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Banning The Breeding of Cavaliers in the Netherlands (NB wrongly said Denmark)

Tania

Tania

Well-known member
I have been told there is an article in the ourdogs paper recently about banning the Breeding of the Cavalier. I have not got the paper but found an article online. These are the statistics within the article.


How do these figures compare to the Cavaliers in the UK


Figures on health problems in the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel: (Netherlands)
  • 95% (CM) of dogs Chiari-like malformation (CM) (a skull too small).
  • 50% have the complete picture of Chiari-like malformation and syringomyelia (CM / SM) with symptoms like chronic pain or itching and / or epilepsy. The disease in humans is seen as one of the most painful that exist (but is fortunately very rare in humans).
  • 40% have heart murmur (100% for over 10 years). 52% die of these heart problems;
  • 20-30% (Patella Luxatie); 20-30% have chronic knee problems (Patellar Luxation);
  • 30% suffer from chronic eye disease;
  • 40% have an ear disease (PSOM), which only occurs in Cavaliers
  • 10 % (at least) has hip dysplasia.






http://translate.google.co.uk/trans...ier&hl=en&sa=X&rlz=1G1SVEA_ENUK419&prmd=ivnso
 
i have never heard of the cavalier breed being about to be banned in Denmark.
the article, i think, mentions the netherlands, which is Holland.:confused:

but the cavalier breed in Denmark is not particularily healthy.
until a few years ago the average life time of a cavalier was 7-8 years. which is not much.....

now there is a heart program, and an sm program on the way.
everybody can have their cavalier's heart ultrasound scanned (including colour Doppler) for free, and there are breeding restictions for dogs with heart problems.

i am under the impression that serious measures are being taken to highten the standard of health in the cav. breed in Denmark.
 
Banning the breeding of cavaliers in denmark

renate said:
i have never heard of the cavalier breed being about to be banned in Denmark.
the article, i think, mentions the netherlands, which is Holland.:confused:

but the cavalier breed in Denmark is not particularily healthy.
until a few years ago the average life time of a cavalier was 7-8 years. which is not much.....

now there is a heart program, and an sm program on the way.
everybody can have their cavalier's heart ultrasound scanned (including colour Doppler) for free, and there are breeding restictions for dogs with heart problems.

i am under the impression that serious measures are being taken to highten the standard of health in the cav. breed in Denmark.
Click to expand...

BANNING THE BREEDING OF CAVALIERS IN DENMARK

Tania,

Here are some British Figures to compare with those in Danish Cavaliers.

For CM the British Cavaliers must be about the same for CM,what could be more worrying though is that of the 85 Whelps Researched Recently ,all had CM.

Is this an indication of how wide-spread the CM Problem is in our British Cavaliers?

What a dreadful thought

The 50% of CM/SM seems to be about the same ,according to the Researchers.

Our Cavaliers are said by the MVD Researchers are 50% with Heart Murmurs at 5-6 years of Age ,that is higher ,and this is no better than it was 18 years ago.

100% having Heart Murmurs at 10 is about the same ,

I don't know any of the Figures for other Health Problems in our British Cavaliers.

Bet
 
Would like to know if it is just cavaliers? What about the other pure breed dogs? More information but feel this is not what research should be used to do. Ban the breed, why not focus on how to use the data? What about changing standard?

I think education and stricter breeding protocols, however is the netherlands where they already had something in place?

I am confused b/c when I searched unhealthy dog breeds the pet insurance study in 2008 was all I found and cavaliers were not on there. Does anyone have more research and comparision to other breeds?

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Wow, that's amazing, and sad... I admire Denmark for taking a stand in the situation. I hope it improves things for cavalier owners there, twould be a pity if they couldn't own them anymore.
 
There are other dogbreeds who have very serious problems. Why not ban all of them then? At least Denmark acknowledges the problem. Although banning is not a solution.
 
Blondiemonster said:
There are other dogbreeds who have very serious problems. Why not ban all of them then? At least Denmark acknowledges the problem. Although banning is not a solution.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Knowledge and information on health is vital but what one does with it, is even more important. Denmark has a great approach :)

We have research and tools but a ban is something I don't understand. Did they ban German shepherds?


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anniemac said:
What about changing standard?
Click to expand...

This is what we have and are still fighting for!

There is a new scheme being introduced where all data will be sucked out of Veterinary practices into a central information centre. This will then give accurate information regarding all breeds.

I agree there are a lot of breeds in trouble. Do you not think the Cavalier endure some of the worst and most devastating painful conditions? I adore Cavaliers but part of me wishes they would stop breeding them!

Thank you Bet for the information.
 
What about crossing with other breeds to help eliminate some of the problems.

I think Pedigrees Exposed had a segment on a man who highly reduced or eliminated the uric acid problem in dalmatians by crossbreeding other dogs into the line. It was a highly dilute cross, meaning the dogs were really still dalmations - but very effective at solving the issue at hand.

We keep breeding for certain physical characteristics that are supposed to make dogs better at their jobs - but grossly overshoot the mark leading only to tragic consequences. Ideally, dogs best suited to their jobs would be bred - ie a border collie that is excellent at herding or a cavalier who has nursing home certification. Healthy, happy dogs. Not dogs trying to conform to an ideal that no longer makes sense!
 
Tania said:
This is what we have and are still fighting for!

There is a new scheme being introduced where all data will be sucked out of Veterinary practices into a central information centre. This will then give accurate information regarding all breeds.

I agree there are a lot of breeds in trouble. Do you not think the Cavalier endure some of the worst and most devastating painful conditions? I adore Cavaliers but part of me wishes they would stop breeding them!

Thank you Bet for the information.
Click to expand...

No one wants to go through this. That question is a no win answer. Yes, but so do others. Breeding not the breed, education but banning, I don't think I will comment.

Please clarify that the research on cavaliers for SM is not connected in any way to this scheme. If I read it as one thing others may.




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Tania,

I only have ella and don't know other breeds but I think if they ban one why not others like German shepherds, pugs, griffons

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Tania said:
I agree there are a lot of breeds in trouble. Do you not think the Cavalier endure some of the worst and most devastating painful conditions? I adore Cavaliers but part of me wishes they would stop breeding them!
Click to expand...

:xctly:
 
Banning the breeding of cavaliers in denmark

Jane P said:
:xctly:
Click to expand...


BANNING THE BREEDING OF CAVALIERS IN DENMARK.


Could I add this information to this Thread,the Chairman of the CAVALIER HEALTH LIASON COMMITTEE,is the same Person a Cavalier Breeder, who spent Two years protesting to every Layer of the BBC'S COMPLAINTS and APPEALS Process until it reached the Corporation's Govering Body ,only to see it Overturned once again.

This was Reported in DOG WORLD at the beginning of May 2010.

One of his complaints was that that when the Pedigree Dogs Exposed TV Film was shown ,it made it appear that Cavaliers' had Ten Size Brains in Size Six Skulls ,this was a Reference to SM.

We now know the Truth about this , it has been recently stated that CM is Chacterized with Brains too Big and Skulls too Small . CM and SM are involved to-gether I believe.

His other complaints were that 30% of Cavaliers could be affected by SM had no Proof , those figures have now shown to be Higher.

There were other Complaints, this from a Person who is the Chairman of the Cavalier Health Liason Committee. !!!!

We now have a Person who is a Health Represenative for the Cavalier Club who will not reveal the details of the MRI Scans of her Cavaliers , because they are for her information only, the other Health Representative does not believe that 50% have a Heart Murmur at 5-6 years of ,the reason being thay she has not seen this Figure in her Cavaliers.

These are the Folk who are trying to save the Cavalier Breed from Distinction .

With the Cavaliers' Health Figures given in this Thread ,is it not rediculous that People with those Views are involved with the Health Problems in the Cavalier Breed,at least Maggie Ford was trying to get their Health Problems improved ,and look what happened to her.

Bet
 
Banning the breeding of cavaliers in denmark

sins said:
The Ourdogs article refers to Dutch cavalier breeding.
http://www.cavaliers.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?4909-Dutch-Cavaliers&p=38171#post38171
The full thread can be viewed on the cavalierchat forum.

Sins
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BANNING THE BREEDING OF CAVALIERS IN DENMARK.

Whether Denmark or Holland the Cavaliers have to be Banned from being Bred from, to us here in Britain it is who is the Chair-man of the CAVALIER HEALTH LIASON COMMITTEE ,I would think will be giving the most concern to those trying to improve the Cavaliers' SM and MVD Health Problems, also the Two Other Health Repersentatives for the UK CKCS CLUB ,who have publicly expressed their Views about those Two Particular Cavalier Health Problems.

How can they be giving Honest Opinions about SM and MVD.

Bet
 
Cavaliers do NOT have to be banned from being bred from Bet.
If you read the article,it's an allegation that an animal rights group have demanded that cavaliers are not bred from in the short term or they'll threaten to go to court to TRY to obtain a ban.
It seems a bit silly that a country would ban breeding of cavaliers when it's perfectly legal to breed them elsewhere in Europe and import them freely.
Seems it might just be an organisation looking for a bit of publicity.
It takes a lot of work and money to launch a legal case like that and build a copperfast argument.
It seems daft to support a bunch of wasters like that when energy is better invested in supporting decent breeders who are trying to actually achieve something with cavalier health through skill,hard work and committed testing of their stock.
Sins
 
sins said:
energy is better invested in supporting decent breeders who are trying to actually achieve something with cavalier health through skill,hard work and committed testing of their stock.
Sins
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. (y)

As an 'outsider' I do wish more time and energy were devoted to breeding healthy animals and health issues per se by clubs and less resources wasted on 'politics'. I wholeheartedly support anyone devoted to "breeding out" health problems in any breed, an exercise which is extremely costly to the committed.

The extinction of the CKCS as a breed is not something I'd like to see; they are a wonderful breed and temperamentally (for the most part) streets ahead of some breeds.
 
sins said:
The Ourdogs article refers to Dutch cavalier breeding.
http://www.cavaliers.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?4909-Dutch-Cavaliers&p=38171#post38171
The full thread can be viewed on the cavalierchat forum.

Sins
Click to expand...

Thanks, Sins. That newspaper article shows, I think, that this is a long-shot effort by this group. I certainly hope so. It looks like the group thinks it can pick off some "low-hanging fruit" to make a point and get some publicity from such an extreme position.

There is absolutely no reason to totally stop breeding cavaliers. The whole point of the advocates of health testing and following breeding protocols is to breed away from these genetic disorders. Following the protocols necessarily calls for breeding fewer litters by fewer sires and dams, but don't blame the health advocates for what some whacko group does in the Netherlands.

If any cavalier fanciers are to blame, it is the many cavalier breeders who have ignored the pleas to health test and follow the protocols. What more evidence do you people (you blockheaded breeders) need to convince yourselves that this is not about you and precious breeding programs? You clearly are a major cause of this stunt in the Netherlands. Look in the mirror; you are the problem.
 
Fifer said:
Couldn't agree more. (y)

As an 'outsider' I do wish more time and energy were devoted to breeding healthy animals and health issues per se by clubs and less resources wasted on 'politics'. I wholeheartedly support anyone devoted to "breeding out" health problems in any breed, an exercise which is extremely costly to the committed.

The extinction of the CKCS as a breed is not something I'd like to see; they are a wonderful breed and temperamentally (for the most part) streets ahead of some breeds.
Click to expand...

Agree and would like to see action like what they are doing in denmark, free health testing etc.

However, hearts are an issue that there is a protocol. I saw on 2/7/11 trupanion published a list of breeds with most heart issues and ckcs were #4.

But it is not just breeders, pet buyers can't ignore health and buy a puppy from a breeder that is not following the mvd protocol.




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Banning the breeding of cavaliers in denmark

RodRussell said:
Thanks, Sins. That newspaper article shows, I think, that this is a long-shot effort by this group. I certainly hope so. It looks like the group thinks it can pick off some "low-hanging fruit" to make a point and get some publicity from such an extreme position.

There is absolutely no reason to totally stop breeding cavaliers. The whole point of the advocates of health testing and following breeding protocols is to breed away from these genetic disorders. Following the protocols necessarily calls for breeding fewer litters by fewer sires and dams, but don't blame the health advocates for what some whacko group does in the Netherlands.

If any cavalier fanciers are to blame, it is the many cavalier breeders who have ignored the pleas to health test and follow the protocols. What more evidence do you people (you blockheaded breeders) need to convince yourselves that this is not about you and precious breeding programs? You clearly are a major cause of this stunt in the Netherlands. Look in the mirror; you are the problem.
Click to expand...

BANNING THE BREEDING OF CAVALIERS IN DENMARK


It does not alter the Fact that the Cavaliers are in a worse plight for SM and MVD that the figures that Tania quoted.

Even worse ,because the 85 Whelps Researched for the Foetal Research, all had CM.

Could this now mean that just about every Cavalier has CM here in Britain.

What a Frightening Thought.

Bet
 
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