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Thread: This is what happens when good breeders talk about health.

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by anniemac View Post
    What I meant to say, the more tests would make it hard to find a cavalier perfectly "clear". Some may say ask breeders for BAER certificates. Great if a breeder did this test but would I rule a breeder out from buying a puppy without this but followed other protocols and tests? No.
    Do you know what it means to flunk the BAER test?
    Rod Russell

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    Quote Originally Posted by RodRussell View Post
    Do you know what it means to flunk the BAER test?
    Yikes, no. I am mentioning that because I saw very few on the ofa database. I did not say I would accept one that flunked.

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    Anne Proud mother of Elton 5 and Angel Ella

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    Quote Originally Posted by RodRussell View Post
    Do you know what it means to flunk the BAER test?
    I give up. It's hard enough finding a breeder who has two parents scanned, followed MVD protocol etc. however, maybe those that do have BAER tests. I'm not telling others to disregard it, just my personal feelings. Doesn't mean I would not ask. Anyway, the whole point of the article is a breeder who did more than recommending health testing. I don't know that BAER testing or DM is recommended but thank goodness there are some that do.
    Anne Proud mother of Elton 5 and Angel Ella

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    Quote Originally Posted by anniemac View Post
    ... I did not say I would accept one that flunked.
    What about getting a puppy from a breeding pair that were not BAER tested, and then the puppy goes deaf by age 3 years? I know it's not as bad as SM, but progressive hearing loss is another big problem in this breed.

    Ignore the MVD breeding protocol, and your puppy develops early-onset MVD and dies young. Ignore the CERF tests, and your puppy becomes blind. Ignore the hips exam, and you pay for hip surgery (probably double hip surgery). Ignore the patellar luxation exam and you pay for knee surgery.

    After all, it is just a matter of paying money to vets, right? It's not like the dog would suffer or anything, right?
    Rod Russell

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    Quote Originally Posted by anniemac View Post
    ... Anyway, the whole point of the article is a breeder who did more than recommending health testing. ...
    I don't even know what that article is anymore. But if the breeder did more than a worthless list of recommended testing, that is not doing much. Either the breeder follows the important breeding protocols, or the breeding is cheating future generations of her dogs.
    Rod Russell

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    Quote Originally Posted by RodRussell View Post
    What about getting a puppy from a breeding pair that were not BAER tested, and then the puppy goes deaf by age 3 years? I know it's not as bad as SM, but progressive hearing loss is another big problem in this breed.

    Ignore the MVD breeding protocol, and your puppy develops early-onset MVD and dies young. Ignore the CERF tests, and your puppy becomes blind. Ignore the hips exam, and you pay for hip surgery (probably double hip surgery). Ignore the patellar luxation exam and you pay for knee surgery.

    After all, it is just a matter of paying money to vets, right? It's not like the dog would suffer or anything, right?
    Goodness rod! I honestly need to read more about baer testing. You forgot the ef de/cc. Then factor in COI which some people say to ask.

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    Anne Proud mother of Elton 5 and Angel Ella

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    Rod,

    Since we can both agree that breeders have known about MVD and had information since 1998 on following the "recommended" protocol but yet you would argue that some still don't follow it, do you really think it would be easy to find a breeder that does all the testing you mentioned?
    Anne Proud mother of Elton 5 and Angel Ella

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    Quote Originally Posted by anniemac View Post
    Rod,

    Since we can both agree that breeders have known about MVD and had information since 1998 on following the "recommended" protocol but yet you would argue that some still don't follow it, do you really think it would be easy to find a breeder that does all the testing you mentioned?
    No, of course it is not easy. Most all cavalier breeders in the US don't follow the MVD breeding protocol. So that one alone disqualifies the vast majority.
    Rod Russell

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    Quote Originally Posted by RodRussell View Post
    No, of course it is not easy. Most all cavalier breeders in the US don't follow the MVD breeding protocol. So that one alone disqualifies the vast majority.
    This absolutely true, a fair number of breeders will follow the crippled and ineffective method suggested by ACKSC, but precious few care enough to follow the true MVD protocol.

    It is worth mentioning that there is no price difference between the version suggested by ACKSC, and true protocol. The big factor is delaying breeding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soushiruiuma View Post

    It is worth mentioning that there is no price difference between the version suggested by ACKSC, and true protocol. The big factor is delaying breeding.
    What do you mean by no price difference? In puppies?

    I just don't understand why one has to buy a puppy buying book. I guess they have breeder referrals but do you buy guide before contact? I know want to buy it because I'm curious.

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    Anne Proud mother of Elton 5 and Angel Ella

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