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Thread: Why oh why????

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    Default Why oh why????

    Are there other Lovers of our Cavaliers like me who get a wee bit Fed Up when we dare put our our Heads Above the Parapet and mention the Health Problems in our Cherished Cavalier Breed ,we are accused of Constantly Indiscrimmiately Baiting Cavalier Breeders.

    That this will cause all the Health Conscious Cavalier Breeders to walk away.

    My answer to this Statement to this is, why at the UK CKCS CLUB's AGM was an effort made to block the Breeding Guidelines Recommended by the CKCS CLUB for SM.

    Why did a Cavalier Health Representative on a Cavalier Forum on the Internet make Derogatory Comments about the CKCS CLUB's Cardiologist.?

    Another Cavalier Breeder made the comment that she does not believe the 50% figures of Cavaliers having Heart Murmurs.at 5 - 6.This also on a Cavalier Forum.

    I think we will remember the Article from another Cavalier Breeder about what makes a Good Committee Member !!

    Last but not Least the Furore from so many Cavalier Breeders when the PDE TV Program was aired ,and Margaret was forced to Resign from the CKCS Club Committee for appearing on the Program.

    If it had not been for some Cavalier Breeders like Margaret, Pet Cavalier Owners like Karlin and Carol, would any notice have been taken by many Cavalier Breeders who were warned for so long that the Cavalier Breed had Two very Serious Healt Problems Afflicting it.

    Even to- day so many Cavalier Breeders are not Accredited Breeders, nuff said about their reason of WHY NOT!!!!.

    The SM Researchers have had to move onto another Breed at the moment because of not enough information coming to them from Cavalier Breeders.

    Finally the Gem of a Post that was made about me was, I only like to cause Trouble when I mention the Health Problems in Cavaliers.

    I have been involved in collecting the Ages of Long Lived Cavaliers for many years ,and have always believed and said that it was better for a Cavalier to have as many Long Lived Ancestors in the Pedigree Back-ground as Possible, but now I wonder if I was wrong in believing this, what if those Cavaliers were Carriers of Genes of the Health Problems afflicting Cavaliers to-day.

    I do so believe that the best way for the Cavalier Breed to have a Future ,is Find the Gene/Genes for MVD and SM, that way the Cavalier Carriers of those Two Diseases will also be being found, this is all down to the Researchers who are trying to find those Genes.

    Bet
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    Default Why oh why????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    Are there other Lovers of our Cavaliers like me who get a wee bit Fed Up when we dare put our our Heads Above the Parapet and mention the Health Problems in our Cherished Cavalier Breed ,we are accused of Constantly Indiscrimmiately Baiting Cavalier Breeders.

    That this will cause all the Health Conscious Cavalier Breeders to walk away.

    My answer to this Statement to this is, why at the UK CKCS CLUB's AGM was an effort made to block the Breeding Guidelines Recommended by the CKCS CLUB for SM.

    Why did a Cavalier Health Representative on a Cavalier Forum on the Internet make Derogatory Comments about the CKCS CLUB's Cardiologist.?

    Another Cavalier Breeder made the comment that she does not believe the 50% figures of Cavaliers having Heart Murmurs.at 5 - 6.This also on a Cavalier Forum.

    I think we will remember the Article from another Cavalier Breeder about what makes a Good Committee Member !!

    Last but not Least the Furore from so many Cavalier Breeders when the PDE TV Program was aired ,and Margaret was forced to Resign from the CKCS Club Committee for appearing on the Program.

    If it had not been for some Cavalier Breeders like Margaret, Pet Cavalier Owners like Karlin and Carol, would any notice have been taken by many Cavalier Breeders who were warned for so long that the Cavalier Breed had Two very Serious Healt Problems Afflicting it.

    Even to- day so many Cavalier Breeders are not Accredited Breeders, nuff said about their reason of WHY NOT!!!!.

    The SM Researchers have had to move onto another Breed at the moment because of not enough information coming to them from Cavalier Breeders.

    Finally the Gem of a Post that was made about me was, I only like to cause Trouble when I mention the Health Problems in Cavaliers.

    I have been involved in collecting the Ages of Long Lived Cavaliers for many years ,and have always believed and said that it was better for a Cavalier to have as many Long Lived Ancestors in the Pedigree Back-ground as Possible, but now I wonder if I was wrong in believing this, what if those Cavaliers were Carriers of Genes of the Health Problems afflicting Cavaliers to-day.

    I do so believe that the best way for the Cavalier Breed to have a Future ,is Find the Gene/Genes for MVD and SM, that way the Cavalier Carriers of those Two Diseases will also be being found, this is all down to the Researchers who are trying to find those Genes.

    Bet

    WHY OH WHY ????

    I am not sure whether this is the Right Thread to Post this or not ,but here goes.

    In a Recent Veterinary Paper , which can be seen on the Internet ,about MMVD, Myxomatous Mitral Valve Disease in Dogs , this is also known as Endocardiosis or Chronic Valvular Disease according to this Veterinary Paper, nearly
    100% of Cavaliers suffer from this Condition at 10 years of age.

    No doubt there would have been mention made at the recent Blenheim Palace Cavalier Show about the ages of Long Lived Cavaliers .

    No-body will know better I would think, than what I do about the ages of Long Lived Cavaliers ,since over the years I have collected around 2,000 ages and names of Cavaliers who have lived to 12 years and over ,along with the Names and Ages that their Sires and Dams lived to that I was able to find out about.

    It was so pleasing to have done this , but it should never be being used by some Cavalier Breeders that many Long Lived Cavaliers are the Norm for our Cavaliers, it has to be realized that Cavaliers are not a Healthy Breed.

    I think it has been mentioned that they are one of the at Risk Dog Breeds with the Health Problems afflicting them.

    If I could mention again ,that nearly 100% of Cavaliers suffer from MMVD at 10 years of age ,I am in no way saying that those Long Lived Cavaliers had MMVD ,but is the Possibility there that they could be Carriers of the MMVD GENES.

    There probably will be here in Britain to-day ,because there are roughly 10,000 Cavaliers Registered yearly by the Kennel Club,100,000 Cavaliers at 10 years of age suffering from MMVD,if not from MMVD, then will they be Carriers of the MMVD Genes.

    I do think that some Cavalier Breeders are doing the Breed a disservice in trying to cover this fact up from the Veterinary Paper

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    ... In a Recent Veterinary Paper , which can be seen on the Internet ,about MMVD, Myxomatous Mitral Valve Disease in Dogs , this is also known as Endocardiosis or Chronic Valvular Disease according to this Veterinary Paper, nearly 100% of Cavaliers suffer from this Condition at 10 years of age. ...
    Bet, when you refer to a published article, could you also provide enough information -- like the title, names of authors, name of journal, webpage, etc. -- so that we could find the article and read it?
    Rod Russell

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    Default Why oh why ????

    Quote Originally Posted by RodRussell View Post
    Bet, when you refer to a published article, could you also provide enough information -- like the title, names of authors, name of journal, webpage, etc. -- so that we could find the article and read it?
    WHY OH WHY ???

    ROD ,

    Here is the Link.

    http://www.eurolupa.org/index.php?op...emim=8&lang=en

    It was written at the University of Copenhagen

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    Default Why oh why ????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    WHY OH WHY ???

    ROD ,

    Here is the Link.

    http://www.eurolupa.org/index.php?op...emim=8&lang=en

    It was written at the University of Copenhagen

    Bet
    WHY OH WHY ????

    Rod ,

    I should also have said that this is a LUPA PROJECT

    It involves a European Research Project gathering Experts in GENOMICS.

    Veterinary Clinics from 12 European Countries are Collecting DNA Samples from Large Cohorts of Dogs suffering from a Range of thoroughly Defined Diseases of Relevence to Human Health.

    The Diseases under Scope are described under the Different Workpackages WP 1 TO WP 5

    I have copied this from their Web Site, but if I could add that Simon Swift the UK CKCS CLUB'S Cardiologist had an
    Article about this on the CKCS CLUB'S Web-SITE ,mentioning that the Cavaliers in Britain were involved in the LUPA Project because of their Heart Problem.

    The Cavaliers are involved in the Gene Research in Canada for SM in Cavaliers, and now our Cavalier Breed is also involved in the LUPA Gene Research for their Heart Problem, so at Long Last is the Future Brighter for our Cavaliers.

    This is going to be the best way for our Breed to have hope for the Future ,is in Genetic Research.

    Sadly now what is being discovered by the Various Researchers into those Two Health Problems Afflicting the Cavalier Breed,that it appears that only a Small Percent of Cavaliers are Protected against them.

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    Default Why oh why ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    WHY OH WHY ????

    Rod ,

    I should also have said that this is a LUPA PROJECT

    It involves a European Research Project gathering Experts in GENOMICS.

    Veterinary Clinics from 12 European Countries are Collecting DNA Samples from Large Cohorts of Dogs suffering from a Range of thoroughly Defined Diseases of Relevence to Human Health.

    The Diseases under Scope are described under the Different Workpackages WP 1 TO WP 5

    I have copied this from their Web Site, but if I could add that Simon Swift the UK CKCS CLUB'S Cardiologist had an
    Article about this on the CKCS CLUB'S Web-SITE ,mentioning that the Cavaliers in Britain were involved in the LUPA Project because of their Heart Problem.

    The Cavaliers are involved in the Gene Research in Canada for SM in Cavaliers, and now our Cavalier Breed is also involved in the LUPA Gene Research for their Heart Problem, so at Long Last is the Future Brighter for our Cavaliers.

    This is going to be the best way for our Breed to have hope for the Future ,is in Genetic Research.

    Sadly now what is being discovered by the Various Researchers into those Two Health Problems Afflicting the Cavalier Breed,that it appears that only a Small Percent of Cavaliers are Protected against them.

    Bet

    WHY OH WHY ???

    Could I please return to this Thread.

    I have just had such an Acrimonious Lashing from a Cavalier Breeder on another Cavalier Forum being accused of Cavalier Bashing because I have dared to mention the MVD and SM Health Problems in our Cavaliers.

    Surely all we Lovers of Cavaliers want is for Cavaliers to be being Bred to have the Chance of Healthier ,Longer Lives ,not like some of the Cavalier Breed are having to-day.

    Some Cavalier Breeders still seem to be not following the Recommended CKCS Breeding Guidelines as was shown recently when the Top Cavalier Stud Cavaliers had been used before they were 2.5 years of age.

    Not just some Cavalier Breeders should be following those Breeding Guidelines but all Cavalier Breeders.

    Why is it when we Cavalier Folk mention the Health problems in our Breed,it is flung at us by some Cavalier Breeders

    YOU ARE NOT A CAVALIER BREEDER , NEVER HAVE BEEN ,(as had been said to me on numerous occasions).

    HOW DARE YOU TRY TO TELL US WHAT TO DO.

    Well we do dare, because we have now come to realize the Mess the Cavalier Breed is in because of the Breeding Practices of some Cavalier Breeders,and I don't mean the Puppy Farmers, but some CKCS CLUB Members.

    There seems to be a certain few CKCS Breeders who are intent on trying to make us be quiet about the Cavaliers' Health Problems, but that ,I am glad to say is not happening any-more.

    I will take all the Verbal Abuse and Anonymous Letters that's Hurled at me , but will continue to make the Cavalier Buying Public aware about the Health Problems in Cavaliers ,and the only way to improve this ,is before buying a Cavalier ,is to ask to see a Health Certificate from the Cavalier Breeder to Prove that their Cavalier Breeding Stock is being Health Tested.

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    Default Why oh why ????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    WHY OH WHY ???

    Could I please return to this Thread.

    I have just had such an Acrimonious Lashing from a Cavalier Breeder on another Cavalier Forum being accused of Cavalier Bashing because I have dared to mention the MVD and SM Health Problems in our Cavaliers.

    Surely all we Lovers of Cavaliers want is for Cavaliers to be being Bred to have the Chance of Healthier ,Longer Lives ,not like some of the Cavalier Breed are having to-day.

    Some Cavalier Breeders still seem to be not following the Recommended CKCS Breeding Guidelines as was shown recently when the Top Cavalier Stud Cavaliers had been used before they were 2.5 years of age.

    Not just some Cavalier Breeders should be following those Breeding Guidelines but all Cavalier Breeders.

    Why is it when we Cavalier Folk mention the Health problems in our Breed,it is flung at us by some Cavalier Breeders

    YOU ARE NOT A CAVALIER BREEDER , NEVER HAVE BEEN ,(as had been said to me on numerous occasions).

    HOW DARE YOU TRY TO TELL US WHAT TO DO.

    Well we do dare, because we have now come to realize the Mess the Cavalier Breed is in because of the Breeding Practices of some Cavalier Breeders,and I don't mean the Puppy Farmers, but some CKCS CLUB Members.

    There seems to be a certain few CKCS Breeders who are intent on trying to make us be quiet about the Cavaliers' Health Problems, but that ,I am glad to say is not happening any-more.

    I will take all the Verbal Abuse and Anonymous Letters that's Hurled at me , but will continue to make the Cavalier Buying Public aware about the Health Problems in Cavaliers ,and the only way to improve this ,is before buying a Cavalier ,is to ask to see a Health Certificate from the Cavalier Breeder to Prove that their Cavalier Breeding Stock is being Health Tested.

    Bet

    WHY OH WHY.

    Do the Cyber Cavalier Bullies make such Snide Remarks about nearly every-thing I mention.

    The latest is about the Mention of the 2nd Edition of the Breed Predispositions to Disease in Dog and Cat.

    This is Published by Wiley and Blackwell , a Global, Scientific, Technical ,Medical Buisness .

    Not by the Blue Cross as was Claimed by those Cavalier Cyber Bullies.

    This is all just because ,on the Front Page of this Edition is a Photo of a B/T Cavalier ,along-side a Photo of the SM Condition.

    Why are those certain few Cavalier Breeders determined not to let the Cavalier Buying Public know about this Serious condition afflicting our Cavaliers.

    They , for me are doing more harm to the Cavalier Breed than has ever happened before to Cavaliers.

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  8. #8
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    Default Why oh why

    Quote Originally Posted by Bet View Post
    WHY OH WHY.

    Do the Cyber Cavalier Bullies make such Snide Remarks about nearly every-thing I mention.

    The latest is about the Mention of the 2nd Edition of the Breed Predispositions to Disease in Dog and Cat.

    This is Published by Wiley and Blackwell , a Global, Scientific, Technical ,Medical Buisness .

    Not by the Blue Cross as was Claimed by those Cavalier Cyber Bullies.

    This is all just because ,on the Front Page of this Edition is a Photo of a B/T Cavalier ,along-side a Photo of the SM Condition.

    Why are those certain few Cavalier Breeders determined not to let the Cavalier Buying Public know about this Serious condition afflicting our Cavaliers.

    They , for me are doing more harm to the Cavalier Breed than has ever happened before to Cavaliers.

    Bet
    WHY OH WHY.


    Sorry Folks , but some of the Cavalier Cyber Bullies are really going to town about me to-day.

    I am not going to bore you with all the Replies I could give, just the one very important one that should never be being forgotten by us Lovers of Cavaliers.

    It was the PDE TV Program that helped the Cavaliers' SM Problem, we we told then that their Brains were too Big for their Skulls, what happened, the Cavalier Buying Public saw the suffering and the Screaming in Pain from the wee Tri Cavalier, this brought home to the Cavalier Buying Public what a Horrible Disease this was ,there was uproar from some of the Cavalier Breeders ,and Margaret was forced out of the CKCS CLUB COMMITTEE for appearing on the Program.

    What has happened since then, the SM Researchers, are disappointed that they have not received the MRI Scans needed for the SM Research in Cavaliers, that they have now turned to another Breed and given them Priority for the EBV Work.

    Finally , WHY OH WHY did those Cavalier Breeders when told as far back as 1983 by Dr P Darke ,the CKCS CLUB's Cardiologist when he had Carried out Surveys at Cavalier Shows ,that the MVD Problem was so Serious and Wide-Spread in the Cavalier Breed .

    Why was this warning not Heeded , if it had been , then probably it would not be being said to-day ,that 50% of Cavaliers aged 5-6 have Heart Murmurs.

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    Bet - I agree with everything you say - These cavalier cyber bullies hurl snidey remarks at you because they know YOU ARE RIGHT, but they cannot dare to face the truth..if these breeders adore there cavaliers and cherish them so much, why on earth do they breed from them WHEN THEY KNOW they are ill..it is something that really confuses me (especially at the age of 16)..

    When I took my little Murphy to the cardiologist and witnessed all the tests that had to be done, I was shocked..as we left the vets in the car I said to myself..It is physically and emotionally painful(for us and cavis) that MOST cavaliers will have to have these tests done just to determine how serious there MVD is .. it is not right...dogs should be "healthy and free from pain,disease and injury"..As the RSPCA Five Freedoms say.

    But are our beautiful best cavaliers FREE from DISESE?
    NO, they are not, this is down to un-ethical breeders, which is, terrible..

    This is something that runs through my mind every day. I wonder IF cavaliers will ever live healthy, pain-free lifes and WHEN will this happen? My idea of a wonderful life is to grow old with cavaliers around me, but will there even be cavaliers when I am older and settling down?? It really saddens me as they are so beautiful and easily my favourite breed, and the best companions ever.
    Something has to be done..Something NEEDS to be done, before its too late...
    Last edited by MurphysMummy; 26th October 2010 at 09:25 PM.
    ..Life wouldn't be complete without a beautiful cavalier at your feet..
    xxxx Mummy to Murphy, aged 8. MVD wont stop my precious boy! xxxx
    28/09/09 Gotcha Day <3

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    Default Why oh why ????

    Quote Originally Posted by MurphysMummy View Post
    Bet - I agree with everything you say - These cavalier cyber bullies hurl snidey remarks at you because they know YOU ARE RIGHT, but they cannot dare to face the truth..if these breeders adore there cavaliers and cherish them so much, why on earth do they breed from them WHEN THEY KNOW they are ill..it is something that really confuses me (especially at the age of 16)..

    When I took my little Murphy to the cardiologist and witnessed all the tests that had to be done, I was shocked..as we left the vets in the car I said to myself..It is physically and emotionally painful(for us and cavis) that MOST cavaliers will have to have these tests done just to determine how serious there MVD is .. it is not right...dogs should be "healthy and free from pain,disease and injury"..As the RSPCA Five Freedoms say.

    But are our beautiful best cavaliers FREE from DISESE?
    NO, they are not, this is down to un-ethical breeders, which is, terrible..

    This is something that runs through my mind every day. I wonder IF cavaliers will ever live healthy, pain-free lifes and WHEN will this happen? My idea of a wonderful life is to grow old with cavaliers around me, but will there even be cavaliers when I am older and settling down?? It really saddens me as they are so beautiful and easily my favourite breed, and the best companions ever.
    Something has to be done..Something NEEDS to be done, before its too late...
    WHY OH WHY ????

    MURPHYSMUMMY,

    Thank You so much for your Post , it's been a rough Fortnight for me with the Battering and Hurtful Remarks made to me by a certain Few Cavalier Breeders.Yes they are Cyber Bullies.

    If I could explain why I have been involved in the Health Problems for years now in our Cavaliers.

    When we lost our Cherished Cavaliers , Sweep,Cindy Lu ,Shari, Ailsa, all from MVD.

    I started to collect Cavalier pedigrees of other Cavaliers who had died from Heart Trouble, I wonder if this just maybe could be the reason for all the Hateful Remarks that I get , that I know so much about the Back-grounds of those Cavaliers who had died from Heart Trouble.

    I collected around 400 Hundred Pedigrees ,I put adverts in Dog Magazines asking for information if their Cavalier had died from Heart Trouble ,to contact me. I sent those Pedigrees to a Couple of Unversities here in Britain and one in Austria.

    This Snow Balled a Bit.

    A good number of Heart Broken Cavalier Owners, like our-selves,wrote to me wanting a Shoulder to Cry On about how they were feeling about the loss of their Beloved Cavalier due to the Scurge of MVD .

    I always wrote back to them, but eventually it got too much for me,my Heart was Breaking when I was reading their sad Letters and answering them ,I had to stop.

    This why I will always be involved in the Health Problems of our Beloved Cavaliers , knowing that there are many Cavalier Owners around who are still being Broken-Hearted because of the Horrible SM Disease now in Cavaliers and the MVD Problem ,which is no better than it was ,as is said by the Experts ,than 18 years ago.

    I will take all the Insults thrown at me , by those certain Few , but will always speak my Mind about how I feel about the Health Problems in our Cavaliers, no matter what new Tactics they try.

    I away for a Coffee now.

    If youve read this, Thanks.

    Bet
    Bet (Hargreaves)

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