20th August 2013, 11:56 PM
Pain when picking up Sadie
Quite concerned, Sadie has done this a couple of times recently, last night when going upstairs she paused, when i helped her up gently with my foot, she crys out,i tried to pick her up and yelps no matter how cautious i am with her, she is eating and drinking, not really herself though, and always loves her walks, but wants to come home, she just won,t tolerate me picking her up,she sleeps upstairs with me, i don,t know if she will get up there, she is 8 years old,but very active for a cavalier, she runs very fast, i,ve had her 15months now, as a rescue, but since i,ve had her shes done this 4 or five times, but following day shes usually better.But wondering if this could be anything to do with her spine?.See how she goes tomorrow. Karen,Ruby and Sadie xxx
21st August 2013, 05:15 AM
I'm sorry Sadie is having problems. My Sydney had a herniated disc in his neck and arthritis down his spine. There were days that it was painful and difficult for him to walk. I had pain medicine for him when it was bad. I don't remember if Sadie had any medical problems when you rescued her, but maybe your vet could do an x-ray and possibly give you some pain medicine and see if that helps. Otherwise, I would suggest a visit to a neuro for an MRI.
Last edited by Sydneys Mom; 21st August 2013 at 06:34 AM.
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21st August 2013, 11:11 AM
Sorry to hear this Karen, it definitely Needs investigating. There are lots of possibilities before we all jump to the diagnosis of CM/SM (syringomyelia), but please also have a look at http://sm.cavaliertalk.com and http://www.cavaliermatters.org, to familiarize yourself with the symptoms.
Pain on being picked up and shoulder pain have been first indicators to me on several dogs unfortunately. However it may even just be a soft tissue injury.
Get the vet to check her over, and take a note of anything else you have noticed too.
Even if it does turn out to be CM/SM, many dogs are successfully managed for years, especially if they are only showing symptoms at an older age.
21st August 2013, 12:43 PM
Agree with the above. Definitely this is a trip to the vet matter -- to start eliminating the possibilities and hopefully find the problem. This would be typical behaviour for several things -- hence the need to carefully explore the most likely and easiests to diagnose issues first. Yur vet will likely wish to do an xray s a starting point. When my SM-free Lucy acted like this it was disk disease and once allowed to resiolve she never had any issues again. I would block access to the stairs with a baby gate and do not let her jump onto furniture -- an xpen can be very useful for managing in this way, Lift her carefully up and down. A vet is likely to prescribe painkillers and crate rest for a couple of weeks to see ho she does. The vet will likely also check hip and knee joints too. But that level of all over pain would seem to indicate the spine -- either disk disease that needs management or potential CM/SM. In a dog that age and depending on heart they may wish to simply try meds for disk disease and then if that doesn't work, start with Clare's CM/SM treatment algorithm.
But you will def need to start carrying her upstairs and placing her in her crate or on the bed or wherever she sleeps -- would not allow her to even try stairs any longer on her own until you can figure out what is going on, treat her and get the OK from the vet. If it's disk disease doing stairs may make it worse.
Lucy was banned from stairs, jumping onto furniture, walks etc. until she had meds and crate rest for about two weeks when she had disk disease and then had no problem with any of the above after that. I do advise pet stairs too. Hyperdrug.co.uk (pet supplies and meds) have nice little stairs as do many other places. I have about three sets of steps in my house as two cannot any longer jump onto furniture or the window seat.
In memory: Lucy
Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com
21st August 2013, 10:30 PM
Thank you all for your advice,will arrange a vet visit very soon,away for a couple of days to see daughter, have a good friend looking after my girlies,i tucked her up last night downstairs, she seemed a little perkier this morning, i even picked her up and put her in the car, extremely carefully, and walked her by the river casually for 30 minutes, took her back to the car, lifted her in and out very carefully,not too bad, she allows me to rub and touch her neck quite vigourisly, she likes this. I,ve just sat down with lap top thinking she,s recovering, and she,s looking at me to get up on the sofa,she craves a lot of attention being a rescue, i,ve gone to lift her gently, and she,s screamed out again, oh god back n
21st August 2013, 10:53 PM
Very sorry posted in era, as i was saying,oh god, back to square one, feeling so bad now, the thing is with sadie, she has a lot of issues being a rescue/ex breeder, she associates pain with humans, she hiding away in hallway,shes looking so scared,i feel really bad, do you think i have walked her too long, shall i get my friend to just let her walk for a few minutes to relieve herself, until i get back. In my opinion these episodes have always happened on exertion, ie stairs jumping on sofa, usually she asks me to get on the sofa, her funny talk, approvel, and i have always picked her up, the last week or two i have been patting the sofa, encouraging her to jump up with out asking, i feel i,ve not allowed her to recover long enough, as she seemed a little better this morning. Will get back to you once Sadie has visited vet.Thank you all for letting me ramble on my concerns. Karen,Ruby and Sadie x
21st August 2013, 11:01 PM
Until you know what's going on, I'd try and keep her fairly quiet - avoid jumping, long walks etc try to get her in to the vets as soon as possible.
21st August 2013, 11:11 PM
Thank you for you support Nicki, as soon as i can x
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2nd September 2013, 11:03 PM
Update with Sadie, I took sadie, to her vet this evening, after showing a lot of pain when picking her up, she,s been very much up and down, since i last came on the forum, after a couple of days resting she would seem a lot better, but still not particulary that active, today not good, panting very hard, which i know with mine is when they are in pain, tried to put in the car, but was crying out, arrived at vets, they told me to leave her in car, and when the vet was free, they would come out, and help, she was examined thoroughly, she pointed out she had luxating patella, but was not concerned at this time, as sadie was not in pain, she figures something is not right, as her right leg does not spring back when pulled back, anyway booked in for x-ray under GA Monday. Well this is a continuation from friday, as forum was off line, today she had X-ray but going for results tuesday morning, as i was working, will let you know what transpires, and the findings, but praying she does,nt need a hip replacement, as this seems to be where they think the problem maybe, and my insurance does,nt cover prostesis/implants, and we all know how exspensive they are, at the moment she is comfortable, shes on Metacam and 25ml of Tramadol, so lets hope its something that can be treated with alternative medicine, will keep you updated. Karen Ruby and Sadie
3rd September 2013, 11:25 AM
Hi Karen, glad you got her to the vet and are beginning some explorations. I was going to agree with Nicki, generally with a dog showing any pain it is a good idea not to walk them at all or only very little for toiletting etc.
I don't think any form of alternative medicine will deal with this kind of pain issue, whether caused by the leg or back -- these are as you have said, fairly serious issues that do often need surgical repair to give any quality of life. For a dog in a lot of pain it would be a better option to lose the leg entirely than try and struggle on with the pain and using lots of painkillers, if a repair surgery couldn't be done or afforded.
But we can easily worry too much about things that never have to happen -- it is much better to consider the possible options but try not to worry too much until you really know exactly what you are dealing with and what the options are. Most vets if they have a good relationship with an owner, will work out a payment schedule over time that can make even a costly procedure more affordable.
These kinds of challenges are so difficult but unfortunately they are not uncommon in this breed and probably is going to make owning a cavalier a greater commitment for people in future -- so many need patella surgery, many need costly diagnosis and care for CM/SM, almost all will eventually be on heart meds for MVD. It is deeply frustrating and places kind and loving owners, who adore their dogs, in difficult situations too many times. It's certainly why I never homed a rescue cavalier over the years without encouraging owners to do as you have done and take out insurance but then as rescues are older dogs most of the time, often there are these exclusions.
Fingers and paws crossed this doesn't turn out to be a costly or long term problem.
Many people do not actually realise how widespread hip dysplasia is in this small breed, associating it with larger breeds. When I looked up the hip score averages for breeds, cavaliers are actually at far greater risk, with poorer average hip scores, than many giant breeds including Pyrenean Mountain Dogs! Some great breeders like Laura Lang in the US have long been outspoken (and snarled at for being so, by other breeders) about how hips ARE a cavalier issue & should be checked before breeding -- she hip scores all her breeding dogs. It can be very, very painful for the dog, and I know you will prioritise the right care approach for little Sadie and we will all be thinking of you and of her. Let us know what the vet says as further tests are done, hoping it will be easy to manage with crate rest and painkillers.
In memory: Lucy
Cavalier SM Infosite:www.smcavaliers.com