Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 36

Thread: Study of SM in 555 asymptomatic CKCS: 70% affected by age 6

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Hatfield, Herts, UK
    Posts
    2,753
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    Cavaliers are in even more need of helpful information being forthcoming.
    It is known that following both sets of breeding guidelines would reduce SM and MVD.
    50% of KC registered cavaliers, from club members and non-club members alike, have at least one parent that is under 2.5 years of age.

    It is not more helpful information that is needed, there is plenty of that being ignored already. What is really needed is breeders that care more for their cavaliers than their own interests.
    Margaret C

    Cavaliers......Faith, The Ginger Tank and Woody.
    Japanese Chins.... Dandy, Benny, Bridgette and Hana.
    Remembered with love......... Tommy Tuppence and Fonzi

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    Originally Posted by Davecav But would it not have been really productive to make breeders aware of the two bitches that were thought to be the fore-runners for this condition? ? so that breeders could begin to breed away from these, as much as possible?

    Answer
    Who can say if breeders would have changed their breeding programmes with that knowledge.
    As some of the most influential breeders continued to use a known MRI confirmed SM affected dog because he produced lovely puppies, I rather doubt if long dead ancestors would have been seen to have any significance.
    Margaret


    Well it's a shame if that's the case; but there must have been some health conscious breeders who wanted to breed away from the condition in 2003 when you wrote the leaflet. It appears to be a missed opportunity that this information wasn't disclosed at the time.

    Maybe as you say, no-one would have cared to bother with it, but now nearly 10 years later Cavaliers are in even more need of helpful information being forthcoming.

    .

    Did anyone know the names of these bitches? (well someone must have!)
    Davecav

    Having this information is totally useless for two reasons. There are no pedigrees that I am aware of post 1980's that do not contain these two bitches, and secondly, they themselves had ancestors who carried the genes , who had multiple offspring that went in several directions, and their genes are widely distributed in the gene .pool. These two bitches were used for illustration purposes on Claire's thesis.

    Mollycavi

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    775
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    Did anyone know the names of these bitches? (well someone must have!)
    I believe that many long-time breeders did know the names. I say that because a close friend of mine in the US who was a long-time breeder phoned me to discuss this at the time because one of these bitches was an ancestor of one of her foundation dogs. She was quite concerned, and we talked for a long time about the emerging information about SM.

    Pat
    Pat B
    Atlanta, GA

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    775
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mollycavi View Post
    Davecav

    Having this information is totally useless for two reasons. There are no pedigrees that I am aware of post 1980's that do not contain these two bitches, and secondly, they themselves had ancestors who carried the genes , who had multiple offspring that went in several directions, and their genes are widely distributed in the gene .pool. These two bitches were used for illustration purposes on Claire's thesis.

    Mollycavi
    From my general understanding, I believe this is correct. It is a lot more complex than just "avoiding" these two bitches.

    Pat
    Pat B
    Atlanta, GA

  5. #25
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Orlando, Florida USA
    Posts
    1,246
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by margaret c View Post
    ...

    It is not more helpful information that is needed, there is plenty of that being ignored already. What is really needed is breeders that care more for their cavaliers than their own interests.

    ...


    bingo!
    Rod Russell

  6. #26
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    490
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    sad...the truth is still many breeders continue to breed well before any health screening can take place. I have asked a few breeders about this and all say they know their lines are free from these problems. I wonder why would a male dog need bred before the age of 1 year and a female at age 15 months? I am not talking puppymills, this is show breeders that should know better.
    I have to agree that publishing names would make no difference to some breeders...as they claim to know what they are doing.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,592
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    15

    Default Study of sm in 555 asympatomatic ckcs: 70% affected by age 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    Originally Posted by Davecav But would it not have been really productive to make breeders aware of the two bitches that were thought to be the fore-runners for this condition? ? so that breeders could begin to breed away from these, as much as possible?

    Answer
    Who can say if breeders would have changed their breeding programmes with that knowledge.
    As some of the most influential breeders continued to use a known MRI confirmed SM affected dog because he produced lovely puppies, I rather doubt if long dead ancestors would have been seen to have any significance.
    Margaret


    Well it's a shame if that's the case; but there must have been some health conscious breeders who wanted to breed away from the condition in 2003 when you wrote the leaflet. It appears to be a missed opportunity that this information wasn't disclosed at the time.

    Maybe as you say, no-one would have cared to bother with it, but now nearly 10 years later Cavaliers are in even more need of helpful information being forthcoming.










    .

    Did anyone know the names of these bitches? (well someone must have!)

    STUDY OF SM IN 555 ASYMAPATOMATIC CKCS :70% AFFECTED BY AGE 6.

    Davecav ,

    What is the use , please ,please tell me if you are given the names of those Two Cavalier Bitches ,what good does that do now.

    The Information is in the Figures 70% of Cavaliers have SM at 6.

    Around 90% have CM where the Condition is Chacterized with Brains too Big for the Skulls, this stops the CEREBRO SPINAL FLUID FLOWING and causes Syrinxes to Form ,then SM.

    The most Disasterous News for The Cavalier Breed was when in the FOETAL TISSUE RESEARCH it was found that 85 of the Whelps ALL ,YES ALL the WHELPS had CM.

    The CM and SM Problem is every-where in the Cavalier Breed ,if you are given those Bitches names what are you going to with the Information.

    I would sure be interested to know.

    Bet
    Bet (Hargreaves)

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    176
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    BetMollycavi has already answered my query succinctly, and fully explained why this didn't happen. (thank you Molly)However, If you really bother to read my post properly instead of jumping constantly to conclusions and repeating the same boring ld information ad-infinitum whatever the question, ...........what I asked was: Would it not have been useful to give breeders the information - All those years ago!!!!Just to make it perfectly clear once more . MY QUESTION HAS NOW BEEN ANSWERED TO MY COMPLETE SATISFACTION. At no point was I asking for the names of the bitches to be made public now!!!

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    176
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    BetMollycavi has already answered my query succinctly, and fully explained why this didn't happen. (thank you Molly).......However, If you really bother to read my post properly instead of jumping constantly to conclusions and repeating the same boring information ad-infinitum whatever the question, ...........what I asked was: Would it not have been useful to give breeders the information - All those years ago!!!!Just to make it perfectly clear once more . ........ MY QUESTION HAS NOW BEEN ANSWERED TO MY COMPLETE SATISFACTION. At no point was I asking for the names of the bitches to be made public now!!!
    I'm sorry my reply is set out in such a poor format. For some reason; though I have written my reply in paragraphs, etc, it has lumped everything together and the system won't let me edit it!

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    1,592
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    15

    Default Study of sm in 555 asympatomaticckcs:70% affected by age 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Davecav View Post
    BetMollycavi has already answered my query succinctly, and fully explained why this didn't happen. (thank you Molly)However, If you really bother to read my post properly instead of jumping constantly to conclusions and repeating the same boring ld information ad-infinitum whatever the question, ...........what I asked was: Would it not have been useful to give breeders the information - All those years ago!!!!Just to make it perfectly clear once more . MY QUESTION HAS NOW BEEN ANSWERED TO MY COMPLETE SATISFACTION. At no point was I asking for the names of the bitches to be made public now!!!

    STUDY OF SM IN 555 ASYMPATOMATIC CKCS : 70 % AFFECTED BY AGE 6

    Davecav.

    It's great that you now realize why the names of those Two Cavaliers could not have been Divulged.

    When I was helping at the beginning with the SM Cavalier Pedigree Research I even had PM's from Cavalier Breeders world wanting to know the Names of the Two Cavaliers from the 1950's .



    Bet
    Last edited by Nicki; 23rd June 2011 at 03:38 PM. Reason: edited to remove derogatory attack
    Bet (Hargreaves)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •