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Sm aggrevation after grooming?

Hoping for an update on Blondie.

It's so hard, there are so many things that can cause issues for our dogs. And since they can't talk, it just makes it that much harder.

I know that I had a friend whose dog was very sensitive to traditional treatment to fleas and ticks.

Frontline is the flea and tick one right? Or does it also cover heartworm? I'd stick with just heartworm pills and not deal with the fleas and tick with an all encompassing med. There are dogs that react to the vaccines that are combo's.

Then I'd try to find natural alternatives for the fleas and ticks. Hoping she is doing better poor little sweetie!
 
update

Blondie is doing better than on day 1 but she is still not her same old self.
I cannot go for walks with her, she get's excited and than the "spasms" start again.
This is her last day of prednisone too, and I'm not sure if the pred helps or if it's just the natural process. Its also nasty weather and it's been for days (grey, humid and always seems like its gonna thunder, so the worst for Neuro problems)
Btw, My friends mom just told me her malthese has a NASTY neurological reaction to frontline that took months to get better. So it's not uncommon at all and I will NEVER touch it ever again.
Now here is the kicker: a massive, fat tick rolled of her body today. The groomers must 've missed it. But the kicker is that frontline doesn't even work.
She must've had it this whole time. (I front lined her because I found a tick on her after a walk in the woods) :huh::huh:
 
Blondiemonster said:
Blondie is doing better than on day 1 but she is still not her same old self.
I cannot go for walks with her, she get's excited and than the "spasms" start again.
This is her last day of prednisone too, and I'm not sure if the pred helps or if it's just the natural process. Its also nasty weather and it's been for days (grey, humid and always seems like its gonna thunder, so the worst for Neuro problems)
Btw, My friends mom just told me her malthese has a NASTY neurological reaction to frontline that took months to get better. So it's not uncommon at all and I will NEVER touch it ever again.
Now here is the kicker: a massive, fat tick rolled of her body today. The groomers must 've missed it. But the kicker is that frontline doesn't even work.
She must've had it this whole time. (I front lined her because I found a tick on her after a walk in the woods) :huh::huh:
Click to expand...

Are you kidding me!! Poor blondie. Please keep us updated. Did you mention this to dr. West? I am on the road trying to catch up. I read what you and karlin wrote about frontline. Was that before or after you talked to dr. West? I would mention this to him again. Like I hate to say it like this, but I hope it has more to do with the weather on top of everything else instead of taking months to get over like your moms friend.

I remember praying for good weather because it really does have a relation to sm dogs like you said. Oh no, I'm sorry.

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Prednisone usually takes at least half a day to start working and persists for 24-36 hours after the last dose generally. I would call Dr West to explain what is happening. And again: I'd just go to a vet and talk about a possible antidote if this is a neurological reaction to Frontline. If this were an SM flare-up, I think you'd probably expect it to have settled by now with prednisone; it is pretty powerful on that type of pain. Hard to know if improvement you have seen is due to preds or a Frontline problem going away of its own accord.

Because use of these flea/tick meds are now widespread many insects are getting resistance to them (quite a few have posted on various dog lists about various products no longer working on fleas. But if a tick is still attached it doesn't actually mean Frontline wasn't working -- it can take a couple of days for them to detach and fall off). Often you need to switch and try a different product using a different insecticide if resistance has developed. But in your shoes, I would not use any further chemical products on Blondie as there looks like there could be a link between symptoms and Frontline side effects :(.

It is really important to understand that the vast majority of dogs have no problems with this medication. There will always be rare cases of animals that do -- just like there will always be people who have one or some of the long lists of potential side effects listed for medications. Frontline would be very commonly used by people here and this is the first possible reaction I have heard of in over 6 years of the board being in existence -- so if this is a side effect, it is very rare.

That said as a general point I don't really like using flea products very often because owners are dosing their dogs with quite strong chemicals that get absorbed into their systems. But we do not have a bad flea problem in our cool climate and no heartworm and few ticks.
 
I agree with you on the prednisone Karlin. It should've worked by now and completely eliminated the symptoms, if they are exaggerated SM symptoms brought on by frontline or not. Since,
Last year the exact same thing happened after frontlining her, I do have some sort of reference:
After a week of no improvement she went under full anesthesia for an MRI because I was suspecting SM. When she came out of anesthesia the symptoms where completely gone. Strange huh?
Maybe the very intense form of "muscle relaxer/valium" under the form of general anesthesia stopped the symptoms.
Anyhow, since they DID go way last year, I am hopeful that it will go away now.
Karlin and Anne, last year I got laughed at by the regular vet with my frontline story.
Dr. Marino also didn't take it very seriously.
Dr. West his team blaimed it on her SM completely and also wont listen to my frontline story, since he didn't want to give muscle relaxers and his assistant vet was pretty condecending to me on the phone each time I brought up "frontline'.
I feel like I am on my own here. The only thing I can try is a brand new vet and not say anything about SM. I feel like "that" mom with her sick child going from doc to doc and nobody will listen. :)
 
I really wish you could find a vet you liked in the area. Karlin did mention that it probably is not very common so I can sort of see why a vet might not put it together the first time. I hated when my vet looked at me like I was crazy describing things with ella. Rod one time gave me advice about vets, that its important if they want to listen and help. You know a general vet might not know all there is about sm or may have never had a dog/cat react to frontline, but if you took what you googled and karlin quoted, I would want one to show concern and help sort this out. Just my opinion.

You have every right to be a concerned mom. That's a good thing. Its also good you remembered what happened last time she had an episode and wrote down that information to put pieces together. I know you have been frustrated with the PSOM and everything else, but I think I would definately be concerned and maybe even call frontline. It might not be tied to it (sounds like maybe it is) but it wouldn't hurt to see what others have had reactions.





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It has to be tied to it because its to coincedental. Im gonna wait it out a few days and hope it subsides like it did last time...
 
Anne has a good point. I'd google the Frontline reactions you got. Perhaps if you contacted a holistic Vet, one that could help you with something more natural that may help in keeping the ticks and fleas off Blondie.

And yes, Karlin is right, I am sure it's rare, but it's just a shame that it happened to Blondie with all her other issues.

Hugs,
 
OMG just catching up. Poor Blondie, how is she today? I am sorry the doctors aren't listening. You said a tick rolled off of her, could she have lyme disease? My brother's dog just came down with it and they live in NY too.
Jack also gets an exacerbation of symptoms for a few days after using Frontline so now I only do it during the hot humid months. However now I am thinking not to do it at all.

Please do update on Blondie.
 
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I'm glad to inform you Blondie is much better today. Kind of the same as last year.
One week of tremors. Very, very strange. But I am so happy she is doing better I am just grateful and not questioning it!!!!!:D:D:D:*nana::*nana: wow irene, i cannot believe you notice it in jack too so frontline is really toxic especially in dogs with an impaired neurological system like ours. Im a little pissed that dr west wouldnt listen though i think hes a great doc. But hey, like karlin said ita supposed to be so rare. I am never touching that stuff again im going the holistic route from now on. What r the symptoms of lyme? I think it seemed to come on too fast after the tick bite isnt their an incubation time? I really think it was a nasty neuro reaction to frontlined combined with the already existing sm...
 
It's easier

Blondiemonster said:
I brought Blondie to the groomers because my bf insisted (shedding..).
She came back and hours later has clearly aggrevated symptoms.
As a matter of fact, I've never seen quiet like this. She's rubbing her head,
lies on the floor and doesn't wanna move and seems in discomfort. She seems mad at her hindlegs! Everytime she wants to play or do something it seems like they "twitch" and then she bites at them and gets really really mad...
This all happened right around when the gabapentin 8 hour mark was coming up, and I gave her the gabapentin just a half an hour ago and gave her a teeny chunk of tramadol left from he spaying surgery. We are already seeing the neuro once every 3 months , and obviously if this doesn't subside I will be going in sooner but,
is this common after grooming? she seems to be seriously irritated by something on her back leg as well... Is it possible they aggrevated the nerve endings somehow? I don't know.. Just guessing. I knew this groomer thing was a bad idea. Darn. Thanks for any advice.. p.s I should add this seems to be a similar episode like last year, which i what led me to find out about the SM... LAt yearm It lasted a few days after which we got her MRI'd and they did a myringotomy and the symptoms subsided. It was a very acute episode. It seems to be the same thing now and I'm really frustrated...
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Just to groom her yourself. I just bought a hair trimmer and I cut Luka's and Atlas's hair myself. I also learned to express their anal gland and brush their teeth every 2 days and scrape the hard plaque once a month or so.

Luka has never had any episodes after I have groomed him, other than giving me a dirty look.
 
Yeay so happy Blondie is feeling better! Those little fur balls really make us worry!

In regards to your question on lyme disease. I just found this info on the web:
http://www.petmd.com/dog/conditions/infectious-parasitic/c_dg_lyme_disease
My brother's dog started limping and refused to go down steps so when they took her to the vet they found a tick on her and ran blood tests. She was treated and is doing great. Not sure what the incubation period is either.

Sorry Dr. W was so reluctant to listen to you. He definitely has his opinions :)

However most important is Blondie is back to her old self:*nana:
 
YAY!!! I'm very happy to read this! :) Great, GREAT news!!!
Woooooooooooo-hooooooooooooooo!!! Go, Blondie, GO! :rah:
 
With my SM girl, I always give her Tramadol about an hour before I bathe her. If I don't, she has a really hard time after her bath. She doesn't get the Tramadol on a regular basis-- just as needed.
 
Actually I never thought of Lyme disease -- that may be worth testing for to be safe. Usually the tick needs to be on for at least 48 hours but if you had one tick you could have had others that went unnoticed. Not sure how much later symptoms would start. It might be worth mentioning to your vet. But if you had a bad reaction of similar nature at the last time you used Frontline I'd think that would be the likely connection.
 
OMG! Just reading this thread!

When I ended up at the vet with Holly and they presume back troubles... It was the day after I put frontline plus on her.

It was unlike any "SM" flare I have ever seen in any of them. But she was also yelping. I remember thinking it was a little strange that it happened right after the frontline and that was in the back of my head the whole time. She just acted "off", was very uncomfrotable and in serious pain. Yelping when touched. She was a little unsteady on her feet and had trembling back legs. I had just never heard of Frontline causing such issues. Now I know I wasn't crazy! My vet said the leg trembling was from being in pain.

Funny thing is I felt the need to switch back to Advantage. I just had a "feeling" about the frontline and her symptoms.

Sure glad I did! Holly has not had another episode like that since....

Vet sent her home with muscle relaxers and she recovered quickly.... I actually didn't follow the 2 weeks complete kennel rest because she recovered so quickly.
 
Reptigirl said:
OMG! Just reading this thread!

When I ended up at the vet with Holly and they presume back troubles... It was the day after I put frontline plus on her.

It was unlike any "SM" flare I have ever seen in any of them. But she was also yelping. I remember thinking it was a little strange that it happened right after the frontline and that was in the back of my head the whole time. She just acted "off", was very uncomfrotable and in serious pain. Yelping when touched. She was a little unsteady on her feet and had trembling back legs. I had just never heard of Frontline causing such issues. Now I know I wasn't crazy! My vet said the leg trembling was from being in pain.

Funny thing is I felt the need to switch back to Advantage. I just had a "feeling" about the frontline and her symptoms.

Sure glad I did! Holly has not had another episode like that since....

Vet sent her home with muscle relaxers and she recovered quickly.... I actually didn't follow the 2 weeks complete kennel rest because she recovered so quickly.
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That's just crazy. It seems to be not very uncommon in dogs with SM. (you, me and Irene. lol that sounds funny. Isn't that a movie title?) And that's only on this board.. I'm so glad you did get the muscle relaxers. That's what i asked for but it wasn't given to me because everybody just thinks "Poor girl with her serious SM, the mother trying to blame it on frontline" I don't even think the prednisone helped, though surely that's what will get the credit for her being better.
The symptoms were also also like NOTHING i've ever seen except for when frontlining.

@ KArlin: we ended finding about 10 ticks on her believe it or not but caught most of them right coming from the woods. There maybe 2 deer ticks. There were 2 that stayed on there for 48 hours but not sure if they were deerticks since they were so full off blood i couldnt say
 
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