personal attacks, namecalling, and disparagement
This is a discussion brought about by the person in question herself acknowledging to people that she had done something she herself confesses was appalling. There is no personal attack, namecalling or disparagement -- there is criticism of
actions she has admitted were wrong, that came on the heels of asking many here to give advice and support. There is bafflement that there is also defense of such actions at the same time. It is the action which has been bemoaned -- but that action is also inseparably tied to the person who took those actions. Every post here that is critical, has been critical of the decision and actions. There really is no other way to talk about them. And honest feedback was asked for.
Anyone who has been a member here for any length of time knows I allow a lot of leeway on discussion amongst members and that if I see them, I do cut off discussions which call people names and make personal attacks etc. I do not consider this discussion at any point to be one that fits that category, even if it is uncomfortable and the pain many here feel at the choice made by the original poster is obvious -- a lot of us feel let down because the decision lets down the breed and everything so many here work hard for, but more specifically, goes directly against all the original poster as recently as a few days ago said were her strongest values and the basis of all decisions she would make in getting a puppy. The discussion does not say 'you are horrible' but says 'you made a decision which is horrible for the following reasons, and many of us cannot understand it, especially due to personal experience with what these cavalier illnesses mean'.
The original poster says we cannot know her and cannot understand her reasons, yet we have many long threads full of detail from the poster explaining her thoughts, reasons, intent and then, decision to wait to get a cavalier until she could support a good breeder and see if some of the health research would be more advanced. All we can go on is the detail that was supplied from the person herself and then was utterly reversed in a final decision she herself knows was wrong. The decision was hers at all times and we were given the option to respond to it in a thread tellingly entitled 'Not the greatest news.'
Past posts from Nela:
In reply to Anne being disturbed at a friend saying to buy a cheaper dog and just get insurance in case things go wrong:
Oh dear... Buying cheap to cover with health insurance? That is insane. You should be buying to ensure no puppy suffers under your care (prevent it as much as possible at least), point finale. If money is such a big issue, maybe that person shouldn't get one. :bang:
I saw puppies for 450 here. The ad said that the parents are tested, the pups are vaccinated and dewormed. There was no mention of registration or not, they aren't microchipped, price is lower than I would expect but we contacted the breeder to find out more, just in case. However, I highly doubt this is a breeder that can produce documents showing that the parents have been scanned etc. I also doubt that they will have a pedigree and be registered. My boyfriend doesn't want to spend too much, but he does agree that the puppy needs to be healthy.
In my opinion, I would rather support the breed by buying from a good breeder and preventing a puppy from suffering and encountering health issues as much as possible. I'd rather pay a bit more now and get a healthy, happy puppy, than pay less and end up with a miserable puppy and expensive vet bills.
Would people who carried serious illnesses reproduce and have children, knowingly passing this on to the child, just because you can take a child to the hospital? I mean really...
I sure your friend doesn't get one.
On waiting to get a cavalier:
Meanwhile, there they were telling me how much they love their dogs and the breed. They even went as far as telling me how they would put their dog to sleep if one were to get ill with syringomyelia because they could not bear to watch a dog suffer. I sat there, wanting to smack them, wanting to yell at them, wanting to curse...
It was absolutely heart-breaking. I think I would prefer to see some dim-wit breeder that knows nothing and breeds for the heck of it than sit there and listen to someone who clearly knows what they should and actually choose to do what they tried to do. Hard as it was to leave those puppies there, I knew that 'saving' one would only encourage things to continue and risk us suffering a major heartache and financial loss and ruin our first experience with a dog.
On the other hand, this visit was very helpful. We know we did the right thing, and to me, that means we are ready for dog ownership. It also gave me contact with the breed, allowing me to see how they are in person. Despite the dumb humans, the dogs were truly wonderful. It also showed me that everything I told Jeff about the importance of a proper breeder was heard and absorbed. He looked for faults just as much as I did and realized that maybe we needed to start looking differently. (I have the list of breeders Margaret gave me and of course we will try those out - though I have one breeder in mind - she is top of the line here from what I hear) It showed me that even though might not really really have wanted a puppy, he is onboard now and we will move forward in the right direction.
It was hard, but I knew exactly what to expect and what to watch out for because of you guys. I know that we will either do this the right way or no way at all. I am committed to my family members and their well-being.
This has been a very good learning experience. All I can say is THANK THE BUNNEHS I RESEARCHED FIRST!!! In this day and age, with the ease of access to information, there's just no excuse for not researching beforehand! I am so glad I have found you guys. You have been invaluable already!
Thank you so very much.
I think at this time, I will hold off and wait for things to clear up with the breed before jumping in. Perhaps, in a few years, a test will have been developped and then we will be able to purchase dogs which will be guaranteed free of these illnesses.
Thank you everyone for your help. After much discussion, we have decided that it might be wise to wait. I wish you all the best with your cavaliers!
After all that, and the eventual outcome, of course people are going to be disturbed by the decision to buy a puppy from someone who fails to scan (which is available for as little as £60 per dog to Dutch breeders). It is hard not to comment on the situation without pointing out that all of the above seemed to be important, then suddenly, was not important at all when it came to getting a puppy right away for less cost that can after all just be insured for health problems.
Personally I consider continuing to argue and fight for the breed's health and future and for the critical need to support health focused breeders to be far more important that people feeling upset at an honest discussion about why buying a puppy in this way totally fails the breed, the individual puppy, the good breeders out there, and every person who gave support on this board (and I would suggest -- failed the puppy buyer herself, too, which I think she knows). If that stance upsets people there are many other places where I can promise, health issues will almost never be touched upon and the word syringomyelia will almost never be mentioned.