• If you're a past member of the board, but can't recall your password any more, you don't need to set up a new account (unless you wish to). As long as you recall your old login name, you can log in with that user name then select 'forgot password' and the board will email you at your registration email, to let you reset your password.

Severe Pancreatitis ?

mommytoClaire said:
And I agree with the comment on keeping her on a low fat diet. I eventually was able to put him on a Senior food after his pancreas healed. It's a slow process, and we also kept him away from cooking smells for a while, as we found for him, smells at times could trigger an attack. Also, for a long time I had him on home cooked meals, chicken breast, rice, etc.
Click to expand...

All of this is correct. The "serious" regime for pancreatitis includes not even cooking in the house or eating in front of the dog. A friend used to eat a cold sandwich in the garage or go out for fast food and eat it in the car. There are good home prepared diets - Strombeck's website and nutritiondata.com can be very helpful. As I recall, you want fat content to be less than 10% and you can find commercial foods that will suffice. My personal prejudice is that I am very anti-Hills products. There are better alternatives but the vets will push Hills. If I had a dog with pancreatitis I'd probably home cook until things were very stable and move to a high quality commercial diet with fat lower than 10%.

More difficult with a toddler in the house and other pets as it will be harder to make sure there are no foods she could get other than what you choose to feed her.

Pat
 
So pleased that Holly is doing a bit better.


I made up my own version of Hills ID - the recipe came from a booklet they produced some years ago which contained home made versions of their diets. I found this very effective at clearing up diarrhoea episodes [both for Pancreatitis and Exocrine Pancreatic insufficiency]

Measurements are USA cup measures but I've added my conversions!

Recipe 1 Highly Digestible diet for Dogs - cottage cheese and egg are very easy to digest

1/2 cup farina cooked to make 2 cups {Semolina, Cream of Wheat} 80g
– bring 400ml of water to the boil in a large saucepan, sprinkle in the semolina stirring constantly. Cook for 5 to 6 minutes.
1 1/2 cups creamed cottage cheese 375g {there are lots of recipes for cottage cheese on the Internet if you cannot obtain it locally}
1 large egg hard cooked {preferably free range}
2 tablespoons Brewers yeast – I use Engevita, produced by Marigold - from health food shops.
3 tablespoons sugar
1 tablespoon veg oil
1 teaspoon potassium chloride – available from E-bay
1 teaspoon dicalcium phosphate – available from E-bay, more readily available in the US.
1 teaspoon calcium carbonate – available from E-bay

Cook semolina {according to directions on packet including any salt}. Cool. Add remaining ingredients to semolina and mix well. Yield 2 lbs approx. I gave this amount to my 9.5kg dog over two days.



**Add a balanced supplement which fulfils the canine MDR for all vitamins and trace minerals eg SA37** {or a more natural supplement such as The Missing Link.}


If you check the protein and fat levels, this is pretty close to ID diet - and much cheaper! I do freeze the cottage cheese - it changes the texture but it is fine for the dogs :) I had to make my own as I can't get hold of it locally.
 
Thanks for that recipe Nicki! My vet has asked that she come home on just a white rice & boiled chicken diet. She said if she does okay on that then after about a week I can try the recipe you provided. I'll use my best judgement and see how she does. She wants her on a bland diet for 2-3 weeks before I even TRY to return her to a normal food.

She is coming home in 1 1/2 hours. The vet lives in my neighborhood (3 blocks away) and is sending me with her personal cell phone number in case of an emergency. I guess that makes me feel a LOT more comfortable.

Part of me thinks she is depressed being in a strange place stuck in a cage :( I'm hoping once she gets home she will perk up more. They said she is stable, no vomiting and eating tiny bits of food. But she is just " really mellow". Part of that is her nature. She is very calm and if she is scared I'm sure that is not helping.

Once I have time I will try to reply to some of the other posts. Sorry super busy!

I don't live near Texas A & M. I WISH I did as that is where our neurologist is. Blitz had his cardio work up done there. They are 4 1/2 -5 hours away. I guess that is not too bad but when you are a full time mommy to a 2 year old & tons of critters it is VERY hard for me to get away for a day. If I can't find one locally I will take Holly with me whenever we get around to taking Blitz up there for his surgery. It keeps getting postponed.
(I have kind of been in the middle of several family disasters the last few weeks. My mom had to have emergency surgery and needed my help. She is finally better and back on her feet and now they want to do TWO more surgeries on her. I swear when it "rains it pours" around my house!)

Off to go grocery shopping for little miss Holly & then pick her up! She has been missed! My son is so excited to go get her! He may only be 2 but he knows all the animals by name and has been asking about Holly every day since she has been gone.
DSCN2338.jpg
 
So happy to hear that Holly is coming homecl*p I hope she is back to her normal self soon:hug:
Becky
 
Aw, what a sweet picture. Soooo very glad to see the good news that Holly is alright.
 
Holly is doing much better today :p She still seems a little slower then usual but she was up and following me around like the little shadow she is. :D Vet sent her home on antibiotics just to be safe since we never got a 100% clear diagnosis. Although the vet is calling it Pancreatitis. She has been nibbling little meals (although she is not her normal self with eating :confused:) Been feeding her the chicken and rice... She seems to think the rice is :grnyuk:!!! (I even cooked it in chicken broth!) But she's not complaining about the chicken. Nearly took my finger off for the chicken the 1st night she was home. I think someone is really trying to get the "good stuff" out of me :roll: LOL My vet wanted to to feed her small portions and she is definitely only wanting small amounts at a time. She refused breakfast all together but ate lunch. She finally pooed so I'm assuming no blockage.

My vet wants her on Enalapril for her heart once daily. She thinks it is very important since her "murmur" seemed to increase in the last 6 months and since her heart is so large. I know pat said Cavaliers naturally have larger hearts... My vet said to at least keep her on it until we can see a Cardio, that it can't hurt anything.

Any opinions?
 
Reptigirl said:
My vet wants her on Enalapril for her heart once daily. She thinks it is very important since her "murmur" seemed to increase in the last 6 months and since her heart is so large. I know pat said Cavaliers naturally have larger hearts... My vet said to at least keep her on it until we can see a Cardio, that it can't hurt anything.

Any opinions?
Click to expand...

Yes - very strong opinion - don't start a dog without CHF on enalapril unless the dog has had a complete evaluation by a cardiologist.

You should run FULL blood chemistry and urinalysis before you start enalapril and then again about 10 days after you start. Get copies of reports, don't just take the word of the vet. No drug is totally benign, and enalapril certainly falls in that category. I would not consider starting enalapril until CHF is imminent - that means significant heart enlargement (with exact chamber measurements from echocardiogram) and a severe valve regurgitation.

And, I did not say that Cavaliers naturally have larger hearts, I said that Cavaliers have a different looking cardiac profile on radiographs from many other breeds and that vets not familiar with the breed can be misled to think that there is cardiac enlargement when there is not. The two statements are not equivalent.

Here is my quote:

"Is your vet very familiar with Cavaliers and has she/he looked at many Cavalier chest radiographs? FWIW, Cavalier cardiac profiles are a little different and many vets unfamiliar with the breed will think that there is heart enlargement when the heart is normal sized."

Pat
 
Awww, she's home! The chicken and rice diet is perfect. If you have a food processor, you might want to grind up the rice and chicken, with a touch of broth (fat free) over it. She might like it better.I was eventually able to have Nash in our living areas while cooking, but I waited a long time from when he had been triggered by smell. I remember seeing several home cooked diets, and have a couple bookmarked on my desktop, but it has recently crashed so I can't pull them off. The Hills product served it's purpose, and didn't have any of the ingredient Hills is notorious for (corn). I was always able to keep a couple cans on hand incase he had an attack and I didn't have ingredients for home cooking (Nash was diabetic, and needed to eat, so if we could catch the issue early, we could generally keep him eating and avoid the pancreatitis). Glad she is doing so well.
 
So pleased she is home and eating a bit. If she won't eat rice, try some cooked white pasta, that is very bland too and they often take it better.

I would definitely follow Pat's advice re the enalapril - thank you Pat again for being here, your advice is invaluable and you have helped many, many people.


So sorry to hear about your Mum, do hope she will be able to avoid more surgery.
 
Wow, was away all last week in Donegal, with little net access, and am just catching up on all this; am so sorry you and Holly have been through the mill with this mystery illness. You have had some great advice and also the information on pancreatitis is very interesting and no doubt will prove helpful to others in future too. Hope she continues to do well.
 
typo on the tag - enalapril not elanapril

I'm not sure how the tags work - I presume this is for searching, but there is a typo that should be fixed.

I have trouble searching on this forum so I'll see if I can find instructions. I'd like to repost the link to the ACVIM consensus paper on acquired valvular disease. This has a great deal of information about when to start meds, etc.

Pat
 
Thanks, Karlin!

So, Shannon, the question is whether Holly is at stage B1 or B2. At stage B1, none of the panel recommends starting any meds. At stage B2, the panel has mixed opinion, but the majority probably still will not start drugs. I'm not at all convinced that your vet can differentiate between stage B1 and stage B2, so in this case, I'd err on the side of caution and not start meds until you can get a cardiology consult. Where in Texas are you? Another option is a consult with a board certified internist - an internist could also do a workup, diagnosis and treatment plan.

Pat
 
Pat said:
And, I did not say that Cavaliers naturally have larger hearts, I said that Cavaliers have a different looking cardiac profile on radiographs from many other breeds and that vets not familiar with the breed can be misled to think that there is cardiac enlargement when there is not. The two statements are not equivalent.

Pat
Click to expand...

Sorry Pat, I misunderstood. Have been reading and processing information at record speed the last few days! My vet is not familiar with cavaliers so perhaps (we can hope) her heart is not as enlarged as my vet thinks it is. :xfngr:

My vet has listened to Holly's heart many times and it was only the time before last that she noticed a "click" and now a "murmur". Personally I understand that she is not a cardiologist and was skeptical of the medication. I questioned her on it but she said that it really doesn't "hurt" anything. That it is much better she take it sooner then too late. As of right now I don't feel the medication is needed for her at this time. That is why I was asking for opinions.

I plan to get her checked out by a cardio as soon as insurance sends payment for this claim. Insurance is great and all but you have to have the cash in advance to pay the vets for there services upfront!

BTW: Holly is back to her normal self! Happy as can be! She is also eating the chicken and rice a LOT better now. Does anyone know if I can offer her small amounts of scrambled or hard boiled eggs? My vet said cooked peas or carrots are okay once she is keeping food down for a few days.

Holly1.jpg
 
On way to er.... Holly collapsed, seizure..gums white....still bresthing not responding...please pray
 
I am sitting here praying, and praying hard right now. Really hard.

Oh Holly :( I will keep praying. I am so sorry.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top