Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 24

Thread: I am in shock

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Leicester
    Posts
    2,614
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default I am in shock

    I don’t really know where to start. I am still in shock.
    Yesterday I accompanied my friend to an excellent veterinary centre. This place is mainly to see specialists for anything you can imagine. If some of you remember Ebony’s mum had a bad turn about two weeks ago and the vet didn’t really find anything. My friend instincts told her that there was something wrong with her ears so she pressed the vet for an referral for an MRI. The vet called her paranoid but referred her. The Neurologist also agreed that if she could see CM on the scan she would do a full scan to check for SM. Well to cut a long story short we went there to find out what’s wrong with her ears, and there is something wrong I can’t remember exactly what it is called it is like glue ear in humans. But the biggest shock came when we saw the scans. The Neurologist described it as bad. She has CM and SM, there are three syrinxes in her spine. What we can’t understand that she doesn’t show ANY signs of discomfort, no scratching no tenderness on her neck or back absolutely nothing she is so full of life. I really don’t understand it as when I read all the posts on here the dogs with SM (especially with three syrinxes) are all displaying symptoms.
    I ask the neurologist that of all the Cavaliers she has seen if there were any without CM and she just shook her head.
    Sabby
    Rosie-06/06 - Ebony-01/07 Harley-08/08
    " My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes "

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Rayleigh, Southend-On-Sea, United Kingdom, United Kingdom
    Posts
    8,136
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    It can happen. Dylan's neuro said there is not always a correlation between symptoms and syrinx as is the case for Dylan, he does scratch etc but considering how bad his 2 syrinx are, you'd expect a lot of pain. Though I have to say, there are many other symptoms you probably wouldn't notice unless you were with the dog all the time.
    ....
    Dylan, Poppy & Kipling's
    *''' ' "*Mummy`` "*'
    ,'*" "*'

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,592
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    15

    Default I am in Shock

    Sabby,

    I was so sorry to read your Post,this is why Karlin ,Margaret and Carol, are battling so hard about the SM Problem in the Cavalier Breed.
    Bet (Hargreaves)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Dublin, Ireland
    Posts
    24,050
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    15

    Default

    I'm so sorry for your friend's result. There are two possible reasons for why she has not seen outward signs (a common result on scans as many who go to the club scanning programmes will confirm!).

    Dr Marino explained this well at a presentation at the SM conference in Rugby where he showed a slide of a cavalier with a spine full of syrinxes and noted that because they develop slowly over time, many dogs simply adjust gradually to having them and to the pain. People who have neuropathic pain will confirm that this is often the case, you just get on with things. Dr Marino said that of the syrinxes had come on suddenly, say as the result of an impact, the dog would probably have died of pain -- it would have been intolerable. But they simply learn to live with it. That is why many SM dogs get scoliosis when younger -- where their neck bends in a C -- which is a reaction to the pain of a syrinx. They curve their neck to relieve the pain from the syrinx. But typically, scoliosis gradually goes away. The reason is most likely that the dog learns to live with that level of discomfort.

    The other reason is that as Dr Rusrbidge's and Nick Jeffrie's work has shown, pain is correlated to the width and position of the syrinx. Large syrinxes that are lopsided and close or against the walls of the spinal cord cause pain. Smaller or more centralised syrinxes tend not to. Also CSF flow seems to be very elevant. Some dogs seem to have different flow patterns that cause less pain. This is known in humans -- there is published work on it.

    The problem is that dogs with syrinxes tend to be a lot more likely to eventually show signs of pain. That is why it can show in older dogs who showed no signs for most of their life. They may just have adjusted to the pain.

    My Leo has one large, short but wide syrinx in his spine. It is fairly central so we seem lucky that it has not caused more pain that it has. His scratching has gradually become more pronounced to the extent that he has scratched off the darker outer layer of hair on his ears, but to an onlooker he is a happy outgoing dog. Only occasionally is he sensitive to touch in certain areas. But he also has balance problems that would never be noticed by most people. Most owners might just joke that their dog is a bit clumsy. I know this is due to some limb weakness. Neurologists can do some clinical tests of a dog's reactions etc to see whether there are signs and sensitivities an owner can easily miss. This is oftem the case -- the signs are there but they are what specialists spot, not what owners notice.

    It would IMHO be smart to start a dog with syrinxes on something like frusemide or cimetidine. There is some evidence that this slows or even halts syrinx development if started early enough -- and cannot do much harm.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Coventry UK
    Posts
    1,877
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Hi Sabby

    One of the real problems with SM is that it manifests itself in so many different ways (which can also be symptoms of other unrelated conditions) and is so unpredictable. As far as I understand (though others will correct me if I'm wrong), whether or not a syrinx causes problems has to do more with its width than its length. As long as it is narrow, it may cause few problems; if it starts spreading wider (usually on one side) it starts hitting the nerves carried in the spinal cord and this then causes lameness, pain, etc. My Oliver's syrinx, for example, having been small and narrow until he was almost 8, has now started to interfere with the nerves to his right front leg, so that he has lost his reflexes and limps a little when he gets tired. We can only wait and see whether his syrinx will continue to widen - and cause more damage - or whether the frusemide he takes will inhibit it from getting any larger.

    I don't envy the researchers trying to find a path through this minefield!

    Kate, Oliver and Aled

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Coventry UK
    Posts
    1,877
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    My post overlapped with Karlin's, who is much better qualified than I am to answer Sabby's question!

    Kate, Oliver and Aled

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Leicester
    Posts
    2,614
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Thank you all very much for you replies.
    Karlin: The Neurologist done these clinical tests before the scan and commented that she dont think that my friends dog has SM.
    We did ask the Neurologist if there is anything she can take to slow it down and she said NO.
    I will definitely talk to my friend and tell her of what has been mentioned in regards of the frusemide or cimetidine.
    Sabby
    Rosie-06/06 - Ebony-01/07 Harley-08/08
    " My sunshine doesn't come from the skies, it comes from the love in my dogs eyes "

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Diego, California
    Posts
    8,700
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I was sorry to hear about your friend Sabby. I just hate how baffling this disease is. I had Shelby MRI'd a couple of months back. She has a rather large syrinx but no malformation. She has very few symptoms and they are few and far between for now. I have sent my scans to Dr. Rusbridge to get her opinion. We are not treating Shelby with any medication right now, although that may change based on Dr. Rusbridge's interpretation of the scans. This disease just scares me so, this is why the need for research is so huge.
    Last edited by Cathy T; 28th October 2009 at 02:34 PM.
    Cathy
    Loving mom to Jake, Shelby and Micah

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Hatfield, Herts, UK
    Posts
    2,745
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    20

    Default

    I am so sorry that you friend has had such upsetting results, but for her cavalier's sake thank goodness she followed her own instincts.


    Best wishes
    Margaret C

    Cavaliers......Faith, The Ginger Tank and Woody.
    Japanese Chins.... Dandy, Benny, Bridgette and Hana.
    Remembered with love......... Tommy Tuppence and Fonzi

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southwest Florida
    Posts
    1,083
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Sabby, I'm sorry to hear about your friend's Cavalier. In talking about the dog having no symptoms: your friend was convinced there was something wrong with her ears, right? So what was her dog doing that made her think that? There must have been SOMETHING that made her press for a specialist referral?
    Trisha in Southwest Florida
    Cavaliers: Casey, Ollie, & Winston and usually a foster or two! Cats: Pebbles & Benson

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •