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Thread: New information from mri scans

  1. #1
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    Default New information from mri scans

    I just don't know whether this latest Research Results could involve our Cavalier Breed

    This Research has been carried out in Australia,and has been Reported in the Press there.

    Humans have been Breeding Dogs for Specific Traits for Centuries,

    Now Researchers have found Selective Breeding has also Altered the Shape and Position of their Brains.

    Using MRI Scans Sydney Researchers have discovered that the Brains of Small ,Pug -Like Dogs have Rotated forward in their Skulls ,compared to Larger ,Long Nosed Dogs such as Dalmations and German Shepherds.

    Does this sound familiar to what Professor Sir P Bateson mentioned in his recent Report concerning Cavaliers ,that the SM Problem in Cavaliers,the Brain is involved.

    Bet
    Bet (Hargreaves)

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    Do you have a link to the story, Bet? That sounds really interesting to read.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

  3. #3
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    Default New information from mri scans

    Quote Originally Posted by Karlin View Post
    Do you have a link to the story, Bet? That sounds really interesting to read.

    Karlin,

    I read this on the

    dogz onlinforums

    It's an Australian Forum, it was mentioned on the In The News section.

    Unfortunately, as usual, there were some Breeders making insulting remarks about this information on their Posts replying to this information.

    What is it with some Breeders that they just can't see the Woods for the Trees.

    I know that here in Britain , mention about the Cavaliers having Health Problems ,All Hell is Let Loose!!!

    I noticed the Cavalier Breed Columnist in her Column in Dog World this week, mentioned about the forth-coming Meeting in October with Dr C Rusbridge and Dr J Sampson, giving information about the KC/BVA MRI Scheme, but in her opinion not many Cavalier Breeders would be wanting to be involved in it..

    Another Post on a Cavalier List Forum said that ,why there are Fewer Cavaliers being Bred at the moment ,is because the Cavalier Breeders are waiting for answers to be being found for the Health Problems in Cavaliers.

    If some Cavalier Breeders will not support the Researchers ,how will the Answers ever be found.

    Sorry,if I have went off on another subject, but really some-times you Despair about the Attitude of some Cavalier Breeders.

    Bet

    .
    Bet (Hargreaves)

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    Default New information from mri scans

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    Karlin,

    I read this on the

    dogz onlinforums

    It's an Australian Forum, it was mentioned on the In The News section.

    Unfortunately, as usual, there were some Breeders making insulting remarks about this information on their Posts replying to this information.

    What is it with some Breeders that they just can't see the Woods for the Trees.

    I know that here in Britain , mention about the Cavaliers having Health Problems ,All Hell is Let Loose!!!

    I noticed the Cavalier Breed Columnist in her Column in Dog World this week, mentioned about the forth-coming Meeting in October with Dr C Rusbridge and Dr J Sampson, giving information about the KC/BVA MRI Scheme, but in her opinion not many Cavalier Breeders would be wanting to be involved in it..

    Another Post on a Cavalier List Forum said that ,why there are Fewer Cavaliers being Bred at the moment ,is because the Cavalier Breeders are waiting for answers to be being found for the Health Problems in Cavaliers.

    If some Cavalier Breeders will not support the Researchers ,how will the Answers ever be found.

    Sorry,if I have went off on another subject, but really some-times you Despair about the Attitude of some Cavalier Breeders.

    Bet

    .

    PS

    Here is the exact Quote from the Cavalier Columnist in this week's DOG WORLD.

    "IN my opinion ,the likelihood of Members remaining in the scheme as it stands is pretty remote"

    I do hope she will explain what she means by making this Statement.

    Bet
    Bet (Hargreaves)

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    How wonderfully supportive of breed health!

    If such a typically sour perspective from this person holds true (though again -- what a wonderfully revealing viewpoint to send on to Sheila Crispin, Prof Bateson, and your own MPs working on animal welfare issues around dog breeding...), then the issue can be laid directly at the door of the past and present UK CKCS Club committee, which seems unable to talk to anyone productively on the issue of breed health, or organise anything health-related that would directly address their broader membership's concerns and the breed's own future (funny how they could throw hundreds of hours of work and thousands of pounds into their big show gala at Blenheim this year though, isn't it?). Priorities, priorities!

    The breed club had *direct* input into this scheme and it involves their own KC advisor/geneticist, so surely it is the responsibility of the current committee, to both the members they represent and to the breed they supposedly care about, to go back and meet with 1) the Kennel Club, 2) the RVC, 3) Jeff Sampson, 4) Dr Rusbridge -- and sort their mess out if it is not strongly supported (but on the other hand -- as club members have never much supported any health initiative or protocol in any meaningful numbers, as their own heart specialist has confirmed -- why would anyone expect some of these people to change now, even though increasing numbers of cavalier owners find they have cavaliers shrieking in pain?). Are they really so utterly incapable of working -with- anyone on health issues -- for a scheme -they asked for- -- and that involves organisations and individuals who clearly are far more aware of the reality of these breed problems because they do the research and see the patients with the conditions?

    If the scheme is not supported, then it is a public condemnation and indictment of the club, the committee, and breeders who refuse to do so. Nothing more clearly would show gross ineptitude and an extraordinary inability to do one iota towards dealing with this drastic breed problem than the fact that they would ignore a programme thats the national Kennel Club, the leading vet research school, their own advisor and geneticist, and the leading researcher into SM agree on as absolutely critical to helping this breed.

    As we can see, the priority for funding and club effort is obviously parading their dogs at Blenheim... where too many will feel that buying something at the health auction will be doing their bit for health -- meanwhile not properly heart or SM-testing their dogs, not following breeding protocols, not supporting research, and not doing anything meaningful for the breed.

    Some of these people should know better -- you know who you are, ladies and gents of the club -- though they hide the facts, they know full will how many of their dogs produce affected offspring, and shamelessly sell on dogs they know are affected to breeders in other countries, who continue to breed them and further diminish the hope of ever minimising, much less eradicating, SM. And many other breeders in the clubs on both sides of the ocean know, whisper about it, AND DO NOTHING.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

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    Found the articles:

    http://southern-courier.whereilive.c...ins-in-a-spin/

    http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/...727-10uet.html

    First one:

    For the first time, scientists have shown that selective breeding of domestic dogs is not only dramatically changing the way animals look but is also driving major changes in the canine brain.

    The brains of many short-snouted dog breeds have rotated forward as much as 15 degrees, while the brain region controlling smell has fundamentally relocated, researchers from the University of New South Wales and University of Sydney have found.

    The large variations in dog skull size and shape follow more than 12,000 years of breeding for functional and aesthetic traits.

    The discovery of such dramatic reorganisation of the canine brain raises important questions about impacts on dog behavior.

    The research is published this month in the Public Library of Sciences journal PLoS One.

    Researchers from UNSW’s Brain and Ageing Research Program and Sydney University’s Faculty of Veterinary Science used magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) to look at brains across a range of breeds.

    “We found strong and independent correlations between the size and shape of a dog’s skull, and brain rotation and the positioning of the olfactory lobe,” said study co-author, Dr Michael Valenzuela, from UNSW’s School of Psychiatry

    “As a dog’s head or skull shape becomes flatter – more pug-like – the brain rotates forward and the smell centre of the brain drifts further down to the lowest position in the skull,” Dr Valenzuela said.

    No other animal has enjoyed the level of human affection and companionship like the dog, nor undergone such a systemic and deliberate intervention in its biology through breeding, the authors note. The diversity suggests a unique level of plasticity in the canine genome.

    “Canines seem to be incredibly responsive to human intervention through breeding. It’s amazing that a dog’s brain can accommodate such large differences in skull shape through these kinds of changes – it’s something that hasn’t been documented in other species,” Dr Valenzuela said.

    Health impacts from breed specific disorders – such as pug encephalitis and hip problems in German shepherds – are well documented; however, until now little had been known about the effects of human intervention on dogs’ brains.

    Co-author Associate Professor Paul McGreevy from the University of Sydney noted: “We think of dogs living in a world of smell – but this finding strongly suggests that one dog’s world of smell may be very different from another’s.”

    “The next obvious step is to try to find out if these changes in brain organisation are also linked to systematic differences in dogs’ brain function,” Dr Valenzuela said.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

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    From the second article:

    ''The very small, pug-like dogs have only come about through selective breeding.''

    Brain rotation in these could be an evolutionary trade-off because the length of their skulls had decreased in proportion to the width, said Dr Valenzuela, whose findings have been published in the journal PLoS ONE. ''We speculate that one of the reasons the brain may be rotating in pug-like dogs is that if it hadn't rotated then there would be less space for the frontal lobe to develop,'' he said.

    The frontal lobe is an area of the brain responsible for intelligence and problem solving, as well as social behaviour.

    Dr Valenzuela said examining the link between brain changes in dogs and their behaviour would be the next step in the research. ''The obvious step forward is to do more sophisticated cognitive and behavioural tests in dogs and see if there is a relationship between brain rotation [and behaviour].''
    All of this would seem to quite directly link in to the issues of how SM develops as skull shape changes in smaller breeds. Many researchers feel smallness as well as a shorter muzzle are two of the creators of canine SM problems -- because only smaller and/or flatter faced breeds are known to develop SM linked to brain and skull size/shape.

    Really interesting -- I sent along to researchers.
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

  8. #8
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    Default New information from mri scans

    Quote Originally Posted by Karlin View Post
    From the second article:



    All of this would seem to quite directly link in to the issues of how SM develops as skull shape changes in smaller breeds. Many researchers feel smallness as well as a shorter muzzle are two of the creators of canine SM problems -- because only smaller and/or flatter faced breeds are known to develop SM linked to brain and skull size/shape.

    Really interesting -- I sent along to researchers.

    NEW INFORMATION FROM MRI SCANS

    Thanks Karlin for that information.if I could add to your Post, I have contacted Professor S Crispin about my Mental State being called into Question on a Public Cavalier Forum Internet List by a newly Elected UK CKCS Club Committee Member because I have dared to mention the Health Problems in our Cavalier Breed, and that as a Result I have Resigned from the CKCS CLUB, and that the Reason for my Resignation is to be being Read out at the Committee Meeting to-day.

    I received a Reply to my E-Mail from Professor S Crispin.

    I now think it could be worth -while contacting her again about what has just appeared in this Week's Dog World from the Cavalier Breed Columnist.

    I really do wonder about all the time and effort being put into the Blenheim Show, is it possible that it is just a PR Exercise, because when mention of it first appeared on the Internet, it was claimed ,that it would Improve the Image of the Cavalier Breed.

    I do hope that information will be forth-coming from the CKCS Club Committee is, as to what their position is in with regard KC /BVA Meeting in October with Dr C Rusbridge and Dr J Sampson.

    Will they or won't they be supporting the Recommendations to be announced at it?

    I think Cavalier Owners whether Club Members or not deserve to know the CKCS CLUB'S Committee Stance on this Important Matter.

    Bet
    Bet (Hargreaves)

  9. #9
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    is it possible that it is just a PR Exercise, because when mention of it first appeared on the Internet, it was claimed ,that it would Improve the Image of the Cavalier Breed.
    I think there's a full and genuine desire to celebrate this very special breed at a special place associated with its origins. But yes, how ironic if it becomes little more than a fluffy festival when there's such an opportunity to actually make commitments to do something and to educate. And how despicable if the 'image of the breed' merely means PR spin and continuing denial and refusal to work with researchers.

    If the club by their (in)action refuse to support their own scheme, then the truth will be there for everyone to see -- people can talk all they like about how they will support this scheme or that, this researcher or that but as soon as it is clear that properly addressing the health issues means acting responsibly, means a financial commitment (well, doh! So does buying puppies that cost from 500 to $2500 for pet owners!), means making difficult decisions to remove nice looking dogs from breeding programmes, means getting and then actually using scan information, means funding work towards a genetic test... then suddenly interest shifts to a new researcher with a less directly threatening research project that will have no direct impact on breeders and how they continue to breed or potentially reveal some dogs as poor mate choices.

    Look at the dearth of information being given to Dr Sarah Blott -- safe to support her and champion her work while the end results were way off in the distance, but when she actually needed MRI results to launch the EBVs, information did not go through to her and still is not going through to her (despite hundreds and hundreds of club member scans having been done, often at club subsidy).

    Same thing seems to risk happening now with the RVC scheme.

    A responsible club committee would vote on whether to publicly support the scheme and make a clear statement on their website, of course, as this was once upon a time, a club supported initiative. is it still? The results of the vote should be public so that members know how their representatives voted. And if they do not support it, the club committee needs to explain why it could not manage to work successfully to produce a scheme with its oversight organisation, the leading vet college, its own vet advisor and geneticist, and the leading researcher into a health problem that affects their breed in shocking numbers.

    It would seem to raise some serous questions for Dr Crispin, Prof Bateson and others, would it not, if ONLY the group that has a vested personal and financial interest in the breed could not support a critical, jointly-produced health-related scheme?
    Karlin
    Cavaliers: Jaspar Lily Tansy Libby Mindy
    In memory: Lucy Leo
    Cavalier SM Information site:www.smcavaliers.com

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