (unless you wish to). As long as you recall your old login name, you can log in with that user name then select 'forgot password' and the board will email you at your registration email, to let you reset your password.

Confused

I am making an unashamed plug here and hope it is in order but a CD I compiled of photographs of early dogs is on the Cavalier Clubs website here .....
http://www.thecavalierclub.co.uk/pay/cavshop.html it is called Cavalier King Charles Spaniels Of The Past and costs £10 plus p&p. The £10 goes to Cavalier Health Research.

Forgot to add once you have clicked on the above links, click on Buy Books. You can also view a sample page.
 
I bought that a while ago and I absolutely loved it. Well done Ruth, it's really something worth preserving.It would make a marvellous stocking filler for any cavalier lover this Christmas.
Sins
 
Thanks Sins. Volume 2 is in progress at the present time and will be available to coincide with the Blenheim Palace Show next August. Again all proceeds to Cavalier Health Research so I hope it sells out!!
 
Wow....I bet that has some fascinating pictures!! Ruth, I love when you post....because I get to see that dirty face in your avatar....cracks me up every time :D
 
Sure AM ,Rod, with so many regrets about what I had believed and said in the Past.

To Pauline, thanks so much for your support,.

At the moment on the Cavalier Chat Forum there are a Few behaving like a Bunch of WEANS, some are Scots, this is a Scots Word ,so I dont have to Translate it!

Kathy I have been reading your Posts ,and I do so agree with what you are trying to get across.

You will have realized by now that you are not alone in your views. Times have changed , we Cavalier Pet Owners are just not afraid any more to speak out about the Problems affilcting our Cavalier Breed.

I'm not certain ,but are there other Breeds , whose Pet Owners are now beginning to speak out about their Particular Breed Health Problems.

Could I mention, Kathy, if you could go to

www.cavaliercampaign.com

There you will see what Carol ,has done and is continuing to do.
 
Here's a concern:

It is clear that far too many breeders and people who are very involved on discussion lists and with breed clubs STILL are not aware of even the most basic steps that have been taken by national and international clubs on health issues, STILL are debating issues that in some cases no longer even exist, STILL are woefully poorly informed about the current state of research, what their own clubs are doing, what is being proposed.

That returns us to the same old issue -- if breeders are concerned about their image, what are their clubs doing to combat it? What are their representatives on their regional and national clubs doing? How many of those breeders on those committees and clubs cardiac test? MRI? How many health reps do? If not, why not? If they don't, if the clubs don't fundraise and support health research but only send a few random members off to argue on discussion lists, then what proof of any commitment to health is there? How is the average puppy buyer supposed to believe that clubs or breeders care when we cannot even find a basic list of breeders who do some basic health screening, when we do go looking for puppies? Would clubs do a survey of committee members and see where each stands? Will they explain why they feel there shouldn't be a public list of the sort that some have tried to set up that would enable breeders to list what they do and with which dogs? Will breeders not go ask their clubs why they themselves are unaware of key developments and even, basic information and research results on SM and MVD? In the age of the internet why do they not have more links to current research and more basic briefing documents on their websites?

Only this past week it was clear some breeders who are very vocal on SM, some of whom regularly have had negative things to say about researchers and scanning and concerns about breeders -- were not even aware that there is a list of dogs scanned on the UK Club site. This list now features hundreds of dogs from breeders and pet owners internationally, and has been there for over HALF A DECADE now!! :sl*p: Several breeders reacted with shock and indignation when the UK scanned dogs list was mentioned as Kathy noted -- they questioned whether it existed and implied if so, it seemed to be some evil plot (from pet owners, was the subtext...). More welcome was at least one person's interest in including their own dogs -- but what huge gaps in education and leadership from the national clubs if breeders of long standing remain unaware of this list!

Sheesh. This is why so many of us are tired of being told any concern at all abut health issues, breeders and dogs is not our business. What kind of vacuum of self-indulgent ignorance do some of these people live in (the ones unaware of the list still, years on, and implying such a list was a bad thing)? Do they NEVER read any posts except their own friends' posts on SM (god forbid they should learn something new...)? Do they never look at any of the other club's websites, particularly the UK Club's which has consistently had the most information on ongoing SM research (it sure seems pet owners take more interest in club websites than club members and are more familiar with the contents)? Do they simply wish to remain this clueless, as it serves their ability to non-debate to their hearts' content? How dare they then tell owners with affected dogs that 'there is SM and then there is SM', as one did last week upon hearing of a confirmed diagnosis (I kid you not) -- apparently suggesting that it isn't really anything for the owner to worry about? On the other hand, what better evidence than such a breathtakingly arrogant statement to indicate that it is apparently fine with these people to breed dogs with serious disease as long as the dog isn't showing pain that they can see. Would these same people say to a friend with a tumour, "Well, there is cancer and then there is cancer"?

The only conclusion that can be drawn from some a statement is that some feel it is OK to normalise ill health (just as MVD has in many circles now become so unworthy of remark that when dogs of only 6 or 7 are heart-murmur free, breeders post this news in excitement). I cannot think any parent would be happy living with the knowledge that their child had syrinxes, a grievously abnormal state of health. Regardless of whether there are any external signs of discomfort at the time of a scan, those who care about the affected patient, be it a parent with a child or an owner with a dog, must live with a potential pain time bomb every day of the remainder of that patient's life, always worried that what is latent will become debilitating. It is opinions like this, expressed on public lists, that make people wonder about how committed breeders are to addressing these health issues. I and many others don't care that sometimes SM has painful symptoms and sometimes it does not; that some cavaliers with heart murmurs at 5 live to age 10 or even 14 and some die in hideous pain at age 6. We want you to get your collective act together, and pressure your clubs and committee members and fellow breeders to show they care about more than organising dog shows.

There are many great individual breeders and brave committee members trying hard to preserve a future for the breed and push clubs in responsible directions. Those of you need to find each other and work together for change just as many pet owners and owners of health-affected dogs are doing. If you don't get the committees and clubs to work towards the goals you want then the entire profession of breeding will continue in disrepute. And you WILL end up regulated from outside.
 
Confused.

Can I thank Karlin from the bottom of my Heart for what she has just Posted.

I will be going for a Coffee shortly ,how good it will taste.

I can only speak for my-self ,but the passed few days have been a bit Grim for me because of the Vindictive ,Venomous Posts directed at me.

What Karlin has described when any of us Cavalier Pet Owners speak ,as some Cavaliers Breeders think ,out of turn, to put it mildly ,we are Hammered.

As some of us know ,we are told ,what business is it of ours,that at the Moment Many Cavalier Breeders are feelig Vulnerable and Insecure .

Well my answer to that Statement ,is WELL TOUGH!!!

Where were many of the Cavalier Breeders who now Profess to Love our Cavalier Breed,when the MVD was first recognized as becoming a Serious Health Issue for Cavaliers,at least 20 years ago,but they are now saying they are doing what they can about it.

Is this a case of Shutting the Stable Door after the Horse has Bolted.?

I won't repeat again about the Cardiologist's Comments about this ,. The Health Representative of a Regional CKCS CLUB , made such Scurrilous Comments about him on a Cavalier List on the Internet,that I could'nt be part of that Club when the Health Representative had such Views about a Heart Expert who is trying to help in the Battle against the MVD Problem that I had no choice but to resign from that Club.

As Karlin has said, why can't there be a Publc List of Cavalier Breeders who carry out Health Tests on their Cavalier Breeding Stock, this would save the Humiliation of some Prospective Cavalier Buyers being given abusive replies when they ask to see a Health Certificate from the Cavalier Breeder .

I know the same lame old excuse is always trotted out by some Cavalier Breeders ,that the Health Tests are for their benefit ,to know about their Breeding Stock, but it's not, it surely is for the benefit of the Cavalier Pet Buyer to know that the Cavalier they are interested in buying, the Cavalier Breeder has the concern of the Health Problems of the Cavalier Breed.

Finally ,I do hope that at the forth coming UK CKCS CLUB AGM ,there will be a Proposal put forward ,that there should now be a Publc List of Cavalier Breeders who are carrying out Health Tests, for SM and MVD,so that the Prospective Cavalier Buyers will know which Cavalier Breeder to go to.

I know that all the Health Tests in the World won't guarantee that a Cavalier Puppy won't suffer from a Health Problem in the Future, but at least the Cavalier Buyer will know that they are dealing with a Cavalier Breeder who is trying their best for the Future of our Lovely Breed.
 
Bravo!!!

:mexwav: :thnx: :lotsaluv: :pi*no:

Three cheers to Karlin and Bet and Margaret and Carol and Rod and Brian and Karen and Oreo and Mark and..OMG, I will mess this up because I can't go back and put in all of your names and I am sorry that I have left your name off this list...but BRAVO to all of you who are standing up and saying, "NO MORE!!!" There have to be enough of us that we could start our own "subversive" list of breeders that test. Maybe? In any event BRAVO! You have my deepest gratitude and respect for all that you do and how strongly you stand up for Cavaliers and their owners. The thing nobody seems to understand is that you are standing up for RESPONSIBLE breeders, also. The RESPONSIBLE breeders should be deeply grateful to you all.

As I told them when discussing the list of breeders that have posted their names of the MRI list, I KNOW that a clear MRI at 2 years may not be a clear MRI at 4 years. That the list of breeders that have had their dogs tested does NOT include the results of the testing. That nobody (now) can guarantee that they will not produce a puppy free of SM or MVD. But I am certainly going to trust a breeder that has tested and is willing to show me the results. I am NEVER going to get another puppy from someone who hasn't tested or will not show me the results of testing. That the only people I think I could ever trust are people who are willing to be transparent about their breeding and business practices. And that is EXACTLY what I tell anybody who asks me about Cavalier puppies. Many of you have been saying this for a LONG time. I just didn't hear it before I got Levi. The cabal of arrogant and ignorant and deceptive breeders does not want anyone to hear it. BUT we can make sure that more and more people DO hear it. People do not have to test or screen (yet) but sooner or later, they will find that nobody will feel safe buying their puppies if they don't test.

Every puppy deserves a good home even if the puppy does have an inherited disease and I am glad that Levi has (I think, anyway) a good home. But people who know that the puppy has a disease and have the resources to adopt it and care for its illness will be able to provide much better homes for that puppy. Nobody should take on this kind of responsibility blind to the difficulty. It is evil and it is cruel to puppies and the people who love them.

Poor Levi could only be a show dog in a show that wanted to point out the faults in Cavalier appearance and health. But I love him dearly and I have been able to find ways to care for him. How dare people think that only the most beautiful show dogs have worth? All animals and all people deserve to be born healthy and that is not going to happen without all of you and your work. How DARE somebody be hateful and ugly to people who are working for basic animal rights and basic human rights?

Kathy
 
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Kathy, Thank You for your comments, I do appreciate them so much.

You mentioned the word Ugly, dare I say this, but are some Folk Ugly on the Inside .
 
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